Another "Needing help with A/C" PLEASE!!!!

[Ranger31]

Okay, I bought my 2005 LS this past Saturday (v-6). Bad hub bearing assembly, and No A/C. Hub bearing, no problem. 30 minutes, and it was all fixed. The A/C is a whole different story. I read a lot on here over the weekend, and decided DCCV. spent the 149.00 and bought a new one. installed, and no difference. (warm air). There is no power going to the compressor. I bought a new Relay, the fuse was fine, but I replaced it anyway, no change. I checked all the DATC fuses, all fine. I ran the DATC self test, and came up with the following. 12-65 Cold air bypass door actuator, 1262 - defrost door actuator circuit failure, and 1242 - air inlet door circuit failure.
Now - when I change locations, i.e. a/c - def - heat, etc. it changes perfectly. At the relay location under the hood, I have two terminals that do have power, and using a jumper I can get the a/c clutch to engage. But there is no power going through the relay to the a/c compressor.
(I'm stumped)..... I absolutely cannot afford to spend a grand at an automotive shop to get the a/c working, but living in Florida. I need a/c. I really like the car, and I want to keep it, but i'm an old fart and need a/c.

Thanks. kinda long I know. but I wanted to provide as much info as I could.

 

[joegr]

First, don't bypass the relay. You could damage the compressor!

Ignore the bypass door error, you don't have a bypass door. It's a software bug that they finally fixed in the later 06s. It doesn't cause any issue other than the false code.
As for the other door errors, those are probably just stored from temporary faults where the doors didn't move quickly enough at one time or another. Clear those errors, and they probably won't come back for a while, if ever.

The most probable reason that the AC is not engaging is that the system pressure is too low. Running the compressor with low pressure and/or low compressor oil will cause damage. You need to check the pressure. Don't just put a can (even with the pressure gauge) on and try to fill it. At this point, you need to have it evacuated. If it will hold a vacuum, then they can put oil and refrigerant in. Unfortunately, you'll probably find that there is a leak that must be fixed first.

 

[Ranger31]

Thanks for the quick reply. I did try and put in R134a, (can with gauge), didn't work. also, the compressor isn't getting power to it? would this be from low pressure? (not kicking in relay)>

 

[joegr]

Thanks for the quick reply. I did try and put in R134a, (can with gauge), didn't work. also, the compressor isn't getting power to it? would this be from low pressure? (not kicking in relay)>

The PCM controls the clutch relay.
It won't engage if the pressure (only high side pressure is sensed) is too low.
It will disengage if the pressure goes too high.
It won't engage or will disengage if the evaporator temperature goes too low. (evap temperature sensors do sometimes fail)
It won't engage or will disengage if the engine idle speed goes too low.
It won't engage or will disengage if the engine temperature goes too high.
It won't engage or will disengage if the engine has severe misfires.

I am confused by your statement about the "compressor isn't getting power to it." Only the clutch gets electrical power. When the clutch is powered, the compressor is turned by the belt from the engine. You bypassed the clutch relay and engaged the clutch (which you really shouldn't ever do for more than a second). I assume you would have mentioned it if cool air had started coming out when you did this. Since it didn't, that well supports the theory that your problem is that there is little to no refrigerant in the system.

 

[Ranger31]

Yes I know. and thanks. The electrical that engages the clutch isn't being received at the compressor. I appreciate the extra information, but after wrenching for 30+ years, functions of the a/c system I do understand. This Lincoln, with the DCCV and DATC are very new to me. I did the things I knew to do, to check the system. the jumper was only to verify, that the clutch would indeed engage. I did stick my hand around the open window, to see if I quickly felt any change in temp. (none). The Low pressure (high side) switch, I know disengages the compressor. On older cars, I also know, that unless you have one hell of a leak, putting R134a (synthetic) into the system (A/C on max, fan blowing high) will usually cause the compressor to at least kick on with the new charge. This one did not. that is what has me stumped. knowing that the clutch would engage, lets me know at least that part is working and gives me hope the compressor is okay. Unfortunately having a machine to pull the vacuum on the system I do not have. It looks like I will have to save up, and get it to a shop that can do that. If there is a leak, (I also suspect there is), then I will let them recover the system, i'll change the parts, then take it back to have them pull the vacuum, remove any possible moisture, and re-charge the system. I was hoping against hope, there was something i'm missing.

 

[Ranger31]

I really appreciate the help Joegr, as I said, I was just hoping (don't we all) it was something less expensive I was missing.

 

[Ranger31]

Okay now the newest problem. My A/C is working great (Thanks Joe), but when I am sitting still "warmed" air begins to come from the passenger side vents, and if I am sitting still long, even the drivers side vents will begin to warm. as soon as I start to move, or "rev" to 1000 RPM, (just over an idle which I think is roughly 700-750 rpm), then it immediately turns cold again. The very first thing I did with this car (see post #1), was replace the dccv, because I was hoping that was my original problem. (Joe) I checked the pressures again this weekend, and they are holding steady where they were. I also did put a small can of (PAG) oil for R134a. any ideas??
Thanks

 

[joegr]

Sounds like low refrigerant, or a failing compressor. The design of the evaporator gives priority to the driver's side, so the passenger side will crap out first. Another possibility would be a problem with the engine cooling fan.
I think that the most likely is that you have a leak (otherwise you wouldn't have had to fill it in the first place), and the refrigerant has leaked to a low level. Usually, as the refrigerant is getting low, you will sometimes hear some hissing from the expansion valve as it tries to deal with it.

 

[Ranger31]

Okay Joe thanks. the R134a that has the dye in it? have you had any experience with that stuff? I mean does it work> thanks again.

 

[joegr]

Okay Joe thanks. the R134a that has the dye in it? have you had any experience with that stuff? I mean does it work> thanks again.

I haven't used R134a with dye. I did once use R12 with dye. It worked. I saw the dye in the condensate drain and knew the leak was in the evaporator. Fortunately, on that particular car, the evaporator was in a case under the hood and not in the dash.

 

[Ranger31]

Okay thanks so much. I will see if I can find r134a with the dye. if not, either get it "sniffed" or buy a sniffer.

 

[joegr]

Okay thanks so much. I will see if I can find r134a with the dye. if not, either get it "sniffed" or buy a sniffer.

Another thing that you can do is to look at all the AC connections, the compressor, and the condenser. There will probably be some accumulation of oil and dirt where it is leaking at.

 

[Ranger31]

come to think of it, at the bottom of the compressor, I did notice what looked like oil and dirt (I cleaned it all up) before I attempted to charge it the first time. My luck i'm probably looking at a compressor, and having someone pull a vacuum and charge anyway. Thanks for the tip.

 

[LS4me]

Replacing the compressor and dryer yourself isn't too bad of a job. Just be sure to unplug the compressor before trying to drop it out. Don't ask how I know I got the compressor from Rock Auto. The parts were just under $410 plus whatever I paid for a recharge.

 

[joegr]

come to think of it, at the bottom of the compressor, I did notice what looked like oil and dirt (I cleaned it all up) before I attempted to charge it the first time. My luck i'm probably looking at a compressor, and having someone pull a vacuum and charge anyway. Thanks for the tip.

Both of my LSes developed a leak at the compressors. I replaced both, along with the receiver/dryers and the associated o-rings. That was a few years back. So far, no problems since. (My symptom in each case was a small yellow/green puddle of oil in the garage where each is parked.)

 

[Ranger31]

Hey Joe, no sign of leakage, the pressures are still dead on what they were when I charged it, well maybe 1 point higher, hard to tell after the little can of leak detector went in. And I did find that the "warmed" air only happens after the engine warms up, not before. Also the air diverter, or whatever it is called, that send air to the different locations, i.e. floor/vent/defrost, is SLOW to change positions, sometimes it take about 30 seconds or so to go from defroster to vent (A/C). but I did paint the speaker grills, and polished, buffed, wax, and detailed the LS this weekend.

 

[joegr]

... Also the air diverter, or whatever it is called, that send air to the different locations, i.e. floor/vent/defrost, is SLOW to change positions, sometimes it take about 30 seconds or so to go from defroster to vent (A/C). ...

There are four electrical servos (actuators) that control the various airflow doors. You may need to lubricate some or all of them. None of them have anything to do with air temperature. The DCCV is the control there.