Water leak dripping near oil cooler

Lincoln LS

  1. rgorke

    rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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    2004 LS Sport...220k miles...lots of maintenance by local dealership.

    Car started over heating yesterday. Coolant in degas bottle low. Obviously have a leak somewhere. What is in the picture is from where it is dripping. IOW, somewhere above that point. Upon further inspection, I can see a little bit of water pooled above the oil cooler.

    Car runs normally...Temp is at 207-210 with fluid in the degas bottle. The drip is between the oil pan and oil cooler. Here is a shot from above with a little bit of water right at the oil cooler. What is above that could be leaking? Degas, radiator, upper and lower hoses, tstat have all been changed in the past 2 years with OEM. Not sure if the tstat housing was changed. I don’t want to just rip and tear and replace things indiscriminately.

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  2. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    Leaks from the water pump are rare, but it is within range. You'll have to remove the intake tube to the throttle body (from the filter), and then you may be able to get in there enough to find it.
    I am assuming that by "tstat" you also mean the housing, fill cap, crossover, and 4n99 pipe. Otherwise, those are all good suspects.
     
  3. rgorke

    rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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    Thanks Joe,

    Not sure if housing, etc was changed with the Tstat. Wanted to just check if the water pump was a common issue vs the other issues vis a vis tstat housing, etc.

    Now, I know the Al Jag housing will only fit on Gen 1. Is there a preferred housing for Gen 2? I know NOT Dorman but what about other options?

    Thanks
     
  4. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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  5. rgorke

    rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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    Thanks, I really like that Jag one because it has all three parts, housing, crossover, and 9N499 pipe. I went out and took a very close look and this is what I saw. I also saw some apparent remnants of splatter over to the left where the crossover attaches to the head. I wiped off all the splatter marks to see if it comes back after a drive.

    Rockauto has a Motorcraft Tstat "Connector" but not a "housing" /cross over. There is an SKB and Gates brand but not sure how those compare to Motorcraft vs Dorman.

    I also have a question of getting to the 9N499 pipe, do I need to take off the intake manifold completely off? Or can I just loosen it and lift the front end? Something tells me that is asking for trouble.

    leak.jpg
     
  6. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    You can loosen and lift, but I think it's easier to remove it all the way. I'd be concerned about knocking dirt into the cylinders and about getting a good seal without replacing the intake manifold gaskets or at least putting a little gasket maker on them.

    Others have cut the rear bolts off and put shorter ones back, but I'm not comfortable with that myself. If you do that, you have to remove the throttle body and adapter. If you take the manifold off, you can leave the throttle body attached to it.

    Jaguar has the degas bottle up front by the radiator. Because of that, there is no engine fill cap, and I think the hoses may exit in a different direction. I think you could get by without the fill cap, but only if the hose nozzles point in very close to the same direction. I wish I knew.
     
  7. rgorke

    rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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    Thanks!!! I am going to try and see if I can actually see where the leak is. I KNOW I should just replace everything. The intake manifold is an extra huge step I didn't want to have to take.
     
  8. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    It adds about an hour (maybe two for the first time).
     
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    • DeviLSh

      DeviLSh Dedicated LVC Member

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      Thanks for pointing this out, I keep getting tiny leaks at my engine's fill cap, eliminating it on my setup might be the better route to take. Might also make sense for me to relocate the degas like the Jag's while I am at it, since I am no longer running heat and such. Thanks Joe! I am saving this link.
       
    • rgorke

      rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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      I took the air intake off and here is the mess underneath. Definitely coming out of the neck, crossover, tstat housing. Don’t think it is coming from the water pump since there is muck on top of the whole area.

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    • joegr

      joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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      Yep. Looks like it's the normal leaks.
       
    • rgorke

      rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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      “Normal” like from housing, crosspipe and 9N499 plastics vs water pump?

      I would think a water pump leak would be a bit more of a catastrophic leak.

      A guy on Facebook suggested the Dorman cross and 9N499 seem to be a better risk than the degas bottle.

      I may call dealership tomorrow to check their price.
       
    • joegr

      joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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      Yes, normal like that. Do be aware that most water pump leaks that I have seen (not specific to the LS) start out very small for some time before becoming drastic. Feel under the bottom shaft weep hole just to be sure. That said, it's probably not the water pump just based on how reliable it is compared to the plastic parts above it.
       
    • rgorke

      rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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      Got it. This was a “everything is running fine and dandy until cabluey on Sunday and it starts to overheat” issue. Rather than a slow drip drip drip leak.

      I’ll make a list and confirm I haven’t left anything out...
       
    • joegr

      joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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      Oh no, that's been slowly dripping (from the plastic) for some time judging by the muck around it. I think that's often the case. You don't notice it till it runs low enough to be a problem, or something pushes it over the edge.
       
    • rgorke

      rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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      Yes, come to think of it, I did notice some muck on the 9N499 tube a while
      Back but thought it was “historic” from when the tstat was replaced a year or more ago.

      I know, how about I go to the pick a part and get the parts!?!?!? (That is a joke.....).
       
    • rgorke

      rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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      I found all the parts at FordPartsGiant. I have a question about the rubber ring, it automatically loads 4 in my cart. Do I need 4 of these? Also, even though the thermostat is only 2 years old, I thought I might as well put a new on it. The degas bottle and upper and lower hoses are only 2 years old.

      Anything I am missing?

      Part Description Price
      Qty.
      Subtotal
      003add%5cFord_2_Ford_cgm_0128_a012845706_8548A.png
      Part No.: 3W4Z-8548-AD

      TUBE - WATER INLET

      Remove
      $43.71
      $43.71
      003add%5cFord_2_Ford_cgm_0128_a012845706_HR1.png
      Part No.: -W707299-S300

      RING - RUBBER
      [Lincoln | LS | 2004 | 8 Cyl 3.9L DOHC EFI NA]

      Remove
      $8.18
      $32.72
      Ford_2%2fFord%2fcgm%2f0128%2fa012845706%2fa012845706_9N499.png
      Part No.: 2W9Z-9N499-AC

      TUBE ASY
      [Lincoln | LS | 2004 | 8 Cyl 3.9L DOHC EFI NA]

      Remove
      $27.10
      $27.10
      Ford_2%2fFord%2fcgm%2f0117%2fa011719403%2fa011719403_8592.png
      Part No.: 3W4Z-8592-AA

      CONNECTION - WATER O

      Remove
      $36.97
      $36.97
      Ford_2%2fFord%2fcgm%2f0111%2fa011170703%2fa011170703_9439.png
      Part No.: 2W9Z-9439-AA

      GASKET - INTAKE MANI
      [Lincoln | LS | 2004 | 8 Cyl 3.9L DOHC EFI NA]

      Remove
      $14.28
      $28.56
      Ford_2%2fFord%2fcgm%2f0117%2fa011719204%2fa011719204_8575.png
      Part No.: 2W9Z-8575-AB

      THERMOSTAT ASY
      [Lincoln | LS | 2004 | 8 Cyl 3.9L DOHC EFI NA]

      Remove
      $22.44
      $22.44
       
    • joegr

      joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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      No, just one.

      Yes.
      Seal at the bottom of 9N499
      Seals (two of same part) between the heads and 8548
      Seal between 8548 and 8592
      Engine fill cap (yes, they do fail)
       
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      • joegr

        joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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      • rgorke

        rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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        Thanks, I was just double checking as you wrote and saw I was missing the 8255 gaskets. there seems to be a "CA" and "CB". I also went by the agency and got a quote and it was over $150 more there, not surprising.

        The parts at Fordpartsgiant say "Manufacturer: Ford. This genuine Ford part is guaranteed by Ford's factory warranty." To me this means NOT Dorman or any other cheap aftermarket but Motorcraft or equivalent. Do I need to or should I double check with them?

        Also, going to print this thread out....

        REPLACE YOUR COOLING SYSTEM - 2004 Fun and Easy Steps
         
      • rgorke

        rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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      • joegr

        joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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        AFAIK, FordPartsGiant is a Ford parts dealer and does not offer any aftermarket parts.
         
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        • rgorke

          rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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          I have been reading through the threads above and am thinking that replacing the 9F814 hose from the 9N499 to the Throttle body might be a good idea. As long as I am in there, I might as well, right. And, with it right on the motor, it has to be taking a beating.
           
        • 1LoudLS

          1LoudLS Dedicated LVC Member

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          every single coolant part I got from Fordpartsgiant were OEM.
           
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          • rgorke

            rgorke Well-Known LVC Member

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            The repair is underway!!! I was going to start a new thread but thought I would just keep everything together.

            Parts are coming. I have a friend (father of kid on my son’s football team that I coach) is a mechanic and hooking me up with the parts through his contacts...OEM/Motorcraft, of course.

            Here’s a few pics of the status. I also post some pics of the removed parts when the sun comes up. (The hose in the middle is just a piece I had to make sure coolant didn’t leak all over the block.)

            I notice a great deal of black oily muck in the fuel injector ports and in the block. I saw a previous thread that articulated this is normal.

            Also, I am thinking of cleaning the fuel injectors, is there a preferred method?

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