Stall converters....

lincoln00

lincoln00

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looking at doing a stall converter and was wondering if the 05-2008 mustang stall converters will work... did a little research my self and found that the flex plate on the 05 and up 4.6 3valves look to have the same bolt pattern on there flex plate for the converter.. So does anyone know for sure that say a stall converter for the 2005+ mustang will work im a 2004 lincoln ls 3.9L's 5r55s trans... the other option i have found was the converter for the 4.0L v6 05+ mustang..
 
Clarification

A couple of comments. First, the stall RPM of a converter is significantly dependent on the torque produced by the engine to which it's attached. Think about it---the harder the engine 'twists'-(that's torque) the more the converter can be induced to slip-(the stall speed).

Second, although it's a very common way to talk, to speak of a 'stall converter' is to speak in error. A '2500-stall converter' is a converter that, in a particular set of circumstances, stalls at 2500 RPM---just as a 180 degree thermostat opens at 180 degrees. But one doesn't speak of a 'degree thermostat'---it's just a thermostat. 'Degree' is part of the designation.
:) :) :) :)
KS
 
3500-4000 sounds a little aggresive, too aggressive with a power adder. i think 3000 would be well balanced.
 
its stalls at 2800 now... i think 3000 would be a disappointment..


on the converter comment... that is why I said 3500-4000 stall.... NOT tht is will tall 3500-4000, it was either or
 
i guess i should try brakestanding it at the track as much as possible and see if thats faster than the launch from around 1k. i have heard multiple reports that it gets out of the hole in a hurry initially, but then goes slow. is that due to characteristics of the power curve, or the converter (or both). i usually pay no attention to the tack until 5k so i can't say for sure. maybe just the fact its a different converter would make it better. if it is 2800 stock, then i agree that 3500 would not be too much.
 
pretty much any decent trans performance shop can re-tool converters and balance them to any stall speed, there was an ebay store selling custom stall'd converters for the ls a while back not sure if there still there, I was thinking about getting a higher stalling converter myself, these things launch a hair below the power band, would be nice to bump it a bit, just remember its a substantially larger amount of strain on everything tho
 
yea that was going to be my second question.... can the rearend handle a 4000RPM launch.. I know when i launch the car at 2800 RPM it bogs BAD.. BUt if you had a 4000 stall, the people with the bottle could leave on the bottle... and the people with 4:10 gears could get a set of slicks and launch SUPER hard out of the hole.... I think the 4:10 gears and a stall can easily put these cars in the 13's and under a 2.0 60 foot...
 
i assume you mean without a power adder. for this type of car, i dont think many people will be interested in losing the driveability that comes along with 4.10's. not knocking it either though as it is a great modification. you will require shifting into 4th however so the gain will be offset by that time to shift. it would be critical to find the right "stall"

on the bottle, your looking at around 400ft-lbs torque if you had no progressive controller so that would surely be more scary on the transmission since its more sudden. i essentially do leave on the bottle as my nitrous comes on a small shot at 2500 and ramps up. The car appreciates it.

i think the transmission would fail before the rearend. wider tires/ drag radials would help more than the gears i think since traction already is an issue.
 
yes NA in 13's... think of it this way... the 05+ mustangs run this trans... shift in to forth in the quarter and run 13's stock... I have seen them with 4:10 gears and they launch really hard... I think the LS can do it to... and the shifting in to 4th isn't that bad sense you wont be doing it right be for the finish line
 
Nothing is going to happen to the rear or half shafts on street tires. All you'll do is light up the tires with a higher stall converter. Put slicks on there and there might be an issue.

I was just talking to a friend of mine who works for a trans shop down in Florida while I was down in GA and I'll be talking to him further about this trans and what can be done with it. Probably won't go through with anything in the near future, but it'll be good to pick his brain.
 
02LincLS said:
i assume you mean without a power adder. for this type of car, i dont think many people will be interested in losing the driveability that comes along with 4.10's. not knocking it either though as it is a great modification. you will require shifting into 4th however so the gain will be offset by that time to shift. it would be critical to find the right "stall"

on the bottle, your looking at around 400ft-lbs torque if you had no progressive controller so that would surely be more scary on the transmission since its more sudden. i essentially do leave on the bottle as my nitrous comes on a small shot at 2500 and ramps up. The car appreciates it.

i think the transmission would fail before the rearend. wider tires/ drag radials would help more than the gears i think since traction already is an issue.
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Getting 4.10 gears in these cars will not hurt drivability in the slightest. Before Jason and I did his 4.10's for his LS he was toying with the idea of only going with 3.73's just to play it safe for the reasons you just stated. After I convinced him with allot of talking and a rear end gear vs few trans gear vs engine rpm table he decided to go with the 4.10's. After we installed them he loved the results obviously. After he had gotten used to it a little bit he said that he could have probably went with a 4.56 rear gear and been ok, even for highway cruising speeds. Pretty much think of a 4.10 gear in the LS equating to a 3.73 gear in an older Mustang. The biggest difference is that these 3.9 engines are just so smooth running. 4.10's are nothing when it comes to drivability and manners for these cars.

The shift time in 4th gear will be minimal at worst. Shift time becomes pretty critical in a manual car where the driver has to row the gears. Not nearly as much critical in an auto. Not saying it doesn't factor in but it doesn't weight near as heavily as shift time in a manual.
 
NYC LS8 said:
I was just talking to a friend of mine who works for a trans shop down in Florida while I was down in GA and I'll be talking to him further about this trans and what can be done with it. Probably won't go through with anything in the near future, but it'll be good to pick his brain.
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Level Ten has been offering builds for these transmissions for years now. As of two years ago they were able to hold about twice as much power than any LS has made to date on nitrous, turbo, or supercharger boost. It will hold up to ANYTHING anyone will almost ever throw at it in an LS. Unless someone gets REAL motivated and brings 25 grand to the table then I don't see anyone surpassing a power level that would be able to break anything in one of those Level Ten built 5R55S, N, W transmissions.
 
heres my input...

A 05 mustang GT runs high 13's because its got 300hp and 320lb ft with a LSD, and i beleive a solid rear axel instead of IRS. these cars obviously dont. thats a factor lol.

I also dont see what a stall convertor would do for this car. Youd have to run slicks for sure. In just my experience to the track launching at a low RPM is the way to go. too high and youll just spin on street tires. The only reason id ever consider messing with the stall in these cars is if i had aftermarket camshafts.

4.10's and slicks would also be a reason that i MIGHT mess with it. But as the car sits traction is already and issue. the highest it can launch is probably perfect for slicks.

Youd also look pretty gay with slicks on a Ls and only running 14's, especially after you warm them up. Nitrous setups (if everything holds) i think could possible see high 12's with the added traction of slicks and a 125shot


theres better investments out there for the cost of a convertor, and there proven too. Nitrous would be one of them.

I myself have always wondered if anyone has ported the TB intake and heads yet.
 
No no..THIS is gay:

2346880330100745609cJGlAr_fs.jpg



2.916 short time, and a 18.1 @ 87 ET. Needless to say, he was never very close at all. :lol:
 
sadly, ive raced worse. I raced a disel ram 2500 that put up a 22. I actually looked back to see where he was.

Those caprices have LOADS of potential though, talking down on them isnt cool when there aftermarket is 200 times the size of ours.
 
You don't say. I've only been to the Southern Super Heavyweight Shootout 4 years in a row and know first hand what can be done.
 
all i can say is the launch in these cars SUCK! I'm use to 4000RPM launches in my mach 1 on street tires and a 3.55 rear gear... And i know the 4:10's wont be an issue... just from the fact of the gear calculate i used... and have been experimenting with... I know a mustang gt has 300hp and 320 torque... my LS is rated at 280hp and 286 torque.... not that big of a difference...

Now when your talking Gen 1 that is a different story... you need to remember the Gen 2 has more power... I see this being a high 12 second car on gears, stall and the bottle no problem... Now dont tell me i wont hook on a IRS when 03 04 cobra mustangs are in the 9's on a IRS! and they have no wait over the wheels... It can BE done.. And i just might have to be the person to do it...

You say 4:10s will do nothing but spin... I don't think you have delt with cars that have had much power.. because getting 350 or 370 HP and trq to the ground is easily done.... Now if i was making 500HP that would be a different story...
 
i just realized you said these cars have trackin problems already... HAHA your crazy. half the time i cant even get mine to do a burn out on a dry road...and launchin at 2000 RPM( which is to low needs to be like 3500 or 4000) it barely chirps the tires
 
In stock form, yes, it barely chirps. To be honest, you are getting the optimal traction when you just begin to hear them chirp.

Since this is/was a thread about converters, most people who have responded have added some kind of power, be it a small or larger amounts, but that equates to traction problems since theres no extra traction to support it.

Most of these people also go to the track so they are worried about every 10th of a second they might lose by going too hard on the throttle. There is a huge difference between a Mustang and the LS. 20 hp (to 50 on a gen1) is not an ignorable difference and we also lack torque. You can't ignore a few hundred lbs either. I don't think they're a useful comparison.

4.10's even on a stock gen 1 will probably just spin, nevermind with a higher stall... unless of course you get some wide slicks or drag radials on there. Forget about it with a power added, I'm all over the place launching from 1100 RPM unless i pedal it out slowly. Limited slip and wide slicks would contain it though.

I agree with you about IRS being fine and reaching 12's with a power adder, gears, and higher stall, but bring the limited slip and wide slicks or else you'll give up a lot of time on the 60'. I only have the 100 shot (was around 85hp at the time) on an otherwise stock car and ran a 13.7. I could have shaved 2 tenths off that with a heater and more practice.
 
I know its going to need slicks thats a given... not arguing that...

I'm arguing this comment of you will look gay running 14's with slicks... 12's is pretty damn quick... maybe his first gen will stay in the 14's but once i'm done with this thing is will be in the 12s on the bottle gears and stall, daily driven!


I mean :q:q:q:q you can find lincoln mark viii third members on ebay all day long and on this forum with 4:10's already installed... then a couple hundred bucks to ills for the bracket for install and another couple hundred for a set of Gen 1 axles... shortin driveline and at the same time through in stall.... set of drag radials and i bet this car would pull a mid 13.. thats respectable to run slicks in my eye's
 
lincoln00 said:
i just realized you said these cars have trackin problems already... HAHA your crazy. half the time i cant even get mine to do a burn out on a dry road...and launchin at 2000 RPM( which is to low needs to be like 3500 or 4000) it barely chirps the tires
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You must have pretty good tires then? I can light mine up all day if I wanted to easily....and did so at the track in GA to the tune of a 2.79 60' :lol:
 
Yeah, it does look silly to run slicks and be in the 14's. I raced a fox body 5.0 with slicks and he ran mid 15 second run. I beat him by about 1.5 seconds with my all season-tired tank. Similar to NYC's picture above.
I think you should be running at least high 13's before considering slicks if you don't want to look silly. It just depends on the order you wish to do things. You wont gain much from them on a stock car (maybe a tenth or two), but they will shine on a modified car. Either way, its still a gain.
While you still may potentially smoke all seasons on a geared (but otherwise stock) car coming out of the hole (if you don't pedal it), you will still get increased torque to the ground for the remainder of the track. To me, its more useful to gear it first rather than do tires.
 
Take this car to a track, run it down the strip. launch once at 2500, and once at 1100.

tell me which works out better for you :)

also...

You say 4:10s will do nothing but spin... I don't think you have delt with cars that have had much power.. because getting 350 or 370 HP and trq to the ground is easily done.... Now if i was making 500HP that would be a different story...
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re-read my post. thats all i can say really. And about the IRS. it CAN hook, im saying a REASON that the 05 runs that high 13 stock is because of 1 the power it has, 300hp over 280. thats 20hp...can you find a 20hp bolt on? also it has displacement, and displacement gives it that 320tq figure. can you find 40extra lb ft without using a poweradder? and 2 the suspension is alot better for launching which means lower 60' times. which ultimatly means lower 1/4 mile times.

you seem to be praising your 03+ like its some sort of automotive god over the gen 1, its pissing me off a little bit. a 00-02 with intake,exhaust, and SCT tune has been proven to go 14.3's by a member on here with stock gears.
 
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