waxing questions

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blklscmd

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i just got my 97 black lsc mark viii painted im gonna order the zaino stuff but wanted to know what is good maintenance for keeping your paint job looking new.I have polishing compound and rubbing compound but i dont know if i should you them to.Can somebody help me out and tell me what products to use and the steps to keep it up?
 
The #1 thing to do is NOT PUT SCRATCHES IN THE PAINT IN THE FIRST PLACE....

Technically speaking if you don't put scratches in the paint washing it you should never have to remove any... so that being said put your money into proper car washing tools first, and any wax will help protect.
 
To begin with, if you just got the car painted, the LAST thing you want to do is use rubbing compound on it.
You have to wait for the paint to harden.
This could take months.
I belong to many other forums, and recently I posted the steps I have used successfully for years to keep all my vehicles looking better than new.
Click on the link below, and you will not only get some useful advice but, if you follow it, you will also save bucks by never having to go to a car wash ever again.
http://mazdaforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18545
Bob.
 
For what Bob had mentioned... is correct some of the time. If they cure the paint with heat, you should be set as far as using a rubbing compound. Don't know why you would need to, but you probably could. If they are letting the paint cure using traditional methods, then yes, the paint is still soft, and should not be polished by someone who does not have a good understanding of the process.

Body shop guys are not detailers. You can bring your "fresh" paint to a whole new level by using a machine polisher to take out the swirls/holograms the body shop left in your paint. But it does not seem like this is the case, as you probably do not have the tools available to you to do it yourself.

I would ask the body shop how long before you can apply a wax as well. Most places will tell you to wait 30 days. What you could do in the meantime is regularly apply a glaze for temporary protection. It will not last long, but your paint does need to breathe to finish curing properly. You can run into issues with the paint if you seal/wax it too soon.

It has already been stressed, but it bears repeating: learn the proper way to wash a vehicle. If you are really serious, get a pressure washer, foam lance/cannon to wash the car, and an electric leaf blower to dry it off. The less you touch your paint, the better.

Here's a basic how-to:

http://www.detailuniversity.com/forums/lessons-detailing/679-washing-drying-lesson-1-a.html
 
I LOVE drying my car with the leaf blower... I use it for 95% of the drying and use clean MF's to finish it off and dry the jams.
 
yessir. It's a great way to do it! ALthough I get weird looks from the neighbors :shifty:

I normally flood the surface first (remove nozzle from hose, and just use the hose end) from top down. On a maintained vehicle, this will remove most of the water. Then the leaf blower to get the rest, and a plush mf to get any of the residual water. The less you touch the paint, the better!
 
Thanks for the link, bob. I needed a good chuckle. What do you think UV rays do to the wax? If you know the proper dilutions for car wash soap (and the correct soap to use), you will not remove any LSP.

but, if you like it, and you are happy with the results, then more power to you.
 
kustomizingkid said:
The #1 thing to do is NOT PUT SCRATCHES IN THE PAINT IN THE FIRST PLACE....

Technically speaking if you don't put scratches in the paint washing it you should never have to remove any... so that being said put your money into proper car washing tools first, and any wax will help protect.
Click to expand...

That, for the most part, is impossible. Driving your car alone leaves it vunerable to particulate matter in the air rubbing over it as you drive however fast you drive, not to mention other enviromental pollutions, bird:q:q:q:q and so forth. The best offense here is a good defense. It all depends on the body shops methods, but generally speaking, give it at least a couple weeks before it gets hammered with products. I wouldn't do anything other than rinse it daily for the first couple weeks, then wax that bad boy, frequently during harsch conditions. Generally on wax, 4 times a year. If you used a calander year, from now, it would be as soon as two weeks as passed, again in late july early august, again in late nov early december, and again in late winter early spring. Basically, get the most protection you can during summer and winter, and those are the two seasons that beat your paint down the most. Color is also a factor:cool:
 
How is color a factor? Are you telling me that black cars scratch faster than white cars? Not the case, the white ones just hide the same scratches better.

You are correct that it is impossible to not abrade the surface if you ever drive, wash, or touch the vehicle. What you can do is minimize it.

For winter wax, try collinite 845. Awesome protection from road salt. And 2 coats should get you through a winter.

I myself throw a fresh coat of wax on about every 30 days. Just because I like to.
 
Lol... obviously you can't eliminate 100% of scratches, but he is asking about brand new fresh paint, and I will once again say that on brand new fresh paint the best thing to do is NOT scratch it... so don't put money into big $$ wax and other stuff, get the right stuff to do a proper 2 bucket wash method with the right mitts....
 
pektel said:
How is color a factor? Are you telling me that black cars scratch faster than white cars? Not the case, the white ones just hide the same scratches better.

You are correct that it is impossible to not abrade the surface if you ever drive, wash, or touch the vehicle. What you can do is minimize it.

I myself throw a fresh coat of wax on about every 30 days. Just because I like to.
Click to expand...

Color is a factor in multiple ways. First, you are correct, lighter colors hide scratching, swirls, and spider webbing much better than darker colors. Second, if it does get marred in some way, it is 100x easier to get it to look like its not on a white car, because you can buff away without the worries of excessive swirls that will be created. White is by far the easiest color to maintain or fix if damage occurs. The darker colors show more oxidation, more swirls, and more definition in scratches. Add to that the fact that darker colors absorb more heat, which in turn melts wax back to a liquid form, then a trip down the highway rolls it off the hood, roof and trunk and you have a recipe for disaster. So, color is a MAJOR factor when deciding on care of the surface, such as time between waxes. Now, if you're extremely overprotective of your car, and you wax it once a month, then color is irrelevant. (and i'm not saying thats a bad thing, cause the mark gets babied at least that often) I toss in a clay bar, depending on how many miles i've done, about twice a year:cool:
 
kustomizingkid said:
IF you get a decent wax melting won't be a problem...
Click to expand...

Thats just not true. There are multiple types of wax. Carnuba, Petroleum based, bayberry wax, wool wax, and the ever over marketed Polymers like Teflon. While the synthetically devolped waxes may have more durability than the other products, their life expectancy is always lower where intense heat from the sun is a near daily factor. (there is also the sealant market, which is not technically a wax) Petroleum and Carnuba are the most widely used, commonly found on any shelf where detail products are sold. There is no way for a manufacturer to say their product is going to last xx amount of days, because their are so many varients in the enviorments in which the product will be used. (persay, arizona vs seattle, which would be god forsaken sun beatings vs constant rain) The surface in arizona would melt away much sooner than seattle, however seattle has enviormental contamination in the rain which will degrade the surface of wax unevenly. There is no product on the market that can without a doubt say it will last a set time no matter what, and you can take that to the bank.;)
 
What's the difference in surface temperature of 2 vehicles, one white, one black, at 90 degrees fahrenheit, full sun, 1:00 pm in San Francisco, California, June 15, 2008, and 78% relative humidity?

Just wondering how you are getting your numbers.

Please also state at which surface temperature a specific wax (each wax is going to react differently, so lets say a 53% carnauba content by solids) would actually melt and "roll" off the vehicle surface at highway speeds.

I'm not saying that your statement is incorrect, just grossly exagerrated. I'd love to see a vehicle with melting wax rolling off the vehicle, so I could laugh at the guy who wasted that much product. I use under 1/2 oz. per application.
 
pektel said:
What's the difference in surface temperature of 2 vehicles, one white, one black, at 90 degrees fahrenheit, full sun, 1:00 pm in San Francisco, California, June 15, 2008, and 78% relative humidity?

Just wondering how you are getting your numbers.

Please also state at which surface temperature a specific wax (each wax is going to react differently, so lets say a 53% carnauba content by solids) would actually melt and "roll" off the vehicle surface at highway speeds.

I'm not saying that your statement is incorrect, just grossly exagerrated. I'd love to see a vehicle with melting wax rolling off the vehicle, so I could laugh at the guy who wasted that much product. I use under 1/2 oz. per application.
Click to expand...

about 40 degrees, which of course depends on the length of time the wax on those cars has been on them, assuming of course they have been waxed. You neglect to give that info, and the reflectivity of the paint will change the temp by a degree or two.

We can all post smartass answers, they'll never show anything though. All of the waxes have different melting points based on their chemical structure....And, the wax on the car liquifies, it doesn't turn colors.....you aren't going to see it, whether you use the smallest amount of wax possible or the greatest amount possible. Hence the point of wax, a clear protectant of paint:rolleyes: If you think its grossly exagerrated, then I suggest you get into the trenches and see what real life does to a cars finish. And by that I don't mean a few cars a day, look at 300 or more a day, and by reading their history or talking with the customer, you'd be suprised what isn't overexagerrated.:cool:
 
YOu stated claims without backing them up. I thought maybe you had worked out the actual formulas or something. It was a pretty bold statement. So I figured since you had a theory, why not test it? I mean, relative humidity would also have a factor on a natural product such as carnauba wax as well, no?

Get the sand out man, just a healthy debate here, as I had not heard from SCORES of professionals that have used most waxes available, that heat on one color car compared to another would have a measurable effect on the lifespan of an LSP.

I agree that heat, and even more specifically, UV rays, will degrade an LSP faster than if it were not subjected to those conditions. But to say that on a hot day, your wax is going to disappear, seems ludicrous. The entire wax industry would be nonexistent if this were the case.
 
Also, I said nothing about the wax changing colors. You stated that the applied wax would change states (into a liquid) and roll off the vehicle. That I would assume would be a visible action, right? since in order for it to roll off the surface, it would have to be large enough for a droplet to form. Which is where I got my statement about the overuse of a wax to teh point where there's enough on the surface to actually liquify, gather into beads, and roll off the paint.
 
Lets say you did have a car with black paint and you lived in a place where it got obscenely hot... maybe you would want to wax your car with something like Poorboys Wheel Sealer... that stuff is made for high temp environments...

I have NEVER heard of wax melting off any car in any condition before though... and if it was an issue don't you think someone would have marketed a "Dark Color High Temp Wax" by now...
 
Ligh colours reflect heat, whereas darker colour absorb and retain heat

The average blackest black has a light reflection value (LRV ) of approximately 5% and the whitest white is approximately 85%. Some yellows can measure up into the 80's or 90's as well. All colours fit in between these two extremes. A colour with an LRV of 50 will reflect 50% of the light that falls on it, and one with an LRV of 23 will reflect 23% of the light, and so on. Think of a reflective value as a numerical version of a grey value scale for colours, roughly like this:

Colour - Reflective Value
Pure White - 100, White -95, Light - 80, Low Light - 65, Medium - 50, High Dark - 35, Dark – 20


Vehicle paint surface temperatures-

Ambient Air temp - 90oF temperatures (attained after 2-hours) slight air movement (with still air add 10-15oF)

Table VI

Temperatures attained by various paint colours

Paint Colour Temperatures

White 115.oF - 46.oC
Red 123- 50.5
Dark Blue 126- 52
Black 127- 53
Metallic blue/green 126- 52
Dark Metallic Green 137- 58

Interior
Dependant upon interior colour
Light 104.oF - 135.oC
Dark 220 – 275



An extract from one of a series of in-depth detailing articles © TOGWT ™ Ltd Copyright 2002-2008, all rights reserved.
 
Now, is a 12 degree difference enough to compromise the integrity of the wax to such an extent that it will have a measurable impact?

I'm awaiting a response from the author of the article of which this was excerpted.
 
I've never seen wax bead up and roll off the surface of a vehicle because of heat. I'm sure that because of the fact that waxes gas out and dry on the surface of the vehicle that this would even be less likely of a situation.
 
Let me rephrase this for those that seem to think they could hold a bucket behind the car and catch the wax for later reuse. Its a process, no different than an application of wax. The wax heats up, returns to a somewhat liquid state, and slowly over hte course of this repeating itself several times it will at some point cause the wax on the top of the car to dissipate. Thus, you've seen cars (especially red and black) that will be red and glossy on the sides, yet the hood roof and trunk are a pinkish oxidized color........the wax (or even lack thereof over many years) has been beaten off the most sun exposed areas, and the aerodynamics of most all cars puts the largest coefficiant of air over the front, windshield, roof, rear glass and trunk. Since those areas are the hottest due to their greater exposure to the sunlight, their risk of loss of product is higher. Its not something worth extreme debate, simply because its true. Its not something I pulled out of my ass last night and posted, its something I learned through experience. If you don't believe it, then don't. But i'm stating factual first hand experience, not a haphazard guess or personal opinion based on information that has no basis other than, "I don't think so." And those last few sentences aren't directed at you pektel, more the rest of the folks who add nothing other than an opinion, whereas you quote information.
 
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