Misfire at idle? Transmission fluid and brake fluid questions

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Diplomat 1

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If anyone remembers I had a ignition coil d code on my 2003 Lincoln ls 3.9 and I checked wires seemed like continuity was good. So I sent pcm to find out that my pcm was good(no misfires at bench test) but they fixed my transmission problem. Anyway I install the pcm along with all new motorcraft spark plugs and replaced the remaining 3 could that haven't been replaced with motor craft coils. Now all the coils are motorcraft. I fire it up and it runs smooth but at idle I still visibly see a misfire. This is actually my dad car and he has been putting regular gas in the car for the longest and I know that isn't right. Could that cause the misfire at idle? I took it for a quick test drive and it seems like the throttle response is good and it actually pulls like it hasn't in years but when in drive and car is stopped when sitting inside the car it doesn't seem like car has a misfire I can't feel it but when in park i can feel the vibration. Timing issue? Could I possibly have messed up my head in some way since I left the car running so long (around 2 years) with misfires and maybe I have low compression? Is that possible ? I know I have a lot of questions please be patient with me thanks.

Other problems I have is I went to go check transmission fluid and I believe I did something wrong. Everything online says to remove the middle screw of the drain plug to check for fluid level. If fluid comes out its good but I did this and about a quart of fluid came out and I believe that's wrong. The way I used to fill it was with car running at idle warmed i filled it thru the fill plug fracking toward the rear of the car and while car was leveled I filled it until I fluid came back out. Is that correct? I feel like since I lost the fluid my car now bangs into from park to reverse and vise Versa. What is the proper way to check for transmission level?

Lastly when I was doin my control arms I took the bottom brake fluid sensor off ( looks like a oil pressure sensor) to get to the arm bolts. Anyway when I first started it pedal would go to the floor and I figured I got air in the system. My question is what is the proper way to bleed the brakes on my car? Thanks so much for any help I know it's a lot
 
Also the idle misfire is worse when cold (first start) but gets better as it warms up. I don't know if thy helps but I need help thanks
 
On the misfire issue, many threads address this. All COPs (coils) and all plugs must be replaced at the same time. Premium is supposed to be used, since it is required I assume this means the car has no fuel map allowing the use of lower octane fuel like modern fuel injected vehicles have. This means too low on the octane will cause detonation, which will do damage. Prolonged misfires will destroy the cats on this car.

On the transmission, you did the procedure correct, you do pull the middle bolt from the drain plug and let fluid drain out until it comes out in spurts. What I didn't see is the car has to be level, running and warm when you do this. If the car wasn't level, running and warm, you let too much fluid out.

On the brake bleeding, you'll need other input. I know how I'd do it on anything else, but the LS seems to do a lot of things differently than other cars so someone else can address that for you.

Good luck.
 
Thank you very much for the input. My main concern is I didn't lose compression in any cylinder. I have had misfires for a long time but I finally finished all 8 coils. How can I check the timing? The misfire only happens at idle that's the issue that's what I'm trying to figure out if anyone can give me pointers for that would be great. I'm glad the tranny fluid I was doin it right. I also feel like there is a special way to flush the brakes maybe a bleeder on the abs pump? I do it the usual way go from RR to LR to RF to LF. Is that all that need to be bleeded? Thanks again
 
So I been driving the car and the codes I get is P0133 and P0420. It's still misfiring at idle but when I give it gas it moves. I don't know what else I can do. Also any ideas on how to diag those codes now? Thanks


Edit: I was thinking maybe I have a vacuum leak and that's causing the misfire at idle? And is causing my p0133? I hope that's it. I changed my intake manifold gasket couple months ago so I don't think that could be it. Any tips on how to check for a vacuum leak?
 
How are you determining that you have a misfire at idle?
Use propane (not lit) to check for vacuum leaks.
 
Thanks for response. When I sit in the car I can feel the misfire and I can see the engine misfire looking at the motor. It shakes just like a misfire. Also I am not familiar with the propane method can u please explain? Thanks
 
Diplomat 1 said:
Thanks for response. When I sit in the car I can feel the misfire and I can see the engine misfire looking at the motor. It shakes just like a misfire. Also I am not familiar with the propane method can u please explain? Thanks
Click to expand...

Cheap gas will cause roughness at idle. Low octane (87) will exasperate the problem.
 
Not all roughness and engine shaking is due to misfire. I would bet that this is probably not misfire, at least not the way the LS usually does it.
Use an unlit propane torch (like plumbers use). Get it really close to where you think there might be a leak (with the engine running). If there is, some propane will get sucked in and you will hear a change in the engine.
 
Thanks for both responses. I am gonna tell him to start using 93 only and see if there is a difference. I will post a video on how the engine runs when idle in park maybe if you see it you will be able to tell a difference. Also the code p0133 I was reading online and it could be due to a vacuum leak. I thought maybe because the engine is running rough at idle the vacuum leak is causing both problems. Is that a possibility? I am gonna get a video and try to locate a vacuum leak. Wish me luck. Thanks
 
Yes. Small vacuum leaks can cause poor idle, but not have much, if any, detriment to cruise.
How about a picture of this "bottom brake fluid sensor" that you R&R'd.
 
This is the sensor I was talking about

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=2065874&cc=1416697&jnid=452&jpid=0

It was dripping fluid out so I figure I got air in system and need to bleed it out. I also got a video of the motor vibration but to be honest in the video it doesn't show any vibration but in person you can see it vibrate.

http://youtu.be/jtGM3YXtDyM

I'm thinking its a vacuum leak. I also hear a whistle noise coming from around the intake manifold. Is that normal? I didn't have a propane torch but I had carb cleaner and sprayed that hoping to find the leak but no luck. I don't know what to do about this I know for a fact something is wrong just can't find it. Thanks
 
You should not have removed that...
You will probably have to bench bleed the master cylinder now and then you will need the dealer tool to bleed the ABS. (Bleeding is normal and doesn't need all when you are just working on the calipers. I think it's another ball game if you open the system before the ABS and up at the master cylinder like that.)
 
So it's not just me but u guys hear the whistle too? I've heard from a tech that some plastic manifolds make a whistle noise and its normal But if your ls don't do it then neither should mine. I guess I will have to find a smoke machine to find the leak cause the carb method didn't work. Does it look/sound like a vacuum leak to you guys? Will the propane method work better? Also for the sensor I bleed the brakes a little and it did make a difference I feel like if there is a certain way to bleed this it will work but if not I will keep bleed the old fashion way and hope it works. Thanks guys
 
A plastic manifold making a whistling sound is a leaking manifold, and is never normal. I would imagine they just don't want to try and find a small vacuum leak because it's a pain to do and customers don't like paying hundreds to fix a vacuum leak. The LS uses hard plastic lines that can split, and you won't see it. For people who can hear, which doesn't include me, you can use a 2-3 foot section of heater hose as a stethoscope to find where the whistling is loudest. What the propane method does is the vacuum leak will suck in some propane when the UNLIT torch passes over the leak. This will cause the idle to increase a bit. It won't be a lot, but it will be enough to notice.

On bleeding ABS systems, the reason it is difficult is because air will get into the ABS system, and the bleed will pass it by. The ABS module on all cars except perhaps the LS uses servos to very quickly pump the brakes, in the more complex systems it can pump individual calipers which is how many traction control systems operate. For all I know the LS uses one servo to put max pressure on the system then uses the servos to relieve pressure. What you have to do is command the ABS system to go into bleed mode (I'm just calling it bleed mode, no idea what Ford or anyone else calls it), which will force the valves to open in a way that it makes a single continuous path through the ABS module. In bleed mode, you can bleed the entire ABS system and get the air out of the ABS unit. It's a pain, but some people actually need ABS to keep control of their cars when the crap hits the fan. Personally I've always found it to be an annoyance but hey, you can't get a car without that garbage anymore. Unfortunately, if you don't have a tool that can command bleed mode, you have to take it into a mechanic who has the tool to bleed it properly.
 
My LS has had that whistle for years. Luckily with the cover and the hood closed, you can't really hear it.
 
Thanks telco I will try the vacuum hose trick. Is there any vacuum hoses behind the manifold next to the firewall that might be causing the leak? Any known places I should look for? I am hoping I can find the whistle noise and that that is causing the vibration and codes on my car. thanks
 
I try not to open the hood on my Lincoln any more than I have to, so I can't say off the top of my head on that. However, as old as the cars are now any of them are suspect. Plastic vacuum lines simply deteriorate over time. If you want a more permanent solution you can pick up some metal line from the parts store of the same diameter and bend it to fit, but really just replacing it with plastic would be fine as it will last another 10 years.
 
The vacuum hose to the brake booster comes from a port on the back of the intake manifold.
 
Telco said:
I try not to open the hood on my Lincoln any more than I have to, so I can't say off the top of my head on that. However, as old as the cars are now any of them are suspect. Plastic vacuum lines simply deteriorate over time. If you want a more permanent solution you can pick up some metal line from the parts store of the same diameter and bend it to fit, but really just replacing it with plastic would be fine as it will last another 10 years.
Click to expand...

I just used the appropriate sized rubber vacuum line and some connectors (for the EGR lines). Worked like a champ!
 
LS4me said:
I just used the appropriate sized rubber vacuum line and some connectors (for the EGR lines). Worked like a champ!
Click to expand...

The rubber lines aren't permanent either. The oil fumes and heat degrade them over time. They may still look okay, but they start leaking. Of course, it takes a long time for this to happen, but probably not as long as it will take for Telco's metal lines to rust through.
 
Thanks for responses. I am not getting misfire codes anymore which is good but the codes p0133 and p0420. Could it be possible the o2 sensor went bad? Any way to diagnose it correctly? The engine still vibrates at idle and I cannot fine a vacuum Leak which I don't even exists. I don't get want " slow response" means on a o2 sensor. Any insight? Thanks
 
I still think your issue is coil(s). They will marginally fail without producing misfire codes. I myself am chasing misfires, I finally got it to throw a code when it was about 20F one morning and cylinder 7 misfire came up. Replaced that one and it is worlds better. Still a very slight vibration/miss at idle in the mornings, so I am sure another coil is slowly dying. It appears I got a bad batch of Motorcraft coils from RockAuto in the spring of 2015.

Going to chase the remaining misfire this weekend.
 
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