Supercharged Ls V8

[Frogman]

That looks suspiciously like the blower and plumbing from a Thunderbird SC... I like.
sweet!

It is. It's an Eaton M90.

 

[97stscaddy]

My dream is to one day open the hood of my car (whichever car that happens to be at the time) and see a sight like that. Great job, that looks fan-friggin- tastic! I dont have the patience to read through 23 pages of post, so I havent read everything that had to be done to get the finished product yet. But it looks awesome either way. Kudos to you for taking the time, money, and headaches to make that happen. :gr_hail:

 

[Quik LS]

Thanks guys.

I was able to get three good runs in this week - and resulting in three new tune files back from Torrie. The latest one is in the car - but it's been raining here for the past two days - so I still have more work.

The car is feeling better with each new tune as Torrie gets closer. We've been stumbling through working with SCT and Torrie on the missing PIDs for MAF Counts which seem to go missing every other tune....

Got my LiveWire working - and even wired my LC1 Wideband O2 into it... pretty neat. It cannot do the pass-through datalogging to LiveLink yet - so I still have to keep my XCal2 for that (for now).

 

[PGA2B]

Rock On Dude!!

 

[Rhep]

You even changed the '8' to a '9' nice touch!

I have an extra Eaton from a SC laying around, too bad I don't have that fab skill.

 

[Kelleyo]

Here's to ya Lou!

http://jalopnik.com/cars/novelties/worlds-smallest-supercharged-v8-engine-++-now-with-details-251109.php

 

[donmega]

I have seen some HORRIBLE nitrous explosions with wet kits...blows the manifold clear off the car. That's what can happen with puddling, etc. It's rare...but I've seen it. It's even rarer with a dry kit...and with the availability to tune for it with the SCT now, it makes no sense to add the extra expense and work involved to go wet. However, you need to make sure you have the fuel capablities and injector size to keep from going lean. With a small shot, you're probably ok...but the only way to know for sure is to toss it on a dyno and have the a/f ratio checked and make sure your MAF sensor isn't maxing out. Just MHO......

Just jumped in this thread, got a newsletter and am really interested in it. Anywho had to stop and comment on this comment real quick.

I slightly disagreee and thats only because its the nos (system not the brand name) manufacturers mistake of making all these damn wet kits like dry kits with single fogger nozzles and such. If your going to go wet do yourself a favor and plump the foggers into the intake , 1 for each cylindar.
If thats too much then I guess go dry \.

What Im saying is I have seen camaros with a single WET fogger pointing into the intake and Im thinking "are you f#cking serious??" "isnt that like gauranteed fuel puddling" lmao

I mean like a good 3" out from the throttle body and yeah I would setup a dry system like that but a wet system like that ??? You got to have brain damage or just dont know enough about nitrous to make an educated decision.

Just thought Id throw that in there before you get people regergatating your information about wet systems then we have 50+ people with blown motors from dry systems running lean.
Each have their own purpose and I will never run a dry system because I havent seen one with my own eyes ran sucessfully yet without serious engine damage from lack of fuel.

I can give you the number of a kid that had a nice rx7 blown up in 2 days of having a zex nitrous system on it, 100% by the book install with the smallest jets. Smashed 2 apex seals right into the rotors, couldnt even get them out. Rotors were garbage after that.

Heres how to do it proper
http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forum...t-port-nitrous-system-on-a-vic-jr-vt1702.html

And an alternative to the multi fogger setup
http://www.holley.com/02119NOS.asp

and of course how NOT to install a wet system even if the kit says so
http://www.musclemustangfastfords.c...ford_mustang_project_car_part_7/photo_05.html

ZEX SUCKS PERIOD
Build it yourself the right way

 

[Slow91z]

Just jumped in this thread, got a newsletter and am really interested in it. Anywho had to stop and comment on this comment real quick.

I slightly disagreee and thats only because its the nos (system not the brand name) manufacturers mistake of making all these damn wet kits like dry kits with single fogger nozzles and such. If your going to go wet do yourself a favor and plump the foggers into the intake , 1 for each cylindar.
If thats too much then I guess go dry \.

What Im saying is I have seen camaros with a single WET fogger pointing into the intake and Im thinking "are you f#cking serious??" "isnt that like gauranteed fuel puddling" lmao

I mean like a good 3" out from the throttle body and yeah I would setup a dry system like that but a wet system like that ??? You got to have brain damage or just dont know enough about nitrous to make an educated decision.

Just thought Id throw that in there before you get people regergatating your information about wet systems then we have 50+ people with blown motors from dry systems running lean.
Each have their own purpose and I will never run a dry system because I havent seen one with my own eyes ran sucessfully yet without serious engine damage from lack of fuel.

I can give you the number of a kid that had a nice rx7 blown up in 2 days of having a zex nitrous system on it, 100% by the book install with the smallest jets. Smashed 2 apex seals right into the rotors, couldnt even get them out. Rotors were garbage after that.

Heres how to do it proper
http://www.moddedmustangs.com/forum...t-port-nitrous-system-on-a-vic-jr-vt1702.html

And an alternative to the multi fogger setup
http://www.holley.com/02119NOS.asp

and of course how NOT to install a wet system even if the kit says so
http://www.musclemustangfastfords.c...ford_mustang_project_car_part_7/photo_05.html

ZEX SUCKS PERIOD
Build it yourself the right way

Well let's get technical...You can do a wet kit without doing a full fogger kit, but it really depends on your intake manifold.

Example-My Buick has a high rise manifold similar to a Victor Jr. Style carb manifold...There's no place for the fuel to puddle cuz the air (and NOS-fuel) comes in the throttle body up high and then goes str8 down into the heads.

"Most" EFI style intake manifolds have many dips, turns, Etc which make running one of these single nozzle wets kits a joke...Problem is people don't want to spend the time/money on what kit your car really needs, and the nitrous company's figure well people keep buying these things, we have warnings all over these things, we might as well make some money on em.

 

[allkesh]

Any UPDATES!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[StinkinLinkinLS01]

careful...you don't want to be accused of being too impatient.

 

[Quik LS]

Any UPDATES!!!!!!!!!!!!

sorry - didn't see you post - saw Aaron's (I reply to him in a minute).

We've been tuning remotely - Torrie sending me a file - me doing runs and logging data, repeat and repeat.

I've got a new smaller pully on order to raise the boost up a bit.

I haven't been around austin for a coupoe of weeks - we are looking to aquired two more companies - so I've been traveling. The weather in Austin been very rainy - so the days I am home - I have not been able to do much.

I'll be traveling next week and the first week of June, family visiting this weekend - so not much happening....

 

[Quik LS]

careful...you don't want to be accused of being too impatient.

Get over it Aaron - anyone can ask without a reaction - as long as they aren't a kid about it.

 

[00HotRodLincoln]

Sc q,s

Hey Quik, Ok so I got a few more questions. First of all my whole ebay thing didnt work out so now I need to find another sc. But before I do this I need to make sure my car is healthy enough to do it. I have about 93k on the motor. I am wondering why it is burning about a quart of oil before every change. Also when I romp on it and it shifts at 40 it makes a screetch noise. I was thinking maybe its the serpentine belt going out maybe. Anyways I really want to do this but. I am wondering how much I should save up or if rebuilding the motor first would be in my best interest. I looked into cams but after researching I guess there isnt a upgrade. comp makes cams for the dohc 4.6 mustang but I guess it wont work. So anyways if you dont mind me asking. How much should I save up to do this so im not with a car in the garage for a long time. Im fairly good at fabricating things and assembling them but as far as the tuning goes its a different story. I saw your video thats pretty cool stuff and you did a great job. How is the power after all that work? Does it light the tires without the power brake after all that?

Thanks, Mike

sorry - didn't see you post - saw Aaron's (I reply to him in a minute).

We've been tuning remotely - Torrie sending me a file - me doing runs and logging data, repeat and repeat.

I've got a new smaller pully on order to raise the boost up a bit.

I haven't been around austin for a coupoe of weeks - we are looking to aquired two more companies - so I've been traveling. The weather in Austin been very rainy - so the days I am home - I have not been able to do much.

I'll be traveling next week and the first week of June, family visiting this weekend - so not much happening....

 

[Quik LS]

I am wondering why it is burning about a quart of oil before every change.

using oil is never a good sign. something is worn.

Also when I romp on it and it shifts at 40 it makes a screetch noise. I was thinking maybe its the serpentine belt going out maybe.

could be many things - not likely the belt. If you can reproduce it at a certain rpm, engine torque, ...etc then that's the clue to start looking deeper....

I am wondering how much I should save up or if rebuilding the motor first would be in my best interest.

I have never heard of 'rebuilding' our engines. usually the shop either orders a new loaded block or a completely rebuilt engine. We cannot even order pistons, rings, ...etc

I looked into cams but after researching I guess there isnt a upgrade. comp makes cams for the dohc 4.6 mustang but I guess it wont work.

correct - the 3.9L is unique

How much should I save up to do this

good question - we are hoping to keep an entire kit in the $4500 range.... and offer pieces/parts to make it much cheaper....

The question really isn't the price - but more - can we get this to a point where it is reasonable for people to do it themselves....

How is the power after all that work? Does it light the tires without the power brake after all that?

sure does. I do not own a video camera - so I have not posted burnouts, ...etc. maybe father's day will bring me a camera...? /hint /hint...

 

[Kulow]

I do not own a video camera - so I have not posted burnouts, ...etc. maybe father's day will bring me a camera...? /hint /hint...

Well Quik, If I can find some time I can bring my camera over and you can light it up for everyones enjoyment. I can even host the videos on my website if you needed (which I'm sure you don't).

Time is always the question though, isn't it? haha

 

[Putter-GLHT]

Crown Victorias, and 97 or older Thunderbirds were very good at squealing the belt when making the 1-2 shift. If the belt is really worn or the tensioner is getting loose the belt can slip during a shift due to the speed and the mass of the alternator, it will do a little burnout on the belt. I've even seen it break the front covers on 4.6's before when it pulls all the slack out of the belt and slams the tensioner to its top.

Maybe you'll get lucky...

 

[00HotRodLincoln]

Sc Ls

Thanks for the replys so I decided to change my oil today since when my car is cold it seems to be alot faster. Changed the oil and looking under my car I realized there is oil leaking between the engine and transmission "Rear main seal" So im guessing this is the cause of my oil leak. I noticed it before but not like I did today. So now my new question for the day is the rear main seal,is it possibly repairable or do I just throw my hands up in the air to getting another motor or buying another/ trading for another ls. I guess as long as I can move it its fine for now. but having a top shape car is always my priority. Im also going to change the belt as soon as I can since it looks like its glazed. I would so be up for buying a sc kit later though after I get my car healthy again. Its pretty much like having a 90's corvette sedan but corvette doesnt have all the bells and whistles and you cant take 4 people along unless theyre midgets lol. Thanks, Mike

 

[Putter-GLHT]

Check the rear of the valve covers before saying its a rear main seal. 3.9's like to leak on the lower rear corners and it runs down the transmission and smokes off the manifolds etc. Also if the rear main is leaking, make sure the pcv valve isn't frozen shut as sometimes thats all it takes to make an engine quit leaking... Cheers!

 

[beaups]

I don't think our 3.9's have a pcv valve

 

[Quik LS]

good advise - the leaks usually happen in the back corners that are hard to get to...

there is now PCV valves in the V8s - they vent straight into the intake.

 

[glanga]

So I've tried to read this whole thread start to finish. Whoever said it should be mandatory reading before posting about S/C's is right.

Just a question.....Not sure if you touched on it yet. But any numbers?!!?!?
You haven't dyno'ed it yet? Do you know the exact RWHP before you added the S/C or just the BHP of the engine. Sorry if someone touched on this before. I tried to read it all but sometimes I'd skip over if I saw someone straying off topic.

 

[Quik LS]

yeah - this thread has a little of everything in it now...

No numbers yet.

Our tuning effort is stalled waiting for SCT. They were suppose to release the LiveLink software to allow the LiveWire to DataLog (needed for tuning) last Tuesday..... They did - but did not release the LiveWire ROM upgrade. So until I can record a run and send it to Torrie, which he then modifies the tune, send it back to me, I uploaded and do another run.... we have to wait. It looks like it should only be a few more days....

Once we get to where the tune is as good as it can be remotely - then Torrie is flying up, and a bunch of folks from LLSOC are coming in - and we'll hit the dyno for final tunes. That way we aren't wasting expensive dyno time until the tune is very close.

While I was waiting on SCT - I have been working with Pulley Boys to get some pulleys and pulley systems build for this project.

The Thurderbird SuperCoupe uses a 3.1" - 3.2" pulley on the supercharger with a large pulley on the crank driving it with a 8-ribbed belt. Most of the performance guys start fooling with the drive ratio and getting to a 3:1 ratio (SC spins 3 times with each engine rpm).

in the first picture below - my current LS pulley on the right - the stock T-Bird pulley on the left. Our LS uses a 6-ribbed belt and revs higher than the SuperCoupes - so we need a different setup.

I have been using this formula:
boost = drive ratio X blower displacement X 25.58 / engine displacement - 14.7

so in my case:
drive ratio = crank pulley / sc pulley = 5.635/2.7 = 2.0938
boost = 2.0938 X 90ci X 25.58 / 240ci - 14.7
boost = 4820.34636 / 240 - 14.7
boost = 20.0847765 - 14.7
boost = 5.39 psi

I am running a 2.9" pulley right now making ~4psi (don't really know until we get to datalog again).

So I now have an interchangable system that allows easier swaps... and have a 2.9", 2.8" and 2.7" (which should make the 5.3psi) - in the second picture.

The cool thing is we can swap out the pulley easier and get more boost (if we think the engine can take it....)

 

[beaups]

Why not just run a simple boost gauge just to be sure?

 

[Quik LS]

I do. I have Autometer C2 air/fuel, fuel pressure and a boost/vac gauge in my a-pillar. eye-balling it while I'm driving at 100mph is not too accurate.

I actually wired the MAP senor into the LiveWire - to my boost levels also display on it - but more importantly I can now log the boost levels with all the other parameters when we do our tuning.

 

[97stscaddy]

Quik how much time have you invested into this project?