4.6 swap in ls????

ssls1787

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Well bad news folks figured out why my engine lost all it oil a couple of weeks ago. when i got underneath the car this past weekend i found a crack in the block going back towards the trans bell housing, and then another going straight up into the block. dont really know what happened to cause that, but no im at a crossroads. im gonna start doing some research on my own and possibly discuss things with some of the other guys on here, but my plan if i decide to keep the car is to figure out if i can fit a 4.6L in the Ls, but im not gonna be trying to fit the sohc in it, if im gonna do it im gonna do it right.

therefore if i find out that i can fit a 4.6L in the Ls then im gonna be dropping in a DOHC mach 1 engine. but like i said its gonna take some research to figure out if this is at all possible.
 
for the right amount of money anything is possible ;)

I'm thinking that you may run into issues with the width of the engine. Although I'd seriously like to see this done! :cool:
 
It has been done I think the car was also supercharged. The down side about it was that the people that built the car were Ford engineers and even they couldnt work out the bugs. Try doing a search on the 1 lap of america LS
 
My unerstanding was that the major hurtle was the electronics. No one has been able to get an engine controll system from a 4.6 to talk to the other controll systems in the car.
 
do a search on "engine swap", OLOA, ...etc many, many threads on this.
 
Would you be swapping out for a different tranny as well? Sounds like a WHOLE lot of work to me. I would think that changing out for the supercharged 4.0 from a Jag XJR would be easier, since it is very similar to the 3.9 that comes in the LS, and it makes 400 HP.
 
The thought has crossed my mind to do a project LS with a Carbed DOHC 5.4 and a t56. That would solve all the electronic problems. You just lose all the fluffy stuff that makes the car a Lincoln.
 
Would you be swapping out for a different tranny as well? Sounds like a WHOLE lot of work to me. I would think that changing out for the supercharged 4.0 from a Jag XJR would be easier, since it is very similar to the 3.9 that comes in the LS, and it makes 400 HP.
If by easier you mean equally impossible, then, well, even then it's not easier. The Jag's powertrain control systems are just as different from the LS's as are those used on the Mod Motors.

The killer isn't the physical size of the 4.6; it's the electronics. Hell's bells, we currently can't even bridge the 1st->2nd Gen LS electronics gap, let alone the LS -> Mod Motor or LS -> S-Type gap.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but when Lincoln engineers (the guys who designed the blasted car), working with factory backing, can't make everything work, that does not bode well for "mere mortals" like us.
 
BTW, if you think you can git 'er done, by all means go for it. Just be aware that it's a long row to hoe, and you're going to be busting virgin sod on this one.
 
BTW, if you think you can git 'er done, by all means go for it. Just be aware that it's a long row to hoe, and you're going to be busting virgin sod on this one.

Oh, anything can be done given time and money, neither of which I have right now. I don't pretend to know all the in's and out's of swapping a motor out in a LS, especially with regards to the electronics. I merely knew that the 4.0 in the jag and the 3.9 in the LS were similar. Hell, my LS is a V6, so I am not really qualified to comment on anything regarding the V8. I'm not saying don't try and put a 4.6 in, it just seemed more logical to go with the jag motor, until you pointed out the problems entailed with it. The electronics differences didn't cross my mind to be honest.
 
and for the 1,000,000th time - the jag motor is not similar. only the block casting are the same....

not the heads, PCM, crank, rods, ..... nothing.... it would be a complete motor swap.
 
The thought has crossed my mind to do a project LS with a Carbed DOHC 5.4 and a t56. That would solve all the electronic problems. You just lose all the fluffy stuff that makes the car a Lincoln.

If by fluff you mean speedo, tach, gas gauge, radio, windows, a/c, power seats, door locks, etc. then you are correct.


The problem will never be the engine size. It will always getting the complex electronic systems in newer (post 1995) cars to work.
 
If by fluff you mean speedo, tach, gas gauge, radio, windows, a/c, power seats, door locks, etc. then you are correct.


The problem will never be the engine size. It will always getting the complex electronic systems in newer (post 1995) cars to work.


That is correct, you would have to take away all the non-stand alone electronics and make them stand alone. Which can be done, with a little time, patients and green stuff with presidents on it. All the things you mentioned can be converted to stand alone and retrofitted without too much difficutly except the AC.

If my buddy can cram a carbed 455 Olds big block w/turbo 400 into a 92 T-bird and make it work, anybody can put about any motor in any car and make it work. Having a carbed motor makes it easier. It does away with half of the birds nest.
 
That is correct, you would have to take away all the non-stand alone electronics and make them stand alone. Which can be done, with a little time, patients and green stuff with presidents on it. All the things you mentioned can be converted to stand alone and retrofitted without too much difficutly except the AC.

If my buddy can cram a carbed 455 Olds big block w/turbo 400 into a 92 T-bird and make it work, anybody can put about any motor in any car and make it work. Having a carbed motor makes it easier. It does away with half of the birds nest.

Your buddy's '92 Bird is pre-OBDII. That alone makes it an apples to oranges comparison. Of course, with enough Andrew Jackson's anything is possible!
 
Your buddy's '92 Bird is pre-OBDII. That alone makes it an apples to oranges comparison. Of course, with enough Andrew Jackson's anything is possible!
I think we've gone way past Andy J here. We're talking Ben Franklin, and probably Grover Cleveland, if he weren't out of print. And probably Johnnie and his friends, Blackie and Red, too... :D
 
You could always just turn the car into a mustang... if you want to swap a mod motor, I would think easiest thing to do would be to get a doner car and swap in everything; wiring harness, gauge cluster, you name it... if it has wires coming from it... swap it. That would solve your problems with the different systems mateing together; it woud essentially be mustang drive train and electronics/wiring pretending it's an LS. But at that point... why not just drive a mustang?!?
 
that is the plan im contemplating. im thinking of finding a junked out cobra or a mach 1 and stealing everything off of there and swapping it into the ls. it should be possible with a little bit of modification. but i never thought of putting the sc 4.0l jag engine in there. that may be a better idea and cheaper
 
You could always just turn the car into a mustang... if you want to swap a mod motor, I would think easiest thing to do would be to get a doner car and swap in everything; wiring harness, gauge cluster, you name it... if it has wires coming from it... swap it. That would solve your problems with the different systems mateing together; it woud essentially be mustang drive train and electronics/wiring pretending it's an LS. But at that point... why not just drive a mustang?!?

I believe it's more complicated than that. EVERY system in the LS is integrated. It would be much less expensive to just buy a Mustang.......
 
From the way I understand it, it would require adding the LS sensors and controllers onto the swap motor to make it work or be able to dig deep enough into the computer to recalibrate the expectation tables for the different sensor to allow the computer to interpret different data coming from say the different cam sensors used between the Gen I and Gen II LS's and thier Jaguar counterparts.
From a V6 standpoint it is getting the 3.5L sensors to talk to the 3.0L computer in a way that is intellegiable, or putting the 3.0L sensors on the 3.5L. Given enough creativity it could potentially be done. My personnel parallel is I'm taking an OBDII system off of a FWD GM supercharged V6 and trying to get it to run a classic Grand National motor. GM is a bit more modular in thier approach to controllers but I will have to X out the tranny fault codes since I'll have a hydromechanical transmission rather than an electrohydromechanical one like the original application had.
 
but i never thought of putting the sc 4.0l jag engine in there. that may be a better idea and cheaper
I can't see how that could possibly be cheaper. Mod motors (with the exception of the 5.0 Cammer) don't cost anywhere near as much as the AJV8s, and you're going to have to swap out just as much of the electronics. It must be less expensive to used a 4.6L (SOHC or DOHC) just because the mill and all the other needed parts are less expensive.

Yeah, it's probably going to be easier to bolt the Jag driveline into the LS, but that's by far the easiest part of the project...
 
Pearls of wisdom from a performance shop and fellow Lincoln LS owner.


Step1: Take stocker Lincoln LS piston and connecting rod to a place like Oliver racing and have them prototype a set of billet connecting rods. Take the piston to a place like Diamond, or CP or so on and have them make custom pistons for you. Yes it will be expensive but still cheaper (and stronger) than any options mentioned above.

Step2: Do not worry about the stocker crank as it takes allot of power (or detonation) to break a crank, even a cast one.

Step3: Have a knowledgeable head porter port your heads and work on the combustion chamber to open it up a little bit. When done correctly this will drop compression slightly (more boost friendly) which will lead to more safety and also free up some power through better flow. CR will still be high, but not 10.55:1 or 10.75:1 high! CR will still be high enough to get vehicle off the line while not in boost yet and still hit a decent 60' time at the track.

Step4: Call up Level Ten and have them build your stocker 5R55N or 5R55S trannny (depending on which generation of LS) to hold 700+ horsepower. Not that you will make THAT much, but you will have a tranny capable of handling it.

Step5: Get an STS Universal Stage 1 Turbo kit with a T04E turbo if you want to make up to about 375-400 rwhp or the 60-1 turbo if you want to make up to 500rwhp. Retails for $1,995 + shipping. If you are a competent welder and are somewhat mechanically inclined then a remote turbo system is not hard to do. Mike Pietras did well but he messed up in a few areas, namely being the turbo turbine A/R sizing and the oiling system return line size and jetting. Also FULL SCT tuning is available to tune for this turbo system.

Step6: Swap in a Ford GT (supercar) fuel pump if you plan to go to 400rwhp and a KB BAP (Kenne Bell Boost a Pump) if you plan to hit 500rwhp or close. A qualified SCT tuner will have no problem extrapolating voltages from the Ford GT returnless fuel pump voltage table and plugging them into the LS tables to get it close right off the bat. After that the KAM (keep alive memory) will take care of the finetuning the voltages from there. I suggest doing a wiring upgrade between the new GT pump and the FPDM (REM for LS) so as to keep things from overloading. This will also increase the range in which your fuel pump will operate. I usually see a 10-15% drop in fuel pump duty cycle when upgrading wiring in a returnless car. This means an extra 10-15% range for the fuel pump to use before it is maxxed.

Step7: Swap to 03/04 Cobra 39 lb/hr injectors if planning to make 400rwhp or less. If planning to make 500rwhp then swap to Seimens Deka 55lb/hr injectors. You will need the injector adapter harnesses to go from your stocker EV6 connectors to the EV1 style electrical connectors found on the SD 55 lb squirters; the 39's will be drop in the for Gen2 LS. As said before the gen 1 LS's will have to swap to different fuel rails to eliminate the air entrainment feature found in the stocker rails.

Step8: Take your stocker LS slot-in MAFS and fabricate a 3" or 3.5" intake tube to house this in. The stocker LS meter will go up to 400rwhp in a 3" + sized housing and still retain good resolution across the range. If you plan to hit bigger power than 400rwhp then step up to the PMAS HPX slot-in meter.

Step9: Go to Ebay and find a 28"x8"3.5" FMIC and fit it into your front bumper area. It will be a VERY tight fit but you want the most IC that you can get to keep things cool. Some small things will have to be modified but it WILL work.

Step10: Have a good SCT tuner whip up a custom tune for your car. Make sure that they either street tune your car or at a mimimum put it on a loadable dyno (Mustang Dyno or Dynojet w/ Eddie current load cell) and tune yous LS. Unlike superchargers which makes boost more based upon rpm, a turbo makes its boost more directly dependant on load that is placed on the vehicle (engine having to tow weight of vehicle thus creating a load for the engine to pull). In a street tune or on a loaded dyno the engine will see that load and the turbo will spool in a manner similar to real street conditions. If load is correct then things such as VE, spark timing and such will be correct which is VERY critical.

Step11: Go with a custom rear LSD. Others have already started to tackle this but a real result may be coming soon.

I may have missed a small thing or two here or there but that pretty much covers it if you want to build a higher HP LS without having to swap to a different engine. You can also eliminate allot of those steps I stated above if you want to only run about 5-6 psi and make around 350rwhp. Allot of your stocker components will last to that power level as long as you treat your car with some respect. What I just stated above was more geared towards going more extreme than that due to the nature of this particular thread.

I own my own performance shop as well as a highly modded Lincoln LS and have allot of experience with the Lincoln LS and modding it for high performance as well as other vehicles. I am an SCT custom tuner/dealer as well as a dealer for many other places such as K&N, STS turbo, MAC, SLP, and so on and on. That is not meant as any sort of plug for my business, but it does serve to hopefully give what I say credibility as I am not a typical noob in here. :p I only prefer to lurk here but I have seen this question, and similar ones to it, asked WAY too many a times without any real definitive answers. Hopefully what I just posted will give some of you a more clearly defined direction in which to go.
 
right - all the same steps that have been discussed 100000 times.

Rocket - when you say 'highly modded' have you done more than N2O?
 
right - all the same steps that have been discussed 100000 times.


If ALL of those steps have been discussed here before then I sure didn't see it. I did see brief mention of one or two of those steps, but not all. And in nowhere near as much detail. Please point out the locations of where all of this information was talked about 100000 times before as I surely do not want to waste space by reposting... All I was trying to do was help some of these people out buddy. :cool:
 

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