Newbie LS Shopping - General Questions

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TKde0

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I've been able to find some pretty good information here regarding changes within the model and when they occurred. I had a few more questions though before I commit to an LS. If anyone could help me out it would be greatly appreciated.

What are the common problems with the LS and when do they typically occur? Would it be ill-advised to buy a 2004 LS with 82k miles? Most of the LSs available in my area are around 45-55k miles. How long could I reasonably expect to be trouble free if I were to buy one of those?

Is there really that big of a difference between a 1st generation LS and a 2nd generation LS? I've seen all the changes that were made and I especially like the revised engine with more power. I know there were a lot more changes that were made, but right now the 2001s and 2002s are about $6k cheaper. I don't want to get stuck regretting my purchase, so if it's a major change for the better, I'll stick to 2nd generation.

I drive cars very very hard. Any car that I've owned for more than 6 months has needed at least one transmission replacement. My current Crown Vic that I bought as a temp car has a transmission that's on it's way out. It just started slipping on my last long trip. I did the last transmission replacement myself on my Grand Marquis since it was the third replacement I had to do in the three years I'd owned it. How are the transmissions in the LS? What about the engine? I may be spoiled coming from a 4.6L, but I've had pretty good luck with the engines on my previous cars.

Are there any expensive common things that break on the LS? When I was considering a Mark VIII, I got a little scared by the common breaking points like the power steering wheel, the rear fluorescent brake light, and of course the air suspension. All of those were pretty expensive fixes. Is there anything like that on the LS that I should be worried about and check when looking one over? Is there anything common that I should check when test driving an LS?

What are the main selling points of the LS? I've yet to drive one. I've heard they have pretty good handling. I'm also possibly considering a Mercury Marauder, but I'm probably leaning more towards the LS. The LS seems more like a total package, luxury, speed, handling, looks, etc. What are the main reasons you guys bought your LS? It will probably be a big change for me as I've never owned anything but pre-87 GM boat cars and the Ford panther platform cars (Crown Vic, Grand Marquis).

Any input would be appreciated. Thanks.
 
I drive cars very very hard. Any car that I've owned for more than 6 months has needed at least one transmission replacement. My current Crown Vic that I bought as a temp car has a transmission that's on it's way out. It just started slipping on my last long trip. I did the last transmission replacement myself on my Grand Marquis since it was the third replacement I had to do in the three years I'd owned it. How are the transmissions in the LS? What about the engine? I may be spoiled coming from a 4.6L, but I've had pretty good luck with the engines on my previous cars.
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I would say, don't buy an LS. Also you are comparing the Marauder and an LS.... two totally diff. machines. I'd say you should get the Marauder, speed, comfort, modular engine.
 
I wish I had a nickel for every time someone asked the questions in your post. They've all been asked before countless times. The answers can be found in many, many threads here. Do a search.
 
Are you doing reverse to lows?? Burning teardrops?? Three transmissions in three years?? Are they junkyard trannies?If they are new rebuilt transmissions, you don't drive hard, you abuse them. I would suggest a proffessional rebuild with a drag pack (kevlar bands & clutches, manual valve body...) Artt carr, Level Ten....
 
Can anybody answer my questions or at least point me in the right direction for a search? I did search, most threads are specific problems. I had general questions.
 
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=31317
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=31226
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=30973
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=20651

BTW - we all get copied on your initial response:
Thanks for replying to me telling me to search, that was very helpful. I did say right at the beginning of my post that I did answer a lot of my own questions with the search function. Not even the 'Similar Threads' at the bottom of the page turn up anything relevant to my questions. I spent about two hours answering my questions with the search last night. I can't find any threads with general answers, most of the threads I found were specific problems. Those are useful if I do buy an LS and have a specific problem, but they tell me nothing about the general information I was looking for.
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If you drive your car hard, dont buy an LS unless you are willing to pay.

Pay for your coils
Pay for your valve cover gaskets
Pay for your tranny (only tranny problems I see on the LS come from the guys that race their car and drive it hard.
Pay for your clockspring
Pay for you coolant reservoir
Pay for your door handles and latches
Pay for your fan pumps
Pay for your thermostat

Most of these are common LS issues. NOT necessarily due to driving hard, except for the transmission. Just my experience from previous post. I have fixed all of the above except for the tranny and fan pump. If you can do it yourself or under warranty you will save alot of money. Go with 03+ , seem to have less problems, but this is relative to miles.
 
I own a 2004 LSV8. I previously owned a 1996 Chevy Impala SS. The Marauder was built to be the Impala SS beater. The Marauder didn't quite measure up to those expectations but the members of the SS list did keep an eye on it and from those opinions and various magazine readings it sounded like the Marauder is a more capable car than the SS for daily driving in comfort with reasonable performance. The SS had better buttometer appeal and a certain tough guy style. So I will base my comments on the assumption that the Marauder is similar in appeal to the SS but a bit more luxurious.

The LS is probably a better handling car than the SS, and is a better "freeway flyer". The SS had better seat of the pants feel off the line and I think in a quarter mile drag with equal drivers may have a slight edge, but top end performance is where the LS should start to take over although max speed I think is similar. The Marauder has a speed limiter and severe drive shaft vibrations so speed maxes about 125mph so if this is an issue for you...

The SS and Marauder had engines that were essentially souped up everyday common engines. So parts were a lot cheaper than the LS V8. The reliability of the 4.6 I believe is better than the LS. In my opinion being bigger cars and less exotic, the SS for sure and probably the Marauder are much easier to service than the LS. I have had far more repairs in less than 50K on the LS than my SS did by 120K.

The thing I miss most about my SS is that it was a lot more comfortable and roomy for a guy 6'4", ditto backseat passengers. The LS feels like a large Honda to me. Sad to say I think it also looks like a large Honda. I think the Marauder would be more comfortable than the LS. The SS and Marauder have more of a panache, but not everyone will like it, definitely not Euro.

If I was to do it again I would first try to replace my SS(mine was totalled) or buy a "new" Marauder. The LS has disappointed me with reliability and comfort. The LS also isn't much of a stop light bandit type car either, there are a lot of imports that would dust us including some rather vanilla rice burners. Probably also true for the SS/Marauder, but got more style. If freeway buzzing past 100 is your thing then the LS is probably better than the SS and definitely better than the Marauder. Not many places you can do that without being noticed.

The pluses in the LS favor are that it is available way below list, used ones depreciate like rocks and insurance is reasonable. They are listed I think in the top 10 of safe vehicles and I think in their size class were #1 when I bought mine. If you are more into a Euro style and won't buy Euro, the LS was designed for that market.

Of course my views are tainted by reliability issues I have had, but many of the guys have not had problems and complaints are what gets printed. The warranty is pretty good on the LS, but interestingly they dropped a year or 2 off the pre 2004 warranty. Wonder if Ford was having too many claims?

Just my opinions,

Jim Henderson
 
Thanks Jim, that was an awesome comparison and exactly what I was looking for. You've helped my decision greatly and I think I'll take your advice and look for a Marauder. I was a little worried about how comfortable I'd be in the LS. I'm definitely looking for comfort and a little bit more room being 6'3" also. I'm pretty sure you're right about the Marauder being faster than the LS. I've seen numerous stock Marauders run in the low 14s. I see people on here surprised by the LS making it to 14.5 with mods. Thanks for helping me out with the comparison.

Thanks for the list decibels, that's pretty extensive and I appreciate your input.

Thanks for the list of threads Quik LS, that was useful information. And I'm glad you got copied in on my original response. I regretted changing it after I left for work.
 
If you beat the piss out of your cars then i would stay away from the LS. I dont think the LS responds well to harsh driving. I am somewhat surprised at how small the interior is on the LS. I am 6'4" and the back of the drivers seat is about 3-4 inchs from the backseat. No human could possibly sit back there. The passenger seat i keep alittle farther forward for my son to get in and out of the backseat but i still cant sit behind the passenger. The trunk space isnt all that. My recent vacation i rented an Explorer because the LS was too small for our luggage. The performance isnt that great in the LS, i'd think with the same amount of money it would take to get an LS to hit an acceptable 1/4 mile time you could make a monster out of the Maurader. Back to your question, i wouldnt recommend a '04 LS with 82k miles.
 
"I'm pretty sure you're right about the Marauder being faster than the LS."

I didn't say that. Experience several years ago when the Marauder first came out and car magazine articles said the Marauder was surprisingly slower and less quick(two different things) than the Impala, but it had better handling and cushyer ride. The Marauder on paper had more horse power but I think torque was marginal for such a big car. So the Impala was usually quicker(o-60, 1/4 etc) in stock form and because of the speed limiter on the Marauder top speed was moot so it was not "fast".

For comparison the SS in stock form was about 15 sec in the quarter and topped out at 142 in reasonable time and maybe 158 with lots of time and space. The Marauder did something like 15.2 or so and was limited at 125. I think the LS is slightly quicker than the SS at just a tick under the SS quarter and I think the LS gets over 150 sooner. My LS really wakes up after about 70mph.

But, maybe Ford took care of the quick and fast issues of the Marauder in the 1 or 2 years they continued making them.

I think with the 4.6 engine the Marauder has the potential for much better performance than an LS and there are lots of aftermarket parts for the 4.6, think Mustang engine mods. THe Marauder is a somewhat heavy car so torque is what you want, but surprisingly the LS is pretty heavy too, I think just 400#'s less than an SS and maybe the Marauder, so the LS really needs more torque in my opinion, which we ain't going to get(not easily) with the pipsqueek V8 we have.

I would probably take a Marauder over an LS if I had the choice today. I am somewhat dumbfounded that I didn't think of it back when I was shopping, duh.

One other thought, the LS will probably never be a "classic". The Impala SS already is classic and the price is going up. I think the Marauder will be in the same class as the SS as far as future value. The Maruader sales never took off, but it is somewhat rare and has similar tough guy credentials and style etc.

Jim Henderson
 
I'll tell you a different way you could go and probably the cheapest is to go pick up a newer Crown Vic. Sport for around which will give you essentially the same car as a Maruader for about $10k less. With that saved money you could pocket $5k and use the other $5k for performance upgrades. I'm sure $5K on that car could surpass any stock Marauder or LS for that matter. You've had those style of cars before, i'd stick with them, they're one of the safest cars around and has tons of abilities. The LS has none, and the Maruader is nice but pretty $$$ for a 2003 vehicle. They're all in the $18k range around me.
 
Yeah a Crown Vic and Mercury Marquis(?), both depreciate like rocks, are essentially the same platform as the Marauder and you can hop it up with the money you save. But like the old Impala SS, the combination package was such a good deal that many people opted to pay the premium for the SS and I assume the Marauder. Plus there are some things on both that you CANNOT buy aftermarket and add on, unless you want to pay too much money. There were a lot of threads on the Impala list about how you could spot a fake Impala, a big clue was dash board shape. I bet the Marauder list has similar discussions.

Just guessing... the Marauder probably has special brakes, very different interior, higher performance parts, maybe even police service parts, special suspension etc. The SS certainly did have a lot of parts not easily available on the Caprice it was based on.

For driving around on a budget a crown vic isn't a bad choice. A Maraduer would be more fun and might be worth something in the long run.

My SS when it was totalled at 120K miles Blue Booked at something like $14K-$15K for the SoCal market. Not bad for an 8 year old car that cost $25K new in 96, and the Blue Book and Edmunds price was actually up a lot from 2-3 years previously. I would expect the Marauder to have a price dip and then climb in a similar way, if it hasn't already.

I like Big fast bad looking cars if you haven't figured it out yet.

Jim Henderson
 
Back when i bought my first LS i had three cars with the third being a '89 Buick. I decided to sell the Buick and was about to use the money to buy a used '03 Crown Vic P71. Thought it would make a fun and safe third car which i would use as a daily driver. Could have done some cool things to the engine. Then some common sense kicked in and made me realize i didnt need a third vehicle which would just be a money trap. But i still like that size vehicle especially if it can be made decently powerful. Recently i was given a new '07 Ford five hundred and was amazed at how much more room there was inside. With the drivers seat all the way back i could still sit behind it and be comfortable, thats not even close to possible in the LS. The engine and tranny sucked but the interior seemed more roomy. The crown vic/marauder goes even one step further with extra room.
 
I've thought about the Crown Vic Sport route. But the differences wouldn't be made up with the same money it would take to buy a Marauder. The base and mid model Crown Vics and Grand Marquis decpreciate very fast, but the Sport stays expensive. The sport is basically full loaded with a few extras like 17" 5-spoke wheels and a console shifter instead of a column shifter. There's really no difference performance-wise between the regular and sport, unless the regular has single exhaust instead of dual. The Crown Vic has a SOHC 4.6L with 239 hp and 287 ft lbs of torque. The Marauder has a DOHC 4.6L with 302 hp and 318 ft lbs of torque. There's a company that makes a bolt-on supercharger kit for the Crown Vic that gets the power up to about where the Marauder is. That kit costs about $6k. That would make it more expensive than the Marauder and I still would only have a Crown Vic with lessened longevity. I like the Crown Vic Sport a lot, it's pretty similar to the Marauder, but it just doesn't have that style. Plus, there's a bolt-on supercharger kit for the Marauder too from a different company that adds almost 100 hp... it also costs about $6k.

Some car magazines may have tested a Marauder at 15.2 1/4 mile, but I think that is definitely off. I've been to meets with a group of panther car owners and saw numerous Marauders make passes in the mid 14s. One stock Marauder was doing 14.4s with a 400lb man driving it. Most were doing around 14.5-14.7, stock. There's a small amount of tolerance in the engines that makes performance across the model hard to measure by testing just one car. I don't think 15.2 is normal for any of them though. I've never seen one run at 15.2 unless the driver doesn't know how to drag race a large automatic car.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/timeslips.php
 
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