LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Ok, if there's a cooling system leak such as the degas bottle, would the system stay in operating temp when parked and idling but climb to overheating real quick when starting to drive it?
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- Thread starter LunaEros
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LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Well apparently that happened with mine. He got the electric fan in but he only tested it idling. When I got there I took it for a test drive and the temp shot up again just like before when I brought it to him. Though this time I guess from replacing some of the plastic pieces I guess it made the degas leak bad, I didn't see any leaks before but when I got back from test driving it looks like the degas is leaking quite a bit. I have a new degas coming in today and hope the hell it finally stops the overheating.
Thanks, Joe.
SultanGris
Dedicated LVC Member
I can confirm Joe is correct, I did my cooling system one leaking part at a time and ended up doing them all. Plastic crap all fails pretty much at the same time, I discovered first hand fixing one just makes the next one leak.
Joe knows these cars better than anyone, I've seen tons of his posts and he is almost never wrong, out of 5,000 posts he might be wrong once, if he says it, believe it.
Joe knows these cars better than anyone, I've seen tons of his posts and he is almost never wrong, out of 5,000 posts he might be wrong once, if he says it, believe it.
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LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Yeah, I know Joe's rep. I've been on here a long time.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Well they can't figure out what's wrong so I got it towed home today. I haven't had a chance to look at it extensively yet but it does seem like it only gets to operating temperature if idling in park but the overheating seems to only happen when driving it. Assuming the cooling system isn't the issue, what else could cause that?
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
The cooling system is the only possibility.
The engine overheats because coolant isn't circulating (at all, or fast enough) through the engine cooling passages and the radiator.
Why isn't it circulating?
Failed water pump, pretty rare but it could happen.
Failed thermostat, less rare.
Clogged radiator, pretty rare unless you used stop leak sometime.
Clogged engine cooling passages, very rare, unless stop leak was used.
Airlocked coolant loop due to air in the cooling system, very common with the LS due to micro-cracks in the plastics.
Airlocked coolant loop due to steam, possible if the system isn't pressurizing and the anti-freeze mix is wrong or missing.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Ok. One more thing. Out of those which do you think would cause this.
When I took it for a test drive last week when he thought it was fixed, when I got into the car and started it up it was at 172°. I backed out and drove down the road. The temp started climbing fast. Roughly a degree or two every second or so. I went down the road maybe a ¼ mile turned around and came back and pulled into the shops yard. Total of about a ½ mile and the temp was at 228°. When I turned around and came back I turned on the heat full blast since the temp was climbing so fast but it didn't bring the temp down after he put the fan and the couple of plastic pieces in. When I first got this problem turning on the heat would bring it down. Not completely but it helped quite a bit. Also when the problem first showed up with the temp climbing so fast on the way home from work one night it seemed to happen all of a sudden like something broke.
You still think it's plastic pieces or could one of the other things you mention make it act like this?
When I took it for a test drive last week when he thought it was fixed, when I got into the car and started it up it was at 172°. I backed out and drove down the road. The temp started climbing fast. Roughly a degree or two every second or so. I went down the road maybe a ¼ mile turned around and came back and pulled into the shops yard. Total of about a ½ mile and the temp was at 228°. When I turned around and came back I turned on the heat full blast since the temp was climbing so fast but it didn't bring the temp down after he put the fan and the couple of plastic pieces in. When I first got this problem turning on the heat would bring it down. Not completely but it helped quite a bit. Also when the problem first showed up with the temp climbing so fast on the way home from work one night it seemed to happen all of a sudden like something broke.
You still think it's plastic pieces or could one of the other things you mention make it act like this?
SultanGris
Dedicated LVC Member
Like he said you have to replace all pieces at same time, you fix one and the next one breaks under the pressure. I fixed my cooling system for 2 months one piece at a time. These cars run hot anyway it seems to me. I was monitoring temps and it was always around or over 220 but the overheat light never came on cause I hotwired my fan to always run full speed and used the heat like you to bring it down. Honestly I never did get mine fixed satisfactorily, I think that's way too hot for normal operating temp but I don't know for sure. Never had any other vehicle run that hot. I was suspecting because the guy before me used stop leak, not sure if these cars are supposed to run that hot or not, but then my engine blew due to other reasons and I've been waiting like 2 years for my mechanic to put another one in. Just replace every plastic crap part or you'll never get it fixed
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
The mechanic most likely didn't bleed the system properly... Or didn't replace all the defective parts.
The main culprit is the gooseneck pipe that comes off the back of the crossover assembly, (above the water pump). The large O-ring leaks, and the coolant runs across the top of the block and down on to the ground.
The main culprit is the gooseneck pipe that comes off the back of the crossover assembly, (above the water pump). The large O-ring leaks, and the coolant runs across the top of the block and down on to the ground.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
I get that but first I need to know what and where each of these damn pieces are. But that's irrelevant to my question to Joe on which possible issue my specific problem of rapid temp rise only when in gear driving might be. I'm going to replace all the plastic anyway as soon as I find all of them and am able to source them but it seems odd to me that it would be just plastic pieces since there seems to be no leak left to be found and I don't understand how air in the system could make it only overheat when in gear driving and not when idling in park. I would think if air in it is causing problems it would do it all the time.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
You talking about the engine fill pipe that has the thermostat housing attached to it too, Sport? Because I replaced that whole assembly already with the aluminum Jag setup.
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
I think he was thinking of the gen 2 cooling system. Anyway, like I said it could be any of the things I listed, and airlocked is the most often reason.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Ok. There isn't some kind of diagram anywhere that shows all the plastic parts in the system on a gen 1 so I can hunt down all the rest I'll need, is there? Because I have no idea where all the rest are or if I can even get to them myself. I know I'll never find them all by just looking under the hood since hoses are going all over every which way under these cars.
milehighmikey
Dedicated LVC Member
How is this engine for bleeding air from the upper bleed port? Does it act normally and generate good stream flow when opened up to bleed? Reason I ask is that when my engine went south on my V6, the problem ended up being the impeller had fallen off the water pump, where you would not see it. In the case of a V6, this is pretty bad. In the case of a V8, I would think that the auxiliary water pump could possibly manage the circulation at idle, but not at speed. In my case, the bleed port was quite unproductive in this situation of having zero water pump circulation. Only way to get any flow was to rev to 2-3k.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
Yes Luna, Joe is correct. I was thinking of the Gen 2 system.
However... the degas bottle is known to get cracks, and suck air into the cooling system. It will do the same when the system pressurizes.
The air bleed is the critical part in this, and if the degas bottle is cracked, you are fighting a losing battle.
My Gen 2 has 10 years on the water pump. So far the weep hole is still dry, but the pipe that goes from the back of the head crossover to the block has the O-ring leaking. (again Gen 2)
If you really want to see what is going on... get some cooling system dye and a black light. The dye will glow under the black light
On top of that there were issues with the early water pumps. I THINK it was only the V8.
However... the degas bottle is known to get cracks, and suck air into the cooling system. It will do the same when the system pressurizes.
The air bleed is the critical part in this, and if the degas bottle is cracked, you are fighting a losing battle.
My Gen 2 has 10 years on the water pump. So far the weep hole is still dry, but the pipe that goes from the back of the head crossover to the block has the O-ring leaking. (again Gen 2)
If you really want to see what is going on... get some cooling system dye and a black light. The dye will glow under the black light
On top of that there were issues with the early water pumps. I THINK it was only the V8.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Ok, Joe or Sport, I got a cooling system pressure tester. It doesn't have Lincolns listed as a make it works on but it did have a cap that seems to fit. I wasn't able to get the pressure gauge on the hand pump to really move but it did put some pressure in the system because I noticed coolant coming out of the threads from the top of the aluminum Jaguar thermostat housing neck So he must've not put it on right or screwed up the o-ring gasket or something. Coolant was leaking down it to where it mounts to the block. I also noticed coolant leaking on to the ground from the back side of the engine. If coolant is leaking enough from the thermostat housing setup can it flow to the back of the engine over the top of it?
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
Yes, it can. I know that by experience.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
That makes me feel a bit better. Then maybe that's where that leak from the back is coming from.
I also noticed he used green coolant. If I remember correctly when I got coolant for the LS when I had the water pump changed earlier this year, the coolant was orange.
Is the coolant supposed to be orange or is the color more of a brand thing?
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
Gold coolant is required for the LS.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
The auto parts stores used to carry the full strength coolant, and I would go buy a gallon of distilled water to make my own 50/50.
Much more economical. But the parts stores around me now only carry the pre-made 50/50 mix.
That's so the manufacturer and parts store can make more profit.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
A gallon of distilled water only costs a dollar... so you can make 2 gallons of pre mix from the concentrate.
Of course... you need to have a spare rinsed coolant jug to make the pre mix yourself.
Of course... you need to have a spare rinsed coolant jug to make the pre mix yourself.
LunaEros
Well-Known LVC Member
Zerex G05. Ok. Thanks, Sport.
04_Sport_LS
Dedicated LVC Member
You will probably want to get the green crap out of the system first, as much as possible. Flush with water.
To get the proper mix, you will probably need to buy some "test strips" instead of using a standard hygrometer.
The tester on the right will not give an accurate reading on the G05 coolant.
To get the proper mix, you will probably need to buy some "test strips" instead of using a standard hygrometer.
The tester on the right will not give an accurate reading on the G05 coolant.