being gay is a lifestyle "choice"? i'd have to see you back that one up. being religious is a lifestyle choice.
There is no exception in the definition of marriage based on sexuality; that is what the gay community is asking for.
Since being gay has not been proven to be anything more then a lifestyle choice there is no claim to equality, as the person is choosing to exclude themselves from the mainstream.
What they are asking for is special rights for themselves; namely the redefining of marriage to accomadate their lifestyle choice; to make an exception for them. This ignores all the potential negative consequences of redefining marriage in order to push the agenda built around their lifestyle choice.
Haven't you ever heard the phrase "sexual preference?" That PC term was coined by homosexuals.Gays do indeed have children, Ted haggard has several children.
If sexuality is a choice, then do tell me when and how you choose to be attracted to women? I also assume like every other person, there are certain qualities you find more attractive than others, eg blue eyes over brown, when and how did you choose yours?
Gays do indeed have children, Ted haggard has several children.
If sexuality is a choice, then do tell me when and how you choose to be attracted to women? I also assume like every other person, there are certain qualities you find more attractive than others, eg blue eyes over brown, when and how did you choose yours?
Ted Haggard didn't have any children in a homosexual relationship. They were from a hetro relationship. Haggard is hardly an example of a homosexual, more and example of a bisexual. Considering his use of crystal meth, I think it is safe to say that there were probably a lot of phsychological factors involved in all his problems, and in his case, the homosexual encounters have to be considered one of those problems.
Either way, the example of Ted Harrard is tangential at best, and only serves to obfuscate the point; which I assume is your goal anyway.
Are you really trying to argue the fact that homosexual couples cannot biologically reproduce?!
No one said sexuality is a choice. You are mischaracterizing again to set up a straw man, I see. Homosexuality is very likely a choice (consciously or unconsciously), as it is due to a number of psychological factors. You choose to deviate from the norm. Heterosexuality is the norm and is biologically natural. Remember that the ultimate biological purpose of sex is reproduction. Heterosexuals can reproduce while homosexuals cannot.
Also, I know this is an old argument, but why would ANYBODY choose to be a homosexual, given the obstacles and torment many have to go through? But this brings up another point that just occurred to me: Why aren't homosexual animals shunned by their heterosexual peers? The fact that they are not implies that homosexual behavior is indeed natural, even if it's not common.
You are wrong about this.as to whether gay is a lifestyle choice.
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/magazine/articles/2005/08/14/what_makes_people_gay/
there is lots of evidence that gay is from birth. it is not a lifestyle choice. you cannot be "cured" from being gay.
Ah, yes, the typical hrmwrm "proof," eh? LOL You don't have a clue what proof is. Animals =/= humans. Nice try.the reason for it is as yet fully explainable. the fact that it exists elsewhere in the animal kingdom and not just in humans proves it is beyond a "lifestyle choice".
Romans 1:27 would definitely answer your sneering sarcasm.but god doesn't make gays, right? just like the sun revolves around the earth.
Not so much anymore.TommyB said:Also, I know this is an old argument, but why would ANYBODY choose to be a homosexual, given the obstacles and torment many have to go through?
Gay men can and do have sex with women, sometimes those sexual outtings produce children. Gay women can and do have sex with men, sometimes those outtings produce a child.
I work with a lesbian, who has a child from a long previous relationship with a man, she has no further interest in men and initially married a man because that is what she thought was right and expected of her, the mariage didn't last long for obvious reasons (her words). Correct, two males or two females can not have a baby together, that doesn't mean that a homosexual couldn't reproduce and pass on whatever it is you think they have or don't have.
So tell me, what would make these people choose to deviate from the norm and what is supposedly biology ingrained? Incorrect again, 'homosexual sex' can't reproduce, homosexuals can and do.
I'm sure you're aware that there is ample documentation of homosexual behavior in wild animals, so that raises some important questions:
1. Assuming that an animal of the opposite sex is available, what factors would cause the animal to ignore his natural instincts and choose the "dirt chute"?
2. Can animals "choose" at all or is it strictly a human concept?
3. Since, as you say, homosexuals cannot produce offspring, why do we still see it in the animal kingdom at all, given that it should have been bred out long ago (I'll refrain from using the E-word).
I don't have the answers to these questions and neither does anyone else. But it certainly seems that there is more to homosexuality than making a conscious decision to become one.
as to whether gay is a lifestyle choice.
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/magazine/articles/2005/08/14/what_makes_people_gay/
there is lots of evidence that gay is from birth.
it is not a lifestyle choice. you cannot be "cured" from being gay.
there are gay animals. obviously, if genetic, it should get bred out and never resurface. yet it reappears. the reason for it is as yet fully explainable.
the fact that it exists elsewhere in the animal kingdom and not just in humans proves it is beyond a "lifestyle choice".
You simply can not accept the possibility of someone having an attraction to the same sex that is beyond their control (ie born) and not a factor of some trauma like a rape, molestation, neglect etc. Funny actually.
This is a very solid argument.All you have shown is that homosexuals by choice can have reproduced in there past as heterosexuals. As homosexuals, they cannot reproduce. People who are gay their whole lives cannot reproduce, and those are the only ones that might pass on a gay gene if it does exist. Basically, being gay isn't inherited or genetic in any way. There is no way a "gay gene" could be passed along. It would be weeded out through natural selection.
This is not. It is a sarcastic straw man argument that generalizes as well.You know, a homosexual probably knows more about their own desires than say, you. Of course they're lying or just delusional when they say "I didn't choose", as the vast majority will say.
Typical hrmwrm argument. First you set up the argument, then you promptly forget that you did so, and mock the response. Okay, first of all, YOU brought God into the discussion, demanding to know where it says that God doesn't create gays. I answer your stupid challenge and then you mock me for doing so? I keep learning the same lesson over and over: You do not debate in good faith. But what else is new. So go pound sand.the typical fossten proof. you found one man who suppresses his urges, even declaring he still has them. hardly cured of anything. supppressing things is not cured. more like he was brainwashed. and 1:27 was to explain what? recitation from scripture doesn't explain a thing, unless you are trying to use this as to why you are homophobic. i quote
"1:27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural function of the woman, burned in their lust toward one another, men doing what is inappropriate with men, and receiving in themselves the due penalty of their error. "
i didn't realize gay was just men. yet you argue against all gay's. where is lesbianism wrong in the bible then? or is that 1:26. can't quite figure it's meaning. but then, this IS a BOOK. just words written down centuries ago, when their understanding was less. and if you think i'm sneering, show me anywhere in scripture it's written that the earth revolves around the sun. you can't. it's actually written that the earth is fixed. which is why much stock is not put in a scriptural arguement.
That's the whole problem with your attitude - you think debating is some sort of juvenile playground fight. Frankly, I don't care if you believe me or not, but if you're going to discuss things in such a disingenuous manner, I'm not going to be sucked in to trading insults with you. If you see a logical flaw in my argument, by all means point it out. But don't mock my beliefs, that only destroys your own credibility and makes you look like a jerk.fossten, i wasn't setting up an arguement, i was being sarcastic at the end of the post. now, if you wish to use scripture as a proving point of arguement, i'm afraid we're back at the same problem of the reality of god. if you can prove him and that those are his words, then you'd have the upper hand.
This is a very solid argument.
This is not. It is a sarcastic straw man argument that generalizes as well.
Oh, and I don't need the upper hand, because you're going to meet God solo one day whether you believe in Him or not, and that's your own deal.
Your reading comprehension is lacking.I believe that was his point in you using scripture as "proof". You believe, someone else might not, there is also no way to ultimately prove (or disprove) God.