Unsticking IMRC's by hand?

Kraze said:
Lol if you think that's bad, wait til you see a WOT data log of my car. You mind if I shoot you a pm once I have the new WOT datalogs this weekend and we can go over them and maybe do some comparison? I'm pretty sure you're far ahead of me when it comes to understanding the data logs and tuning aspects of these cars lol.

And here's an old data log with some WOT runs on it for you to look at if you want: http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=7fe10a379214d0c18ef1259ff1b60e81e04e75f6e8ebb871
Click to expand...

Feel free to shoot me a PM..
but I dont log in much over the weekend..but..
CHECK your PM box I'll shoot you my cell #

call me anytime.. and I'll log in and grab your datalog no problem
 
haha sure, Im sure there is a hardcore WoW player using a mark VIII avatar!
 
Kid: You should definitely log that and post them up so we can all take a look at it. Are you using SCT livelink?

And this weekend I'll probably do another couple seafoam treatments and mess around with the IMRC's, along with some more data logging. Thanks for all the help guys!
 
Kraze said:
Kid: You should definitely log that and post them up so we can all take a look at it. Are you using SCT livelink?

And this weekend I'll probably do another couple seafoam treatments and mess around with the IMRC's, along with some more data logging. Thanks for all the help guys!
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Kraze, who did your tune?
You/they really should:
a.pull some timing out
b.add some fuel to it

I looked at your WOT logs and....
yea.. that thing is trying to disassemble itself.

Do you have the PRP or are you working via a mail order tuning solution?

It looks to have an AZZLOAD of timing, which I found interesting until I saw.."THE KNOCK"..ouch. Please stop doing that.. it hurts me to just look at it. HAHA

IF you dont have PRP, does your Xcal have the "user adjustable options" enabled?
if so..I'd "suggest" chunking about 10% fuel at it and see if the knock goes away.

IF that helps..then you need to adjust the tune, "rinse lather repeat".
 
On that WOT log, what was different between the first and second run?

The first run knocked like crazy and the second one didn't....that is what struck me as weird.
Were you "pedaling" the second run to keep it from knocking or was it an actual FOOT DOWN WOT run as well?

I'm still looking at your log file...just FYI
 
Now I'm not completely positive on this, but I'm pretty sure all the WOT runs were foot down the whole way, no difference. That was almost a year ago though, which is one of the main reasons why I'm going to do some more data logging this weekend. And I'm actually going out to my car right now to change the tune up.. I'm gonna pull some timing and I'll try adding that 10% fuel like you said, so that's the tune that will be data logged this weekend.

The tune was by Torrie at fast parts network, and no pro racer here for me.... yet lol. I've had suspicions for a while now that my fuel pump is on it's way out, and I'm going to be doing a fuel pressure test this weekend too so we'll see if those suspicions are confirmed then.
 
I would do "either or", but not both.. unless that is what it takes to make it stop knocking.
Before you take timing out.. try chunking 10% fuel IN.
IF that doesnt work then by all means drop a couple of degrees of timing.
In your datalog it took 5 degree's out before the car stopped knocking..

BUT if you add some fuel, and the fuel pump is actually up to the task... then the motor SHOULD be come more knock tolerant.

I saw in one of your other posts talking about low fuel pressure and I agree that your fuel pump might be "crapping the bed".

If adding fuel doesnt help, then you probably need to get into the tank and swap the pump (sorry to say)
 
Kraze said:
and no pro racer here for me.... yet lol..
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The level of fuel and spark control is about 100 times more adjustable in the ProRacer software vs what you see in the Xcal.

You've already got an xcal, so upgrading to PRP should only be 320-330 dollars... and it's WELL WORTH the investment, especially when your car or tune isn't doing what it's supposed to be doing.

just a thought from the far side.
 
Well I decided to make a compromise. Since I've had suspicions about the fuel pump, I added in 6% fuel and pulled 2 degrees of timing from 0-4000 and 3 degrees from the rest. Depending on the results of the fuel pressure test, I might try putting the spark back at what the tune had it set for and bumping the fuel up to 10%, and then go from there with datalogging and all that good stuff.

And the PRP is next on my list of things to do AFTER I do my O2's, fuel pump, and get my a/c working again lol. I figured those three things are a little more important.. gotta have my priorities straight :p
 
You should make a datalog just prior to flashing the new tune and then change the tune and datalog again.
It's a PITA process but well worth it when trying to compare data.

I guess your really just trying to look for and stop knock so it's not like trying to nail down a maf transfer function or something like that.

Give it a whirl and post the log
 
Chunking more fuel at it under suspicion of fuel pressure problems is like burning the land around the forest to stop a forest fire....
 
Lol that's why I only did 6% for now instead of 10%, and why I'm doing fuel pressure tests. And umm.. they actually do practice controlled burns when there are forest fires to help slow down the spread of them lmao.
 
Well, did the fuel pressure test and I have a good 40 psi at idle, so fuel delivery isn't an issue I guess. I also was able to wedge my hand way back in the engine bay and manipulate both IMRC levers by hand and they both move freely. I also visually checked again to make sure they're snapping open like they should, and they are.

Now for the datalog: http://www.mediafire.com/?sharekey=5c2f7a808ecf907ced24a2875c7fa58ee04e75f6e8ebb871

Both IMRC's have now officially gone dumb on the datalogs. I think I'll just ignore them from now on. I did have some knock, not nearly as much as before though. Also, what the hell does a positive value for the knock sensors mean? lol

Another thing I found interesting was the fuel pump duty cycle. It appears that I'm maxing that out at high rpms. What does that indicate?
 
The fuel pump is variable voltage.... so at WOT it should be giving the pump full voltage.

The knock sensors can add timing... and have you thought of giving it a seafoaming to try and clean up some carbon?
 
So duty cycle for the fuel pump is the voltage? Because I know people on the sct forums had made it sound like it's not good if you're maxing this value out.

And yep, I just did a seafoam treatment, both through the pcv and in the gas, when I had the IMRC problem. I also cleaned the MAF the other day with some CRC maf cleaner.

Anybody else have any numbers for MAF counts, air flow, and load? I'm curious to see how my car stacks up to other gen 2s.
 
Kraze said:
So duty cycle for the fuel pump is the voltage? .
Click to expand...

Duty cycle is not voltage it's the duty cycle for the pump
100% duty cycle means the pump is maxxed out, but it is not "voltage".
 
Kraze said:
Another thing I found interesting was the fuel pump duty cycle. It appears that I'm maxing that out at high rpms. What does that indicate?
Click to expand...

If you maxxing the duty cycle, then your pump is "not up to the task"..and needs replacing, that's pretty straightforward.

you should not be maxxing the duty cycle on a N/A stock motor unless the pump is "giving up the ghost".
 
See that's what I thought. Is it weird that I'm maxing the duty cycle out but still able to get a consistent 40 psi at WOT, or is that not out of the ordinary?
 
You did a WOT fuel pressure test?

Now you may have PSI but your volume has fallen off.
it doesnt take a huge amount of volume to pressurize that itty bitty fuel rail.

NOW.. I'm not guaranteeing a fuel pump will solve the problem.
There could be underlying problems with the car that neither you or I are aware of..
could be clogged sock on the pump
leaking line internal to the tank {quite common)

I doubt seriously anyone can give you a guarantee as to what will fix your car.

BUT.... "ALL SIGNS POINT" towards a bad fuel pump.. OR some underlying issue with fuel delivery.
 
That makes sense about volume. And yep, I was fully expecting to not see 40 psi, but the car surprised me. I've been thinking the same thing about a weak fuel pump ever since I got the car, and it coincides with all my symptoms, but who knows.

And yeah I'll email it to you right away. I'll start using a different site to upload them too.. that was just the first site that popped up in a search for free file upload lol.
 
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