No Heat

steeda

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Sorry in advance for the wall of text. Any help or tips would be greatly appreciated.

Ok here is another "I have no heat" thread. I bought the car with some issues and here is where I am at.

2001 3.9

-I replaced the Degas Bottle, coolant crossover hose, thermostat and housing with the aluminum jag unit.
-Did a pressure test on the cooling system to see if I had any more leaks and it held pressure without a drop.
- Put the cooling system under vacuum with my Airlift Uview 550000 and filled it with coolant to spec.
- Opened the bleed and started the car and let idle with heat on max.
-Closed bleed once I got a stead stream out of it while making sure degas level was at max cold fill.
- Let the car idle for 5 minutes.
-Opened bleed again to let any trapped air out, had none so immediately closed it.
-Held engine at 2k rpm for 5 minutes but the heater only slightly warmed up.
-Returned to idle to find the air still is only slightly warm.
-Used my no contact infrared thermometer gun to verify the following:
-Thermostat had opened and was getting around the same temperature in both upper and lower radiator hoses.
- Lines going down to the Aux Pump and DCCV not clogged and coolant was getting to them.
- All 3 lines going to the heater core were nice and hot as well.
-Shut off car and ran a self diag. on the DATC. No codes, everything perfect.
-Let the car cool down and then repeated all the above to ensure I did not miss anything.
-Still have only the slightest bit of heat out of the vents.

Now here is my logic on the situation:
-Car runs and drives just fine. Does not over heat, no issues what so ever. If I had air getting into the cooling system still I would think that it would over heat. I have put close to 100 miles on it this way with no issues other than no heat.
-If I had an internal leak such as a head gasket I would see numerous signs such as coolant level dropping, over heating, pressure test would have shown a drop in pressure, possible missfire, steam out the exhaust ect.
-If the DCCV were bad I would not have hot coolant to the heater core.
-If the heater core were clogged I would not have hot coolant in the return line. So effectively I would have 2 hot lines and 1 cold.
-If I had a stuck blend door or bad actuator I should have gotten a code from the DATC when running the diag.

At this point I don't know why I do not have hot heat. My last thought is that I have a broken blend door that does not move when it should but does not show up on the self diag because the actuator is moving the rod as intended.
 
Okay, this keeps coming up.

The LS does not have any air temperature blend door*. I know that most cars do, but the LS does not. If you can't get hot or cold air, it's not a blend door. If the air is coming out in the wrong place or coming from the wrong place (fresh or recycle), then it could be a blend door problem. Temperature is controlled by the DCCV only.

Everything under the hood gets hot. Finding that the heater hoses are "hot" does not really prove that coolant is really circulating at any reasonable rate in them.

A really good possibility for your problem is the Aux pump. Check and see if yours is working.

*: The gen I LS does have a "cold air bypass door." It is used only to get maximum cooling when needed, and does not otherwise control outlet temperature. If you get any heat, it's very unlikely to be the cold air bypass door.
 
joegr you have made some great points. It seems like I need to look at my aux pump. I will update later this week when I have time to look at it. Thanks.

*edit*
If the aux pump had failed wouldn't I still get heat when driving? I am still going to check it out, just going over the situation in my head and trying to figure this out.
 
...If the aux pump had failed wouldn't I still get heat when driving? I am still going to check it out, just going over the situation in my head and trying to figure this out.

In theory, yes. However, some have reported that they didn't really get much heat then either when their aux pump failed.
 
Welp! I have heat issue on my 02.

Mines different. At 5 Degrees Celsius or colder, its Lukewarm until 15 minutes of driving.

When temperature drops to Minus -5 or colder, No heat. However, after driving 30 minutes, eventually some warmer air comes through, but nothing hot.

When I accelerate heavy, the air gets hotter. When I release the throttle, it cools back down to lukewarm. =/

EDIT: All Vents, air comes out at the same temperature (its not like its hot one side cold other). The Dual climate control works fine. AC is mint. Just Heat issue.
 
Aux pump was not working. Checked for voltage at connector and got nothing. Jumped the relay and got the pump to turn on however it sounded really weak. joegr, do you happen to know what kind of ohms is acceptable for the aux pump? After confirming the aux pump is within spec I would like to get to the root of the issue and find out why the aux pump isnt getting voltage. Do you happen to have a schematic of the circuit by chance? I really didn't have time to dig any deeper so it could be something simple such as a bad relay however I would just like to be prepared for when I do have time to really get this figured out. Thanks!
 
Well here is where I am at. After finding out my aux pump was not getting voltage because of no ground to the relay to complete the circuit I have jumped the relay to where it energizes when the ignition is on. Now that I have power and ground to my aux pump I determined it was failing intermittently by applying voltage and ground. Sometimes it would work, but very faintly, other times it would not work at all. Pulled the aux pump and decided to check my DCCV while it was in easy access. Checked for voltage and ground at the connector and it was good. Then I applied voltage to pin 2 and then ground to pins 1 and 3 respectively to energize the actuators. I did not hear anything. Went ahead and pulled it off and tested it again on the bench to ensure it was in fact bad. Tested bad again so I went and picked up a new DCCV and an aux pump. Installed both and bled the system. Everything is working great including my heat. With that said for now I am satisfied with my progress so far.

I still need to figure out why my relay is not getting ground to complete the circuit for my aux pump however. I am not sure if it running the entire time the ignition is on will cause excessive wear and possibly premature failure. I checked out the gen II link you provided joegr, and it may be close but I have a feeling a few steps might be different between gen I and II. When you get the time, or anyone else for that matter, would it be possible to get the schemtic and the proper troubleshooting flow chart? Thanks for all the help so far.
 
See if this helps...

I4.jpg


I5.jpg


I7.jpg


I9.jpg


I11.jpg


W1.jpg


W2.jpg
 
Update: It appears my DATC has failed. Everything but the control to the aux pump works fine. I confirmed this when I came to step I10 by jumping C228b pin 18 (BN/BU) to C228a pin 2 (BK) and it energized the relay and I heard my aux pump run. I will update this again when I get my new DATC to solidify my findings. A big thanks to joegr for all the help. Couldn't have done the diag without ya.
 
Update: I put in my new DATC tonight and it did not solve my issue. I must have missed something somewhere or my new DATC is bad also, but I think that is unlikely.
 
Update: Well I went through the diag yet again and came up with the same conclusion... bad DATC. Either I am missing something or my new DATC really is bad despite being highly unlikely.
 
Update: Well I went through the diag yet again and came up with the same conclusion... bad DATC. Either I am missing something or my new DATC really is bad despite being highly unlikely.

Is the "new" unit new or used?
 
Is the "new" unit new or used?

Used from the local pick-a-part. I see where you are going with that, and I agree it is possible I got another bad DATC, however I dont think they have a high failure rate and the odds of me getting another with the exact same issue is slim.
 
Used from the local pick-a-part. I see where you are going with that, and I agree it is possible I got another bad DATC, however I dont think they have a high failure rate and the odds of me getting another with the exact same issue is slim.

It may not have been bad when it arrived, but who knows how long it sat out in the elements. That could kill a previously good part. Electronics don't like being exposed to the weather.....
 
It may not have been bad when it arrived, but who knows how long it sat out in the elements. That could kill a previously good part. Electronics don't like being exposed to the weather.....

The car I pulled it from had just gotten there and had all the glass and doors so no exposure to weather. The good news is that the DATC I bought has a 14 day exchange policy so I am going to make the trip back and exchange it for another. Well I hope so at least. Not sure if they even have any other LS's. I guess I will have to see.
 
I'd check the pins of C228a and C228b to make sure they aren't damaged. If the ends of your jumper wire were too large, the sockets in the connectors may have been spread out enough that they no longer connect to the pins from the DATC.
 
I'd check the pins of C228a and C228b to make sure they aren't damaged. If the ends of your jumper wire were too large, the sockets in the connectors may have been spread out enough that they no longer connect to the pins from the DATC.

I used back probes that have the alligator clips attached to them. I will pull it apart again and take a look again though.
 

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