Nitrous to Turbo...Out with the old and in with the new...

I ordered all of the raw hot side tubing, cold side alum tubing, t-bolt clamps, silicone connectors, etc etc etc that will be needed for this project. Some of the special ordered stuff will not be making it to me for another 1.5 weeks so it looks like I should be starting this in two weeks. Just keeping you guys updated. I do not foresee the fabrication time to be significantly long on this project. What I do foresee happening, as with all custom projects, is the possibility of reorder for different parts due to unforeseen circumstances. It sometimes does happen.

A piece of advice from a performance shop owner to you modding enthusiasts...plan plan plan....and then make sure you plan to have at least a few minor setbacks when doing a custom project. I usually start planning a project one year out from estimated starting date if I have the luxury to do so. This may seem like a long time out for most people but it will ensure that very few, if any, things are left not addressed. I have found it saves allot of rework and thus also saves money too.
 
Keep us updated... I'd be pretty damn interested in swaping out an 8.8 w/ 3.73's!!! (why are you guys wanting to run a trac-loc? Eaton makes a limited slip that spanks the hell out of the trac-loc. Auburn makes a limited slip with electric lock that is also stellar. Are we talking cost or what?)
 
NateRW21 said:
Keep us updated... I'd be pretty damn interested in swaping out an 8.8 w/ 3.73's!!! (why are you guys wanting to run a trac-loc? Eaton makes a limited slip that spanks the hell out of the trac-loc. Auburn makes a limited slip with electric lock that is also stellar. Are we talking cost or what?)
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More like overkill. The Ford Traction Lock will work just fine at these power levels. Cost is not really big factor but why spend double when you really don't need too.

Used 8.8 unit, gears, Traction Lock, rebuild kit, labor to build if you can't or don't have the equip, custom drive shaft...thats just for the Gen1. Gen2s will have more cost like axles and maybe more. It not a cheap swap but will be worth it.
 
02LSE96LSC91SE84TC said:
More like overkill. The Ford Traction Lock will work just fine at these power levels. Cost is not really big factor but why spend double when you really don't need too.

Used 8.8 unit, gears, Traction Lock, rebuild kit, labor to build if you can't or don't have the equip, custom drive shaft...thats just for the Gen1. Gen2s will have more cost like axles and maybe more. It not a cheap swap but will be worth it.
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Okay... gotcha. I've personally never been a big fan of the trac-loc myself, replaced the factory trac-loc in my F-150 with an eaton e-locker and put a LS in the front. That aside, why will the gen2 need new axles?!? They didn't move up in spline count did they? And if so, I think I have a 31 spline trac-loc sitting in my attic from my truck with 3.73 gears that would drop into an IRS carrier. Or did dimensions change?
 
NateRW21 said:
Okay... gotcha. I've personally never been a big fan of the trac-loc myself, replaced the factory trac-loc in my F-150 with an eaton e-locker and put a LS in the front. That aside, why will the gen2 need new axles?!?
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From a quick glance it has a different diff width and different position/mounting. I have a Gen1 and a MarkVIII and did alot of the first measuring finding alot of similarities. ILLS now has a extra of each (Gen1 LS diff and MarkVIII diff) at his house and confirmed alot of things. We new the Gen2s were different from some reading (namely width) some posts on it but never knew the exact differences. ILLS has now gone under his 05 to check it out and it is different. Nothing we won't tackle, just for now know it will be complex than the Gen1 swap.

I designed a pinion brace to solve the front mounting of the 8.8 in the Gen1.

My car will be done first and then his will be tackled.
 
02LSE96LSC91SE84TC said:
From a quick glance it has a different diff width and different position/mounting. I have a Gen1 and a MarkVIII and did alot of the first measuring finding alot of similarities. ILLS now has a extra of each (Gen1 LS diff and MarkVIII diff) at his house and confirmed alot of things. We new the Gen2s were different from some reading (namely width) some posts on it but never knew the exact differences. ILLS has now gone under his 05 to check it out and it is different. Nothing we won't tackle, just for now know it will be complex than the Gen1 swap.

I designed a pinion brace to solve the front mounting of the 8.8 in the Gen1.

My car will be done first and then his will be tackled.
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So is his a gen2? Or will ya'll need a gen to to experment on?
 
The Gen2 LS will require not only custom mounting for the front of the 8.8 case but also custom mounting for the rear of it too due to the offset in the mounting location of the stock diff. This slight relocation that needs to happen will mean that the stocker CV shafts cannot be reused even though they would fit into the case itself. I am looking at the possibility either seeing if Gen1 LS CV shafts will work or maybe even the Mark 8 stuff. The Mark stuff would need to be modified though as the speedo ref "gear" is on the inside near the diff instead of outside near the wheel like the LS has. Worst case scenario I will have custom CV shafts made. The Gen 1's will be allot more bolt-in for this swap.
 
nice work. im curious on how much would all this cost for the basic universal sts turbo with tuning and plumbing etc at around 5psi? if in my price range i will keep the ls instead of moving to the 300c.
 
whosmikebyrd said:
nice work. im curious on how much would all this cost for the basic universal sts turbo with tuning and plumbing etc at around 5psi? if in my price range i will keep the ls instead of moving to the 300c.
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PM sent.
 
whosmikebyrd said:
nice work. im curious on how much would all this cost for the basic universal sts turbo with tuning and plumbing etc at around 5psi? if in my price range i will keep the ls instead of moving to the 300c.
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yea i would like to know aswell i have a 04 so i may keep it for a while if you get it to work let me know how much it will hit my wallet. :rolleyes:
 
ILLS said:
The Gen2 LS will require not only custom mounting for the front of the 8.8 case but also custom mounting for the rear of it too due to the offset in the mounting location of the stock diff. This slight relocation that needs to happen will mean that the stocker CV shafts cannot be reused even though they would fit into the case itself. I am looking at the possibility either seeing if Gen1 LS CV shafts will work or maybe even the Mark 8 stuff. The Mark stuff would need to be modified though as the speedo ref "gear" is on the inside near the diff instead of outside near the wheel like the LS has. Worst case scenario I will have custom CV shafts made. The Gen 1's will be allot more bolt-in for this swap.
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doesnt the 8.8 diff fit inside the ls housing? and use the same 28 spline axles just different shims
 
chocolat1701 said:
yea i would like to know aswell i have a 04 so i may keep it for a while if you get it to work let me know how much it will hit my wallet. :rolleyes:
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A setup like this will not be cheap, but it will not be stupid expensive either. I am going all out with the best parts possible so mine will be somewhat expensive, even while getting dealer pricing on quite a few parts. There are ways that people could approach a system like this to get great power while keeping costs allot lower; and still remain safe and drivable. Some of the specific technical information regarding the build will be disclosed only to customers. Other info, like 1/4 mile ET, dyno graphs and overall general results will be posted of course.










XxbmxlsxX said:
doesnt the 8.8 diff fit inside the ls housing? and use the same 28 spline axles just different shims
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The different approach we are using will serve a few purposes. It will allow a person that does not know how to set their own gears up be able to purchase an already assembled 8.8 diff, carrier and all and just bolt it into their car without any hassle. Also, with 4 points of attachment to the vehicle instead of 3 like the stock LS's have it will be an overall much stronger piece too.

As for the 8.8" diff fitting into the LS carrier I have seen pictures of it but I have reservations of how the pinion gear wear pattern lined up with it due to point of contact vs the vertice of rotation being .4" different (on center) from one diff carrier to the other for proper wear and backlash. There is more to take into account with a swap of that nature than just shimming the pinion shallow or deep and shimming the diff itself to one side or the other; otherwise known as normal gear setup. By the looks of what I have sitting on my workbench and the way the pinion engages the ring gear I would say that it is not likely that it will work. I probably butchered the explanation of the reason why this will not work, but I hope you get the gist of it.
 
This sounds like a must have. '04 here as well, and I will be looking for the "not stupid expensive" bolt in...if its not stupid expensive...:D
 
ILLS said:
A piece of advice from a performance shop owner to you modding enthusiasts...plan plan plan....and then make sure you plan to have at least a few minor setbacks when doing a custom project. I usually start planning a project one year out from estimated starting date if I have the luxury to do so. This may seem like a long time out for most people but it will ensure that very few, if any, things are left not addressed. I have found it saves allot of rework and thus also saves money too.
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And it gives you time to save for it too;)
 
ILLS said:
"Stupid expensive" is a relative term. ;)
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YOu want to see "stupid Expensive" go to the Dinan site http://www.dinancars.com/ and check out the cost for a 3.45 LSD for the M5 $2499

Lightweight Flywheel $2199

Or the full S3 package (Supercharged to 621HP) which is $35,000 + depending on labor.. :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

S3 Engine

Intercooled Supercharger System

S3 Engine Management
High Flow-Ram Air Intake
High Flow Throttle Bodies and Tuned Velocity Stacks
4:2:1 Stainless Steel Headers
Free Flow Exhaust

Peak Horsepower: 621 @ 7000 rpm
Peak Torque: 502 lb/ft @ 4500 rpm

Top Speed (6th gear @ 7300 rpm with Dinan wheel and tire package):
3.15 Final Drive: 209 mph
3.45 Final Drive: 191 mph



Chassis and Suspension

Front and Rear Shock Tower Braces
Stage 3 Suspension System, Including:
Performance Springs
Koni Rebound Adjustable Shocks and Struts
(Dinan/JRZ Racing Type Shocks optional, at additional cost)
17mm Adjustable Rear Anti-Roll Bar
28mm Front Anti-Roll Bar
Front Camber Plates
Rear Subframe Reinforcement
Dinan Performance Brakes by Brembo
355 x 32mm Front / 345 x 28mm Rear Slotted Rotors
4 Piston-Cast Aluminum Calipers with Dinan-Spec Pads
Goodridge Stainless Steel Brake Lines

Lightweight Forged Performance Wheels
Front: 18 x 9” (17.5 lbs.); 275/35-18 Tires (Sold Separately)
Rear: 18 x 9.5” (18 lbs.); 285/35-18 Tires (Sold Separately)


Driveline

S3-M5 High Performance Clutch Package (including Flywheel, Disc/Pressure Plate and Slave Cylinder).
3.45 Limited Slip Differential


Accessories

Serial Numbered S3-M5 Factory Works Plaque
Dinan Deck Lid Badge
Dinan Signature Floor Mats


Warranty

12 Months/12,000 Miles (whichever occurs first).

For more information, please contact your Dinan performance specialist at 800-341-5480.
 
Kelleyo said:
YOu want to see "stupid Expensive"
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Oh my other vehicle has stupid expensive written all over it. There is more money into it aftermarket than what I bought it brand new for. The vehicle cost me just over $30k new. I have a little experience with "stupid expensive". ;) Gladly I can at least look at it as somewhat of an investment due to the nature of my business.


I think it is hilarious that those owners pay that much for that stuff. Poor MB and BMW owners take it up the rump so badly it isn't even funny. Good quality stuff, but huge huge markup as well.
 
Well I won't be spending that much. I am very happy with the performance of my car (for right now :D )
 
Kelleyo said:
(for right now :D )
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You don't know how many times I have seen those words spoken only to have that same person come to me 4 months later asking me to do a custom turbo system, nitrous, or supercharger for their car. Good luck staying stock. ;)
 
Has anyone checked the Jaguar S type R.
I belive that their diff has a different ratio with LSD.
Might be an alternative to the custom 8.8, why re-invent the wheel when there is one there allready.
 
gpptsi said:
Has anyone checked the Jaguar S type R.
I belive that their diff has a different ratio with LSD.
Might be an alternative to the custom 8.8, why re-invent the wheel when there is one there allready.
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S Type R diff is like a 2.73 ratio since it has 400HP to play with. But may be possible to change the ratio in that too?
 
+1

It has a real low gearing and I couldn't find anything stating it was a LSD. Also it perhaps would cost more to get that than swapping in the 8.8 if in fact it was a LSD. Plus if it was a LSD I would still be out on gearing up.
 
I haven't forgotten about ya.

Still waiting for a few more items to arrive next week. I may be able to work on the LS a little after that. I have to travel to Maine teach a class so I will be gone for a week a little later this month which will not lend well to working on the LS. It looks like the project will kick off more like late September versus "early" September like I had originally hoped. That is how the system works; always waiting on other establishments to do their job before you can do your own.
 
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