little nitrous help please

I am assuming using sst is a must in 03 + if the nitrous is armed? I know my car in d5 even under light acceleration likes to go WOT when in D5 to avoid part throttle downshifts.
 
beaups said:
I am assuming using sst is a must in 03 + if the nitrous is armed? I know my car in d5 even under light acceleration likes to go WOT when in D5 to avoid part throttle downshifts.
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well - I would say -

leave it in D5 and drive it, really the car is actually exactly the same with or without N2O - if is needs to downshift to get going, let it downshift and get going....

the factory shift points are pretty good...

if you are using SST you are placing a lot of faith in your shifting - when drag racing - I've always left it in d4/d5 and just stepped on it.

the worry on the 5r55 is that it is capable of having a rpm flare in the 2-3 shift (which I learned is a swap shift). There is a long explanation - but if the two speed releases before the three speed starts, the trannie goes back to 1st gear then makes a 1-3 shift. This usually is more energy than the intermediate can take, and the friction material burns up in a few shifts of this type.
 
Quik LS said:
well - I would say -

leave it in D5 and drive it, really the car is actually exactly the same with or without N2O - if is needs to downshift to get going, let it downshift and get going....

the factory shift points are pretty good...

if you are using SST you are placing a lot of faith in your shifting - when drag racing - I've always left it in d4/d5 and just stepped on it.

the worry on the 5r55 is that it is capable of having a rpm flare in the 2-3 shift (which I learned is a swap shift). There is a long explanation - but if the two speed releases before the three speed starts, the trannie goes back to 1st gear then makes a 1-3 shift. This usually is more energy than the intermediate can take, and the friction material burns up in a few shifts of this type.
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The SST would be better when in a dragrace if your actually taking it serious because you will want to already be in the gear that your going to start the race in. Whether it is a highway roll or whatever, you will want to already be in that gear so you don't have to wait for your tranny to downshift and then accelerate. It all depends on how seriously you take the race I suppose. Not to mention that when I switched to using SST at the track I cut 2/10ths off my ET from that change alone.

Quik, the rpm flare your talking about is because on the 2-3 shift and all shifts after. It is due to the transmission switching from non-synchronous to sychronous mode of shifting. That is one of the big contributing factors why the 5R55S, N, W trannies don't hold as much power when compared to the 4R70W tranny. The 4R70W tranny starts shifting synchronously one gear later than the 5R's do, and the 4R's are a bigger transmission too.
 
rocket5979 said:
Quik, the rpm flare your talking about is because on the 2-3 shift and all shifts after. It is due to the transmission switching from non-synchronous to sychronous mode of shifting. That is one of the big contributing factors why the 5R55S, N, W trannies don't hold as much power when compared to the 4R70W tranny. The 4R70W tranny starts shifting synchronously one gear later than the 5R's do, and the 4R's are a bigger transmission too.
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rocket - you're close -

On the 5R55S, the 1-2 is a non-synch. The 2-3 is a swap shift. The 3-4 is a synch shift, and the 4-5 is a non-synch.

The 5R55N has an additional one way clutch and intermediate clutch to change the 3-4 to a non-synch shift.

It's the 2-3 'swap shift' that is the most problematic.

No doubt there will need to be some development on the 5r55 series before you'll find them in many pro-level drag races.
 
Quik LS said:
No doubt there will need to be some development on the 5r55 series before you'll find them in many pro-level drag races.
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Yep, right now Level 10 does offer a pretty stout rebuild for them that is supposed to hold 700/700 at the wheels. But everyone knows how power claims are. hehe.

Quik, why the hell are you on here posting on a Saturday!?!?? You need to get out and finish that damn intercooler off! hehe. Lazy azz. :D
 
rocket5979 said:
Quik, why the hell are you on here posting on a Saturday!?!?? You need to get out and finish that damn intercooler off! hehe. Lazy azz. :D
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posting from the computer in the garage....
 
What do you think about the trigger on a button, then you could let of the no2 with out letting off the gas
 
true - but the button allows you to 'accidently' spray when you foot isn't at WOT - and then you could run very lean - and boom....

I personally do not like them. the system is designed to operate at WOT - only adding N2O when your fuel is pumping its hardest and your tune is in open loop.

many times someone was spraying with the button and for whatever reason accidently lifted their foot for a split second. if it was a WOT + button then maybe....
 
zexls said:
What do you think about the trigger on a button, then you could let of the no2 with out letting off the gas
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That is another way. There are many many ways to activate a shot of nitrous. Some people get pretty creative.
 
I'm another LS owner debating the bottle...

I am not that serious about racing, I do it strictly for fun. The only reason I am even contemplaiting getting the bottle is because I have a little extra $ and I want to surprise a few certain people; especially this cocky ass asian kid in his M3. The kit I'm looking at getting comes with two switches -- one to activate/deactivate it and one to purge the kit. Its the same kit sheepsoup from LLSOC.com has...seems to be pretty solid.

Now even though I just got BRAND NEW plugs installed less than two months ago I'm still going to get copper core just in case. I also just got a brand new fuel pump, injectors and 5 out of the 8 engine coils replaced so the engine should be able to handle a 75 wet shot as long as I use it properly - that is all I am worred about! lol. If I upgrade to 100 shot, I will upgrade fuel pumps, I want to be as safe as possible. Oh and I also all ready have the XCal2 and will get the nos tune in no time.

Once activated I can use a button to spray. I have a 2001 and I do NOT have SST mode and I really don't plan on making the conversion. The races will not be THAT serious and I don't have that much confidence in my shifting so when I do use the spray I will have it in D4/D5 the whole way. Is there any way to avoid spraying between gears 2-3 or any of the gears for that matter? I figure even if I let off the button for a mila-sec nitrous will still be flowing through the system so it won't even matter. To my understanding, when using a 75 wet shot on an LS I should only spray once I hit 2nd gear after about 2000 RPMs.

My questions, can I spray from 2000 rpms in 2nd all the way to 4th gear in D4/D5 without letting off the button at all (of course I will be at WOT the whole way)

Finally, can I spray while still in 1st at all?

I'm not talking about straight out of the whole, I'm talking after 3500 rpms...more less once I get rolling cuz I don't want to rip my rear end out or wreck the trannie. I know the LS struggles getting out of the hole (which is why I'm getting 3.58s) so I'm just wondering when it is that you guys would say I have the "green light" to start spraying a 75 wet shot into my 01LSV8 (no sst)
 
And Quik, you said the best way would be to get one of the "staged kits" that gradually increases spray. I'm sure you are familiar with the setup "sheepsoup" from LLSOC has on his LS. What would I need and how much would converting the to "staged kit" cost with what that particular kit all ready has (a/f gauge, purge kit, kill switch, spray button etc)? Thanks.
 
yep - sheepsoup and I exchange many e-mails - he's happy with his setup.

IMHO - running N2O comes down to three things:
- proper tuning, plugs, ...etc
- not exceeding the limiits of the driveline
- how many miles on the driveline

any car can do it - but not with any size shot.

using a 'rpm windowing' switch allows the N2O to only be triggered within a rpm range.

a staged kit puts a small N2O shot to get you off the line (like a 25shot) then ups it as you are moving.

http://www.nitrousexpress.com/Pages/DualWindowSwitch.htm ($170)
http://www.nitrousexpress.com/Pages/Maximizer2.htm ($700)
Edelbrock Progressive Nitrous Controller, p/n 71900 ($300)

Venom is big at the track -> http://www.venom-performance.com

you simply 'add' the unit to your kit
 
my point is that the 03+ units with ETC do not match throttle position with accelerator position. You can feel it and it's discussed in the service manual. What I mean is if you give it say 20% throttle in D5 the car will open the throttle fully (WOT) leaving the car in 5th....and would thus engage the nitrous. Does this make sense?
 
beaups said:
my point is that the 03+ units with ETC do not match throttle position with accelerator position. You can feel it and it's discussed in the service manual. What I mean is if you give it say 20% throttle in D5 the car will open the throttle fully (WOT) leaving the car in 5th....and would thus engage the nitrous. Does this make sense?
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so using a TSP WOT sensor or a mechanial WOT trigger switch you know your at WOT, and that is what you are tuned for.

the issue isn't if you downshift or not, it's adding 100hp to your driveline - either from a stop launch or from a roll - adding 100hp is risky.

think of a new mustang - it has a 100hp more than us - and they step on it and downshift all the time.

IMHO - it comes down to three things:
- a proper tune, plugs, ...etc
- not exceeding the limits of your drivetrain
- number of miles on your drivetrain
 
We're still not syncing here. the throttle body on the 03+ LS's opens fully and frequently with light throttle input. wouldn't this fire off the nitrous when you don't want it?
 
I understand what you are saying -

- the car is only tuned for N2O at WOT - so under WOT is when it should fire - reguardless of your pedal
- if you feel it is triggering when you do not mean it to - because it is going to WOT when you don't mean it to - then you have to either go rpm windowing switch, progressive controller - or wire a 'activate' button in-line with the WOT switch

- you asked about SST - how does that change the way the pedal acts?
 
Quik LS said:
I understand what you are saying -

- the car is only tuned for N2O at WOT - so undet WOT is when it should fire - regaurdless of your pedal
- if you feel it is triggering when you do not mean it to - because it is going to WOT when you don't mean it to - then you have to either go rpm windowing switch, progressive controller - or wire a 'activate' button in-line with the WOT switch

- you asked about SST - how does that change the way the pedal acts?
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OK that makes sense. I think the inline activiation switch would be a must for the 03+. Yes, SST it would work fine as the throttle and pedals appear to be "linked". My concern was driving around casually on the highway (in D5) and just give it a little gas whamo the nitrous fires. I think that would happen a lot on the ETC vehicles.
 
Well - I don't anyone who drives around with the bottle open, system armed - just in case someone is looking to race. You have to stage ready for N2O use - it's not like you 'could' use it on the way to work....

think of it like dynomite - you lite it and it goes boom - you only have less than 2mins of use in the bottle.
 
Quik LS said:
Well - I don't anyone who drives around with the bottle open, system armed - just in case someone is looking to race. You have to stage ready for N2O use - it's not like you 'could' use it on the way to work....
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Hehehe. No sh1t, huh? It would be funny to see someone always armed with their nitrous ready.





Unless you got a remote bottle opener or KNOW you will run into a race soon after, you won't have your bottle even opened yet. The master arming switch is what is used in conjunction with all the other switches to make sure the nitrous only activates when the user wants it to. Even with the TBW systems in the 03+ LS you will not have to worry about WOTcommand and part throttle actual response because if your nitrous is armed the next time you get on the gas will most likely be totally full WOT.

The trannies will handle a lot of power and still keep a ticking. I have put 500 horsepowe through a stock 5R55W tranny (brethren to 5R55S, N) and had no problems with it. I am still running it at 450 horsepower and so far it is running ok. In an LS you would have to be running a big shot of nitrous to equal that amount of power through the tranny and driveline. I wouldn't worry too much about the tranny as long as you don't get stupid with things.
 
5r55 = 550 peak torque rating

the torque converter multiples the engine torque by 2 (peak) before it locks up - then it's one-to-one

so the key is not to surpass the 550 peak torque of the trannie before the converter locks up - which it never at the engine peak torque output....

so my LS puts out 267 lb/ft peak torque (stock) which doesn't get multiplied by 2 - since the peak output doesn't occur at peak converter multiplication.

so we have some room - don't know how much....
 
Has anyone taken any install pics? On average, how much have you spent on your kits (from start to finish) (anyone?). I see alot of people like the wet kits more. can I get some detailed opinions. Can anyone give me some model numbers for the kits (part numbers and brands) And last, but not least, what brand plug makes a good cold plug?
 
I ran the Nitrous Express Part # 20922 + the bottle warmer, remote opener, purge kit and guage. it all totaled up to about $1100.

The stock fuel pump kept up. Initally, I had trouble finding colder plugs - but now found good swaps - Autolite, NGK, Champion - cross it to a champion RC10YC4 and then gap them a little smaller.
 
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