1. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Hello to everybody. Although I am quite new to this forum, (I didn't know it existed until Ken at LSK mentioned it to me), I do have some degree of experience. I work out of Ben's Place-(bensplace.us) and have helped with some of his more exotic projects.

    I am the present holder of two Maxton Land Speed records with my '02 LS with a best of 140.106 in E/FCC. Since the car had 109 K miles on it when I set both records in September, I am going to do a thorough go-through this winter in preparation for next spring. I am, at present, doing a complete tear-down of the four litre Jag engine that will replace the 3.9. I will be using custom forged pistons and aluminum rods to take the place of cast pistons and powdered-metal rods. Exact dimensions remain to be worked out---I don't know at this point how much I'll have to open up the cylinders to remove wear, and I want to move the ring pack down on the pistons due to the extra loading of both turbo boost and 'spray'. The rods will then be sized to fit the open space.

    I intend to keep the car, as now, as my daily driver. The roll cage was designed with this in mind and I'll be keeping the concept firmly in front of me as I remove the engine computer and replace it with one that will tell both engine and trans exactly what to do. Then, with the help of some of the very talented people to be found in the Detroit area, I'll go back and try to integrate everything else. Some things may have to be done away with or seriously modified. It should be fun.

    I'll be happy to make entries here from time to time to keep anyone interested abreast of what's happening. If you have questions, you can either reach me here or through the email address---ben@bensplace.us. I'll post pictures as soon as I figure out how to do it here.

    KenS from Ben's Place
     
  2. NYC LS8

    NYC LS8 Dedicated LVC Member

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    Sounds like fun, man.

    You can sign up at photobucket.com and host pictures from there if you want. Would love to see pics of the car as it sits now and during the build up.

    Best of luck! :Beer
     
  3. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    It's 11 PM and Ben and Tom and I just got done tearing down the '99 4 Litre core engine that will be the basis of my project. There was a little water in some of the cylinders but no rust damage.

    I did find two spun rod inserts. The crankshaft will require close attention, but since I will be using two inch big-end aluminium rods, the crank will require turning to the new size anyway. There is just enough wear in the cylinders to be feel-able, so I may not need any more than a light honing, depending on the clearance recommendations of the forged piston manufacturer.

    I am considering titanium valves so a change of seat material may be necessary. I'll probably also five-angle Serdi the seats and do a basic blend job.

    The cams will need to be reground to best work with the turbos.

    Over the next few days, I'll be working with various sponsors to get a more comprehensive list of modifications.
    KenS from Ben's Place
     
  4. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    I noticed somewhere on this forum the statement that there was no chance of using a Jag engine in place of the 3.9. Years ago, I knew a guy who had a '29 Ford Sedan with an Allison engine from a P-51 Mustang fighter in it. In point of fact, anything will go in anything (unless the engine is actually larger than the car) so there will be no giant problem with the four litre in place of the 3.9. I'll attack the electronics issue 'backwards'. Most likely, I'll use an aftermarket ECU to power the engine and concentrate on function in that mode first. Next, I'll get help (nice to live in Detroit) to interconnect as necessary to get the other car systems on line.

    As another aside, the bottom end of the Jag has all the necessary features to make it as strong as anything available anywhere. The main bearings are in a full length girdle that ties everything together. Then there is a cast sump that holds a windage tray in place to finish off the system. A sheet metal 'pan' on the front of this sump gives a degree of access to the underside. I didn't think to count but there are four main bolts at each of the five main bearings and five (I think) down each side for additional support. In addition, there about a dozen or so to fasten the aluminium sump to the main girdle. Since I'll be both using a high (relatively) boost dual turbo set-up and a NX Pro spray system, I'll install steel straps on the mains and use studs where there were bolts. More soon!
    KenS from Ben's Place
     
  5. KD00LS

    KD00LS Dedicated LVC Member

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    Sounds like you have a heck of a project on your hands. I can't wait to see the progress and pictures. Good luck.
     
  6. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Tuesday night
    Thanx for your good wishes. I have an appointment to sit down with my trans guy tomorrow. I'd prefer to keep the electronic controls of the 5R55N trans that came in the car. If I can be comfortable that the original will take the load from the engine, well enough. Otherwise, I'll go with a C-4 and Gear-Vendors OD system. That'll give me 1K HP or more of capacity. And I'll use a 9-inch center section and shafts if necessary.

    Someone commented that there was a degree of doubt of the engine making my goal HP-wise. Obviously, the reality remains at the dyno point. However, the math is simple. I am using a four litre Jag engine. With the selection of factory and aftermarket items available, would anyone disagree with a figure of 300 RWHP?

    Next, let's take a quick look at supercharging. As a broad rule of thumb, double atmospheric pressure--and add commensurate fuel---and make double the HP. (We all know we're really talking about torque here. HP is a calculated figure; it's really torque that's being measured.) Therefore, an additional 14.7 pounds of 'boost' should make our dynamometer console read '600 HP'. This will be without the planned addition of some small degree of methanol so as to be able to use regular pump gas. (When not in boost, regular driving often takes no more than 60-or-so octane to go down the street.) The addition of methanol---with its 120+ octane---will have some HP-adding benefit due to the extra O2 and the cooling effect, and make a mechanical intercooler un-necessary. So let's say that the whole enchilada goes just to 600 HP---even if I have to go to more than 15 pounds of boost. The dual turbo system is sized to make as much as 30 pounds so I have lots to play with.

    Now add in the NX PRO nitrous oxide system---also using more methanol instead of any gasoline. My present system has a 300 HP capacity---with gasoline as the fuel. NX tells me that their nominal 150 set-up, with gasoline, actually makes about 165-170 at the rear wheels. My own experience says that a designated 100 HP---with NH3OH as fuel---increased my one mile speed by about 12 MPH. And every time I increased the methanol pill size, without any more N20, I went faster. I ran out of reasonably-sized pills and still re-set the record three times. Since I'll be using a 200 HP set of 'pills', and using the CH3OH to replace gasoline, we've arrived at the magic 800 HP. In England, a five litre version of our engine---used for a European racing venue---makes 550 HP with no power adders. I'll be using a symbiosis of boost, methanol and nitrous oxide. I'll have to limit boost and 'spray' amounts to stay below 800 HP. Your comments are solicited.
    KenS from Ben's Place
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2007
  7. ILLS

    ILLS Dedicated LVC Member

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    The 5R55N, 5R55S, & 5R55W transmissions have lived to 700+ rwhp in built form through stock Ford computer re-tuning. Level Ten offers a good build. Art Carr does too, but they are under new ownership and having QC issues. If you control that transmission with a standalone controller like the PCS then you will likely be able to hit 900-1000 hp before the trans dies. The PCS allows so much more adjustability than the Ford tuning which keeps these trans together. With these electronic transmissions the tunes are every bit as important as the hard parts to prevent breakage.

    I am curious to see who it was that made the comment about a Jag engine not making 600hp on boost. You throw enough boost to any engine and you will make 600 hp. As long as the engine is built to take it then everything should be fine. There are some people on this board that do not quite understand automotive performance. I noticed that it almost seems some of them look at modding a vehicle from a performance standpoint as some sort of voodoo magic. Obviously that is not the case, and all performance mods are based upon solid physics.

    It does seem to be an ambitious build which is why allot of people are doubtful. Trust me I have been there many times with the various custom builds I have done. On the various vehicle forums I frequent I see no less than 10 people a week say they are going to do this custom turbo or that custom blower, or make that race car and never follow through with it. Allot of talkers, few do'ers. You may (or may not) be the biggest do'er the world has ever seen but people here still do not know you enough to determine that yet; which is why everyone defaults to doubt initially. What I am trying to say is do not take anyones doubtful comments here personally. Call it forum profiling... ;)
     
  8. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Again, thanks for your kind words. I believe you have hit the nail squarely with your comments about doubters. In fact, being new here, I'd have been little more than a lurker if it were not that my record speaks for itself. Go to the ECTA website and look at the E/FSS and E/FCC records. They are held by the Ben's Place Racing Team. I am the owner and driver for that entry.
    We finished 17th out of over 100 entries in season points and didn't even go to all the meets.

    In the Photoshop section of this forum, I've asked for detailed directions on posting pictures here. If someone reading THIS will read THAT and help as I've asked, I'll be happy to post some pictures.
    KenS from Ben's Place.
     
  9. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Dual post! Sorry !!
     
  10. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    I've spent several hours trying to re-size photos so that this forum (box below) will accept. So far no luck. I have no difficulty emailing photos, so if anyone is willing to post for me, I'd very much appreciate it. And, of course, if anyone has the key to re-sizing, I'll happily accept that too.
    KenS from Ben's place email---ben@bensplace.us
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2007
  11. daves2000ls

    daves2000ls Dedicated LVC Member

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    Got them resized earlier today, just got around to posting.

    Enjoy!

    Looks awesome, can't wait to see a video!

    1) Controls
    2) Engine Compartment
    3) Looking Across The Pits At Maxton
    4) Maxton Timing Tower
    5) Methanol Delivery System
    6) More Helpers
    7) No Substitute for Safety
    8) NX Hardware
    9) Pit Setup---104 In the Shade...and NO SHADE!
    10) Ready to Get Started
    11) Roll Cage for a Daily Driver
    12) Some of Those That Helped

    Controls.jpg

    Engine Compartment.jpg

    Looking Across the Pits At Maxton.jpg

    Maxton Timing Tower.jpg

    Methanol delivery system.jpg

    More Helpers.jpg

    No Substitue for Safety.jpg

    NX Hardware.jpg

    Pit Setup---104 In The Shade, and NO SHADE.jpg

    Ready to get started on.jpg

    Roll Cage for a Daily Driver.jpg

    Some of those that helped.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2007
  12. 98LSC32V

    98LSC32V Dedicated LVC Member

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    Very cool build, should have done it with a Mark VIII though but im biased haha...
     
  13. NYC LS8

    NYC LS8 Dedicated LVC Member

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    Nice, dude. What wheels are those? Me likey. :D
     
  14. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    My thanks to Dave for his help in posting the above pictures. The tech folks at AT&T tell me there is some sort of glitch between my primary email system and my Photoshop software that seems to be causing the problem. In addition, this is a glorified typewriter as far as I'm concerned.

    The work shown by ILLS in his thread is such an awesome guide to what I'm aiming for that I've probably gone over it at least a dozen times. However, I'll be using two smaller turbos and keeping the spray system. Since I have over 109K miles on my '02 LS Sport, I've chosen to start this winter's project by re-doing a 4 litre Jag engine as a foundation. In so far as I can now tell, it's almost a twin brother to the 3.9. As I discover the inevitable small differences, I'll pass on the info---either here or in the pages of one of the Primedia Publications. (I've been doing tech projects for performance magazines since the '70s; at that time the ONLY Ford-focussed Mag was Super Ford and I was a columnist there.)

    Any and all comments and questions gratefully accepted !
    KenS from Ben's Place
     
  15. daves2000ls

    daves2000ls Dedicated LVC Member

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    No problem Ken, I was anxious to see them.
     
  16. NYC LS8

    NYC LS8 Dedicated LVC Member

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    :confused:
     
  17. Brock

    Brock Active LVC Member

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    "In so far as I can now tell, it's almost a twin brother to the 3.9."

    I read on a Jag forum, I believe, that the "3.9 is the all aluminum version of the 4.0"
     
  18. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    'All-aluminium in a 3.9 but not in the 4.0?'

    I would read that statement to suggest that there's more aluminium in a 3.9 than a 4 litre. The only things that aren't aluminium in the 4 litre Jag engine are the rods, crank, cams and associated hardware, and the bolts. The inlet manifold is a composite, as is the one on the 3.9. Since my 3.9 is still powering the car, I can't speak for the internals to be found there, but it would be un-challengeable to call a 4 liter Jag an 'all-aluminum' engine. The stripped block for the Jag is still mounted to an engine stand, but I have no doubt of my ability to support it in one hand. (Not hold OUT, but hold DOWN. After all, I'm a 66-year-old 'retiree'. At least as retired as I'm likely to ever get.) Please take this reply as a challenge to the original statement-maker and not to you personally. :)
    BenS from Ben's Place.
     
  19. Brock

    Brock Active LVC Member

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    I don't believe you mentioned why you were using the 4.0 instead of the 3.9 for your project. Actually, I like to call motors by C.I. I feel better saying 242 C.I. versus 3.9 L!
     
  20. 00_slow_5spd_ls

    00_slow_5spd_ls Well-Known LVC Member

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    00===========d
     
  21. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Why a Jag?

    Mostly because a '99 4 litre was readily available to me at the right price. I don't believe there is any significant difference beyond several cubic inches. (The VVT on the Jag may be more sophisticated, although I don't know this for a fact.) But I work with what's in front of me, unless it's significantly inferior. The '02 Lincoln doesn't have VVT at all.
    KenS from Ben's Place
     
  22. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Tires and rims

    Sorry! The car wasn't home---my daughter had it---and I couldn't remember the rim brand name. They're Verde and are in Michelin Pilot P-2 245/45 ZR-18s.
     
  23. NYC LS8

    NYC LS8 Dedicated LVC Member

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    Nice. I really like those. Not like I have the cash for a set, but still.... :D
     
  24. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Error modified

    I just had it pointed out to me that I mis-spoke in a post above. The Ben's Place Racing Team entry finished 19th in points out of 124 different entries during the just-past racing season. There are five weekends of racing; we went to four.
    KenS from Ben's Place
     
  25. cammerfe

    cammerfe Dedicated LVC Member

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    Magazine story

    For those who might be interested---
    I arranged, this morning, through a 'verbal handshake', to write a short item for a Primedia publication regarding our record runs at Maxton. I'll be sending in the story and photos within the next week or so and it usually takes at least six weeks before it would appear in publication. Depending on where the editor is in his work, it may well take longer than that. The photos will be other than those I've shown here and the copy will give a narrative of the past season. Future stuff will focus on the new engine and trans build and next season's activities
    KenS
     

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