2002 Lincoln LS V6 Auto Sport won't drive in auto, only 2 & 3 in SST, No trans codes???

Lincoln LS

  1. Itzyaboy Jo

    Itzyaboy Jo LVC Member

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    Took my car to a supposed emissions specialist shop for a reoccurring P0411 code ( 2ndary AIR incorrect upstream flow detected); P1633 Battery High Voltage (although code itself reflects low voltage when Google searched ‍♂️) and P1504 Idle Air Valve.

    Upon initial fix P0411 and P1633 no longer appear, but P1504 is still present, along with P1507 another Idle Air circuit code and P1565 speed control system.

    As the mechanic pulled up with my vehicle he "claims" my transmission flashed E on the dash and now my car will NOT drive in D5 or D4, but it will in SST 2 & 3; however, when you upshift from 3 to 4, 4 flashes but it drops back down to 3 immediately. When in auto E is NOT on the dash, it shows the gears D5 & D4 but car will NOT move, although it does in Reverse.

    The car had 189,601 when I dropped it off, but it now has 189,971, which means my car was driven 370 miles since it had been dropped off I'm aware there trans is supposed to be checked at around 180,000 - 190,000 miles according to manufacturing specs, so the problem may have been imminent, however, the excessive and unexplained mileage put on it by the "technician" definitely ushered it in.

    Currently there is no transmission code associated with the problem, so I'm wondering if anyone KNOWS what the problem may be. I've heard trans may have went into limp mode to save it from being a total loss, but with no code I don't know what the problem may be. I've heard solenoid pack and some sort of gear spring
     
  2. Itzyaboy Jo

    Itzyaboy Jo LVC Member

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    Prior to dropping the vehicle off I have NEVER experienced ANY transmission slippage, stutter, and only a slight jerk when put in reverse, which is quite common I've heard because supposedly reverse uses more torque than drive.
     
  3. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    I don't know where your found those specs. I would like to see them though.
    The manuals that I have say that the transmission should have a full fluid exchange at 150K miles.

    I'm positive that there are DTCs for your transmission stored. You/they aren't using a Ford specific scan tool that can pull them. It all guesses and throwing parts at it without the proper tools and knowledge. If I dropped off a working car and then picked up a broken one, I would be very upset with the shop. What is there position on that?
     
  4. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    No, that is not normal at all. That is a result of a solenoid assembly problem. There were some defective ones (defective in that they became marginal early on), and it was/is important to replace those before they caused major mechanical damage to the transmission.
     
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    • Itzyaboy Jo

      Itzyaboy Jo LVC Member

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      I took it to an Auto Zone to check and see what codes were in it before I took in the same day and their printout had manufacturer recommendations on it at the end that stated 190,000 but that may have just been in reference to what the current mileage was at the time. I bought it in December from a guy that couldn't get it to pass emissions and had it sitting up for a year prior to me purchasing it. I believe it was around 180,000 when I bought it or slightly under. He told me he had already had the fluids changed on his last tune up, but there is no dipstick access for me to check.

      The shop it's at said they put it up on a lift to check the fluids themselves and said nothing came out and that they put 4 qts in it, but there has been no leakage from it because it has sat in the shop several times since I've had it for up to two weeks at a time and no leakage was underneath and I damned sure would've been made aware if so because it's mostly been at my childhood friend's shop and he would've definitely said something as he's only got a one car capable garage so he would've seen the leakage.
       
    • joegr

      joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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      Perhaps they don't know what they are doing and have very much over filled it. I don't think that in itself would completely explain your current problem. I'll bet that they also put the wrong fluid in. The Auto Zone scanners usually can't read anything but engine codes. You need to get the right tools or take it to someone qualified to work on it. Maybe a good local independent shop with Jaguar experience. Playing it cheap will cost you greatly.
       
    • Itzyaboy Jo

      Itzyaboy Jo LVC Member

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      I hear you on that. That's why I stated from what I've been told. Also, my current driveway is on a slight declining slope, so when I got reverse it's already angling uphill a bit, but I've only been at this new location a month and a half. Prior to that, I lived in a complex with an even parking lot and I never experienced even the slight jerk then, only since I've been at the new location.

      Sometimes the engine would stall in reverse after a cold start, but not after I've driven it and had to stop and the engine was still hot. I don't know if that had to do with the fact that I needed a new upper intake plenum gasket installed, because it had been removed 3 times after it had been cleaned by a shop. Had to replace the spark plugs when I first got it and the front tube assembly broke, so it had to be removed again once the part came in to insert the part in the passenger side. Then, I removed it myself to change the 1st cylinder coil pack because it had blown out. The "technician" at the current shop replaced that prior to the current issues occurrence.
       
    • Itzyaboy Jo

      Itzyaboy Jo LVC Member

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      Oh no, the current codes in it were not found at Auto Zone, that's what the shop pulled using their scan tool. I'm aware that P0700 series codes would be associated with the transmission, and I believe P1700 would be Ford specific codes, but don't quote me on the latter, I'm going off slight recollection from what I've dug up so far
       
    • heyjewel

      heyjewel Well-Known LVC Member

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      Are you mechanically inclined? If so, I believe you ca fix this problem relatively cheaply. I had a similar problem on my 2001 LS auto V6. It would run fine in 1, 2, 3 but then would almost never shift beyond 3. Also reverse was somewhat clunky. Thanks to some info on this site, I fixed these issues by:
      1) purchasing the correct type and amount of trans fluid, a new trans filter, a solenoid pack, a reverse solenoid and a tiny spring.
      2) completely draining the trans fluid by removing the pan.
      3) Removing the filter and the solenoid pak (a small 10mm bolt holds it in from the very top of the case)
      4) removing the reverse solenoid
      5) careful now at least one ball will drop on the floor as you lower the body. - drop the valve body from the car carefully and keep it parallel to floor. Place it on a workbench and remove the spring located ... The spring will almost certainly be broken. Replace it with the new spring.
      6) reverse the above procedure and refill the transmission as described in ...

      You almost certainly will be good to go. Total cost $300 or so.

      The two things I didn't specify above can be found on this list with judicious searches. Sorry I'm out of time right now.

      Good luck.
       
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      • lincoln_zero

        lincoln_zero Dedicated LVC Member

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        I've noticed mine to be jerky at times, more or less rarely. I am aware 2004's suffered from bad solenoids.
        I have 116,000 kms (72k miles) on it.
        Should I go ahead and replace the solenoids and do a flush / oil replacement?
         
      • joegr

        joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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        I think that I would. They replaced the solenoid pack (and all fluid) early on my 04 (don't remember the miles, but probably 2 years old). At 210K+ miles, it is still smoother than my 06.
         
      • 04_Sport_LS

        04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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        DITTO !!!

        Sounds to me like it may have went on a 370 mile thrashing joy ride. Or may have been a long trip parts chaser beater.

        Any other issues, quirks, noises present now that weren't there before???

        If you can document and prove that this shop put almost 400 miles on your vehicle... and it was worse than when it was brought in ... then you should contact your local Attorney Generals office and see if you have a case.

        Park the vehicle and don't drive it anymore until you contact the AG. Get a rental and recoup the costs later if you can. Don't have any further contact the shop at all.

        If the AG says you have a case... take the shop to small claims court after getting a dealer repair estimate and a 2nd one from a high end reputable independent shop.

        Keep in mind also that factory LS trannys can be had for around $1700, (and were still available as of last year)... and that the repairs could cost more than a new tranny. Use that to your advantage.

        Sue the crap out of that shop... and again... wait till they get the certified letter and just ignore their calls. If they would offer in court to make the proper repairs... just tell the judge that it's obvious by their neglegence that they can't be trusted... so why would you want them to do the work.

        Keep in mind that most States small claims court is good for $5000.
         
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        • AmsterDutch

          AmsterDutch Dedicated LVC Member

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          That’s sound wisdom from 04_Sport_LS ...follows his advise and you’ll be loving life again
           
        • Itzyaboy Jo

          Itzyaboy Jo LVC Member

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          Definitely sounds like good advice but I'm starting to think EVERYBODY I take this car to are idiots or for some goofy ass reason they think I am!

          Had the car towed from the first shop to a Ford/Lincoln dealership last Friday ($130). All of what I've previously explained here, explained to them. Was told it would be $135 to diagnose trans issue. Went to the dealership Monday (my off day) to touch basis face to face with the ppl there. Received a call later that day and was told, "my technician drove the car around a bit... Says you need a new transmission the one in there's no good."

          I asked what diagnostics were used and what were the results of such and he proceeded to tell me, "our guys have a lot of experience with these cars, so they can tell pretty much by driving it" I had to tell him I could tell you THAT from driving it! I brought it here to figure out EXACTLY what's wrong with it, or what is the cause of it not shifting into 4 & 5 but driving in 2 & 3, and why it wouldn't have given me any transmission codes at all before total failure. This guy proceeds to tell me that the transmission doesn't have any sensors on it for that year model that would tell me ANYTHING Mind you, I've sat and watched a man engage my transmission while it was idling in park with a snap-on scan computer when I first got it. Now this old shxt keeps calling me telling me nothing but EXACTLY what I already told them when I took it there.

          I'm trying to ascertain what EXACTLY has failed in the transmission and why there is no transmission failure codes in my PCM/ECM. It's a sealed transmission with no way to service it except take it to a shop (unless you have shop equipment readily available) so there's no way their going to convince me that there are absolutely no sensors on that transmission that would've alerted me to low transmission fluid, which would cause not only low pressure, but high temperature from parts not being lubed properly while in motion.

          The whole situation is beginning to make me wanna wig the hell out! I mean, absolutely no technical analysis at all but these ppl expect me to pay them $135 to tell me everything I already knew. Ridiculous.
           
        • joegr

          joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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          Sorry, but I would have predicted that a dealer would now only say that it is broken and not try to correctly diagnose it. The LS is now outside of the range of cars that they work on. I wouldn't take a 1973 Monterey to a Ford/Lincoln dealer either.
          There are pressure and temperature sensors in the solenoid assembly in the transmission.

          I don't know why everyone keeps repeating this "sealed transmission" crap. It's simply not true. It doesn't have a dipstick. That's the only difference between it and other automatic transmissions that do (there are also plenty of other transmissions without dipsticks). Like all the other automatics out there, it has a vent on the top and a removable pan. Unlike some, it also has a drain plug. It is no different to service other than it's more involved to add fluid and check the level than those with dipsticks.

          You need to find a good local independent transmission shop with experience on the 5r55 transmission series. Find out which shop most of the local mechanics farm transmission work out to.

          I still don't understand why the place that screwed it up isn't taking care of this... (if all is as you related.)

          Get Forscan (PC version). It will pull the transmission codes for you. They are there, but many scan tools won't read them.
           
        • 04_Sport_LS

          04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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          Actually... there are none. Proper fluid level is maintained through routine maintenance. Only other indicator of low fluid level would be red stains under the vehicle wherever you park.

          That can be difficult. Could be solenoid pack, (doubtful)... worn valve body... broken spring in valve body... bad gasket in valve body... sticking sprag clutch, and a couple other things.

          It's kinda the same as with engine failure. You might get a couple codes showing "symptoms", but you won't know what happened until you get inside.
           
        • 04_Sport_LS

          04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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          I think that BS was started by the service write up guys at the dealer when dipstick tubes disappeared. It was just easier to say that then try to explain the whole procedure to the customer.
           
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          • joegr

            joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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            Yeah, there are some cars that report engine oil level, but I don't know of any that monitor transmission fluid level. There really should be no need. It is not consumed and leaks are rare (and should be noticed). The fluid level should always be correct unless it is incorrectly filled or there is a leak.
             
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            • 04_Sport_LS

              04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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              AGREED! And the first thing I would do is have them check the fluid level... and have them throw on a can of that SeaFoam "trans tune" , and see if it improves.
               
            • 04_Sport_LS

              04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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              Joe. Would you want to take your vehicle back to the same place that screwed it up? Especially if they put 400 miles on it in the process?

              They would probably band-aid it back together... and 6 months later when the, (maybe), warranty expired you would be S-O-L.
               
            • 04_Sport_LS

              04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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              Either way... at this point it's been a week... and unless the excess milage was documented, (service write up ticket and time/date stamped photograph when vehicle was picked up), the opportunity for litigation is fading. Especially since it has been driven more since then.
               
            • joegr

              joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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              No, but I would expect them to pay for someone else to fix it, and that's what I meant.

              Been there, done that (not LS related)...
               
            • 04_Sport_LS

              04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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              I figured that's what you meant, but by the sound of this shop... they'd probably pay another fly by night shop, (or do it themselves), to stick a boneyard trans in it and cross their fingers it held up for the brief warranty, (possibly), offered.
               
            • 04_Sport_LS

              04_Sport_LS Dedicated LVC Member

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              With all the horror stories I have heard over the years about shitty shops... that's why I have this in my sig...

              "I don't take my vehicles to a shop! That way, if I screw something up, I know it's screwed up, and I'm not trying to hide it from myself! :shifty:"
               
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              • AmsterDutch

                AmsterDutch Dedicated LVC Member

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                I know from experience with my past 1st Gen 3.9 ...( Damn I loved that car) when it comes to transmissions...mine was failing waaaayyy before I did a fluid exchange...only after the fluid exchange did my Transmission light come on ...if you like the car and the body/ interior is in good shape ..as already stated find a good Indy shop that has connections with a reputable transmission specific professional...no not AAMCO find a shop that will warranty the transmission and rebuild it for a walk out price between $2000-2300 including a trustworthy warranty...good luck
                 

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