Well I purchased an 01 cobra short block and I am going to replace the internals with forged components, now for the money the stock terminator set up looks like the way to go, I would just need a tune build for the setup correct? Oh and of course a hood to accommodate it?
Terminator style blower or centrifugal?
- Thread starter Bouncer88
- Start date
Short block? So no "C" heads?
Ill assume you ment long block and have the "C" heads. I would def go with a positive displacement supercharger. The Eatons out there are cheap! I know a dude that would trade one for a cat back for his Stang or a Pro Chamber.
The 01s internals will only hold 450 rwhp so an Eaton with the Afco heat exchanger and a 2.81 blower pully will have you right there with a conservative tune. Only downside is you now have the lesser Windsor block. With forged internals it can hold 1000 hp max so its not that bad. lol!
IDK if you have driven a Termi or Shelby but the positive displacement S/C makes the little engine feel like a big block! Full boost and TQ avaliable from 1900 RPM and just the most wonderful sound under load. Truley excellent sound.
Ill assume you ment long block and have the "C" heads. I would def go with a positive displacement supercharger. The Eatons out there are cheap! I know a dude that would trade one for a cat back for his Stang or a Pro Chamber.
The 01s internals will only hold 450 rwhp so an Eaton with the Afco heat exchanger and a 2.81 blower pully will have you right there with a conservative tune. Only downside is you now have the lesser Windsor block. With forged internals it can hold 1000 hp max so its not that bad. lol!
IDK if you have driven a Termi or Shelby but the positive displacement S/C makes the little engine feel like a big block! Full boost and TQ avaliable from 1900 RPM and just the most wonderful sound under load. Truley excellent sound.
Rich88LSC
Dedicated LVC Member
I agree with Laser. If you look around Eatons are pretty cheap and I love the whine.
94m5
Dmaup's Daddy
LOL,
You can buy a stock eaton for 200 bucks. But your looking at another buttload of cash for the supporting hardware to make it work. This is just a sample if what is needed. In addition ot this, you are STILL gonna need the C-heads, and engine built to handle it.
IF I were you, I would get the C-headed long block built, and call up Kenne-bell and order thier intercooled 99-01 cobra kit. You will be MUCH happier with the result.
You can buy a stock eaton for 200 bucks. But your looking at another buttload of cash for the supporting hardware to make it work. This is just a sample if what is needed. In addition ot this, you are STILL gonna need the C-heads, and engine built to handle it.
IF I were you, I would get the C-headed long block built, and call up Kenne-bell and order thier intercooled 99-01 cobra kit. You will be MUCH happier with the result.
ground_zero298
Dedicated LVC Member
Go with the KB setup, centr are best for 5.0's not the 4.6's
Better know what I am doing when it comes to what? Building an engine? Getting a tune? What?
I know how to build a motor, I know how to build different types of motors, tuning I don't know a damn thing about, so yes someone will be paid to do that.
94m5
Dmaup's Daddy
Yea, but you suck so...............Take that for what it's worth.
J/K Jeb.
I disagree completely with ground_zero68
If anything, the Vortech should be MORE efficient on the 32V mod motor, due to it's higher RPM breathing capacity.
94m5
Dmaup's Daddy
Better know how to cram 10 pounds of s h i t into a 5 pound box.
The Mark 8 does'nt lend itself to a friendly install, because of space constraints and the reasons listed here.................http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=50679
I wish you luck none the less.
Mike
Yea, but you suck so...............Take that for what it's worth.
J/K Jeb.
I disagree completely with ground_zero68
If anything, the Vortech should be MORE efficient on the 32V mod motor, due to it's higher RPM breathing capacity.
Yeah but the modular needs help down low where a positive displacement helps. Pushrod 302s need help on the upper end and is why a centri is better there.
94m5
Dmaup's Daddy
Kind of a realitive term there.
I have NO problem whatsoever with the VIII's dig off the line with 3.73s or 4.10s. The cenri system is goddamned wicked out on the highway from 3500 on up. Which is where my 94's engine is at 90% of the time it's running.
I don't see the big deal rebuilding one of these motors even though I do understand everything that was said in that thread. Last year before I went to boot, I rebuild a 3.2 liter BMW M3 motor as well as helped a buddy rebuild his 2.7 audi s4 motor. Granted they showed me some tricks, I think I can handle the task.
ground_zero298
Dedicated LVC Member
I'm just going off what diamond and lidio say, screws for the 4.6 32v and centr or turbo's for 5.0's. But hey, I'm sure you build 150k cars every week also. I'll make sure I tell them guys to pull their heads out of their asses and start using vortechs, wonder if they would get laughed out of autorama for showing up with a vortech. Besides if centr was so BA for a 4.6 lidio would not have strapped a KB on roadboss's car, and I'm not one to argue with anything thats 535 rwph.
topher5150
Dedicated LVC Member
here's something you could try, not the right year, or induction, but something you could try out LOL
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/PAXT...ptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/PAXT...ptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
Roadboss
Dedicated LVC Member
Bouncer you are going to need to modify or change out a lot of stuff with either S/C setup. Fuel supply,gears,drive shaft,exhaust,tranny,T/C,headers, all have to be considered, This isn't cheap. I can only tell you that I went with the KB setup as I wanted the torque at lower RPM where I drive the most. I would also make sure you have a system that provides for Inter cooling as well
Transmission can't be rebuilt or bought? I am not looking for 500 rwhp or even 420rwhp. High 300's would be perfect. Exhaust , drive shaft, T/C I know it gets expensive, hence why I am still driving the car as it is now while starting to do this build on the side.
Roadboss
Dedicated LVC Member
Before you go too far down the road with this $500 car you have, is the suspension been rebuilt lately? If it hasn't you are going to need to bring it up to snuff. Based on your desires of upper 300 HP range I would suggest you shop around for a used motor and setup from 96-98 Cobra. You are also going to need some assistance to get this all tuned as your car is on an OBD l system. A competent tuner is going to be your real salvation as he is the one who can get you to your goal for HP, so I would pick one out and develope a plan that he will also sign on for.
Speaking of front end, I already ordered the coil setup (for the whole car), I just replaced ball joints, sway bar end links , and the upper control arms. Brakes have been all done over less than 100 miles ago by the previous owner.
I know what I am getting into, the car is from SC , nothing underneath looks beat or damaged, I have inspected the rear, it is fine but I will be replacing it with 4.10's probably, the cv axles were replaced recently as well , at least from what I could tell.
94m5
Dmaup's Daddy
I don't give a God Damn what Lidio or Diamond have to say regarding what is better. I have DRIVEN both types in a Mark 8 platform, so I have personal expierence with them both.
The EATON charged 4.6 is a MONSTER off the line, I will NOT disagree with this statement. But for what it does off the line, it struggles higher up in the rev band. I'm sure a K/B or Whipple does better in that department, but I've never had the privledge to drive one.
The Vortech'd VIII was running 3.73s, stockish compression on forged internals. It WAS NOT as strong off the line, but out on the highway (which is where I run *MY* VIII), the Vortech would walk the Eaton pretty well. I have also heard stories from a certain member on this forum that went from a centri unit to a complete Terminator setup, that the Vortech provides better fuel economy as well. In addition, My 94, has a manual transmission conversion done to it, which will lend it's self more readily to a high RPM boosted car than a 4R70W.
Like I stated earlier in this thread,
Everything you or anyone else says is "the best", may not be for the next guy. I have'nt even gotten into the cost difference between the two yet.
Next.
driller
Dedicated LVC Member
For the money, on the Mark VIII platform I'd say you are better off with a centrifugal.
Check out what set up the quickest Mark VIII running
KB blowers are bad a$$ as I have one. All the low end torque isn't that great if you have IRS ,all it takes is one decent wheel hop and tow truck is on its way.
CobraStar_LS8
Dedicated LVC Member
a Vortech w/ bigger gears like 4.30s and a high stall converter???
Roadboss
Dedicated LVC Member
If you are comparing KB to Eaton on technical terms it is apples and oranges as the KB units are more efficient with twin screw technology. As with everything else performance carries a price tag. You just have to find what level of pain you can stand. LOL
Rear end/axle breakage just doesn't appear to be as big a problem with the MarkVlll IRS as it has been for other FOMOCO products, even with all forms of modded cars here, so I wouldn't get too worried about over torquing our IRS. Tire and wheels size will have more influence IMHO.
Rear end/axle breakage just doesn't appear to be as big a problem with the MarkVlll IRS as it has been for other FOMOCO products, even with all forms of modded cars here, so I wouldn't get too worried about over torquing our IRS. Tire and wheels size will have more influence IMHO.
Eaton blowers aren't that bad as everyone makes them to be, I know TS blowers are little bit more efficient but I wouldn't say apple to oranges.Most of the KB cars make more power then Eaton cars but look at the size of the KB sc and look at the size of Eaton sc .03-04 Cobra Eaton is 1.7 l let's compare it to 1.7 KB sc ,what's the most power you have seen out of 1.7 KB ,my cousins 03 Cobra just made 565 rwhp through Eaton sc [bone stock engine ,valve covers never been of the car]
That's pretty simple that 500 hp manual car with s...t load of low end torque is going brake axles quicker then 300 hp auto car with no low end torque, auto works very well with IRS.I haven't seen a single Mark VIII with PD blower running down the track but I've seen pretty much stock Super coupes braking axles with 250 hp.You can make 1000 hp and you will never brake axles if you won't run the car.
as 94m5 said....its all about you and what YOU want to do. I did alot of research before my build as well. On other sites as well as this one..I also work in a body shop and i talk with all the parts guys and people that they put me in touch with. I talked to guys with pd blowers in their marks that said if they did it again they would go back to centri. It was said that they were more fun, got better gas mileage, and were a whole lot easier to install and if your keeping b heads your able to inter cool them. I chose a kb after all that cause i like being different thats why i kept my b heads and why i drive a mark viii. I wanted big torque for street driving and i wanted the bad a$$ look of the twin screw in my engine compartment. Everyone will tell you that the mark motor and a cobra are the same. Thats fine the blocks are pretty close but they are not exactly the same. You will have to fab brackets, linkage, custom tune, cut crap for clearance, cuss, swear, sweat, bleed and then hopefully have something that works when your done. I got in over my head and ended up sending my car to a shop..its been 15 months and i now have a car that starts and runs but still isn't finished. It takes a lot of know how and ingenuity to get a pd blower on a mark, but it can be done. If you have the time and patience or a big check book and thats what you want get it done. The problem i ran into was NO-ONE had done it or wasn't helpful from kenne bell on down. As far as i know I'm the only mark with a 2.2 on it. I've never installed a centri but i know there are more people out there who have. I'm sure its not a simple job, but i would have to believe it would be much easier, just from fitment issues. Not trying to take anything from centri guys out there.