Is this a good deal?

lostsoul77

lostsoul77

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I'm planning to have exhaust work done in about a month or two:

I asked a co-worker to get me pricing from his performance shop to include 2 40series Flowmasters and 2.25" piping from the cat-back and 3.5-4" tips. Does the LS have an H-pipe already?


"From tim (speed shop guy):

-Your friends car will run about 480$ for parts&labor on the exhaust.
-He will need to buy an sct handheld for any tuning that needs to be done, they cost 379$
-If he wants to buy the exhaust and a handheld i will do free before and after dyno pulls, but if he wants me to play with the tune it will cost him 150$ per hour just for the tuning, And i may be able to only pull 5-10 hp out of the tune.. Price is about $1000 for mufflers, pipes tuner and a dyno beofre and after. THAT is a good deal!"

I didn't think 5-10hp was much out of an SCT tune and his reply:

"no, no, no..... he said a MANUAL tune would only squeeze 5-10 more HP over a canned tune from SCT. I'm sure the SCT (included in the $1000) would be more like 40ish with the exhaust."
 
You may get 20hp from the tune. You do not need a tune for exhaust work. You aren't even changing the diameter of the exhaust pipe. I think the gen 2's have 2.25" already. I don't think you will net more than a couple horses from redoing just the exhaust.

A dyno tune will net you more horses, but I dont' think you'll see it on the butt dyno.
 
You don't NEED a tune if you're getting exhaust work done. My car ran fine without a tune with a 2.5" exhaust for quite some time. The LS does have an H pipe, but if you're going from the cats back with new pipe, you're going to need a new crossover. I would suggest buying an X pipe and having them install it. Or have them supply it, whatever.

I paid 600-ish for my custom tune on the 300, and that was far more than 4 hours. That picked up 30 horses in some spots and 20 more peak than the canned tuned on the Predator. Nevermind the increased shift pressure, less timing retard around shifts, etc. and it's money well spent. Anyway, back to the LS...I wasn't all that impressed with the tunes for the LS that I had (from both well-known guys on here who do them). Sure, the shifting was better, but the car didn't feel any more powerful. So to get the most out of your car, I would definitely recommend a dyno tune. Just depends on if your pockets can afford it.
 
NYC, I believe you were involved in a discussion about flowmasters not being a good performance muffler? If you want sound then flows are good but for performance that a free-flowing design is better?
 
correct. I remember that as well. I don't know if it really makes a difference on the low hp apps (like the LS). But Magnaflow does flow better than Flowmaster.
 
Yea, I think the consensus was that the stock 03'+ LS had good exhaust systems stock and that there wasn't much to be gained there.
 
Mechanicboy said:
NYC, I believe you were involved in a discussion about flowmasters not being a good performance muffler? If you want sound then flows are good but for performance that a free-flowing design is better?
Click to expand...

Yessa, but that was judging by the Flows I had on my 87 LSC. I swapped them out for some Dynomax Ultra Flos (I think they were Dynomax, I forget now), but you could feel the car pull harder past 3500. It was very noticeable, even by the butt dyno. Flowmaster might've changed up how they make mufflers, so I'm not positive where they would stand these days.
 
A guy at a performance shop said a customer actually lost hp by switching to flows from stock mufflers on a charger, sounded real nice with the flows but it cost him hp.Check out all the walls in the muffler. The air has to get through all the corners and by the end it sounds nice but isn't very good for performance gains like staight through mufflers are like magnaflows or borlas

http://image.moparmusclemagazine.com/f/14207159+w750+st0/mopp_0301_16_z+flowmaster+muffler.jpg

I felt a difference when I switched from borla to flows. Flows sound real nice but I felt I lost some hp there, dont know how much but I definitely felt it.
 
My suggestion for lostsoul is that if he's willing to sped the extra for a dyno tune then he should consider a different muffer. Also there should be a video around of an LS with not mufflers and it sounded pretty good. Maybe just by some resonators instead of mufflers.

opps, my bad, gen2 already has resonators.
 
Last edited:
Ah
Why bother with mufflers.
Just replace them with straight pipe and tips.
Trust me it won't be too loud or even very loud at all.
My car with home made CAI Tune and straight pipes
purrs real nice and pulls very satisfyingly with this 300+ hp
combination.
 
04SCTLS said:
Ah
Why bother with mufflers.
Just replace them with straight pipe and tips.
Trust me it won't be too loud or even very loud at all.
My car with home made CAI Tune and straight pipes
purrs real nice and pulls very satisfyingly with this 300+ hp
combination.
Click to expand...

I thought about that but figured it may be very loud. Do you have any sound or video clips? I really want it to have a more aggressive sound more than anything; it puts out a nice sound right around 2000 rpm 1-2 gear which is what i would want all of the time. So should I only consider the dyno when I purchase a CAI?
 
All LSes have 2" exhaust cat-back stock. They are different from Gen1 to Gen2 but still 2". Its been discussed more than once and there is some false info in posts from the past. One reason why the search feature is flawed at times.

I ran the MagnaFlow system for awhile before my tune, car runs fine and picked up power, mines a Gen1 though. Most found the Gen2 gained little from exhaust or at least less than the Gen1 gained.

But you don't need a tune after a exhaust upgrade on the LS. And I doubt 40ish HP will be gained.
 
02LSE96LSC91SE84TC said:
All LSes have 2" exhaust cat-back stock. They are different from Gen1 to Gen2 but still 2". Its been discussed more than once and there is some false info in posts from the past. One reason why the search feature is flawed at times.

I ran the MagnaFlow system for awhile before my tune, car runs fine and picked up power, mines a Gen1 though. Most found the Gen2 gained little from exhaust or at least less than the Gen1 gained.

But you don't need a tune after a exhaust upgrade on the LS. And I doubt 40ish HP will be gained.
Click to expand...

So then when does a tune come into play?
 
lostsoul77 said:
So then when does a tune come into play?
Click to expand...

Major mods, not just the basics.

Intake and exhaust you will be fine on a stock tune, it just doesn't change enough. That doesn't mean that a tune won't compliment these improvements, just not a must.


My first mod was the MagnaFlow exhaust and ran fine that way, never ran at the track. Did the Intake next and ran like that for quite awhile. No issues. 14.541 was my best time in the 1/4. A tune did up my trap speed hit 98mph a few times and did get me a 14.368 time. The tune does give power, but not 40hp. I doubt all 3 mods get 40hp, maybe.
 
02LSE96LSC91SE84TC said:
All LSes have 2" exhaust cat-back stock. They are different from Gen1 to Gen2 but still 2". Its been discussed more than once and there is some false info in posts from the past. One reason why the search feature is flawed at times.
Click to expand...

ID or OD. My stock was 1 3/4" ID. Magnflow was 2 1/4 ID. Here's some pictures. There has been a section replaced in my stock exhaust so it might have had the resonators removed.

0108001415a.jpg

0108001416a.jpg

0108001416.jpg




lostsoul77 said:
So then when does a tune come into play?
Click to expand...

You shouldn't NEED one with either intake or exhaust, but adding a tune with either/or will complement the bolt-on. Many people believe that if you get an intake that a tune is a really good idea and I'm one of those people.
 
OD 2" although less at the bends less.


And you bring up a good point the MagnaFlow system is a 2.25" system, they advertise it as a 2.5". I called and suggested they fix how they advertise and list it..........bet they never did. Few people I talked to ther acted like I was sweating the small stuff or something. I like MagnaFlow, but I talked to a couple of real tools there.
 
02LSE96LSC91SE84TC said:
OD 2" although less at the bends less.


And you bring up a good point the MagnaFlow system is a 2.25" system, they advertise it as a 2.5". I called and suggested they fix how they advertise and list it..........bet they never did. Few people I talked to ther acted like I was sweating the small stuff or something. I like MagnaFlow, but I talked to a couple of real tools there.
Click to expand...

It's 2.5" OD so...
 
Buy a 2.25 clamp and it will slide right over. The clamps that come with it are stamped 2.25 right on them. The stainless ones that come with it get bound after a few on offs. I just used regular ones. My system has been on and off at least a half dozen times making minor adjustments with my diff swap. Indexing the driveshaft for it smoothest spot and such.
 
02LSE96LSC91SE84TC said:
Buy a 2.25 clamp and it will slide right over. The clamps that come with it are stamped 2.25 right on them. The stainless ones that come with it get bound after a few on offs. I just used regular ones. My system has been on and off at least a half dozen times making minor adjustments with my diff swap. Indexing the driveshaft for it smoothest spot and such.
Click to expand...

I need to get under there to check for an exhaust leak anyway, I'll see if I can borrow ramps again. I want to weld the system, but that's going to have to wait.
 
I got resonator delete, 2.25" stainless piping with manaflows and resonator double walled tips and a KKM CAI with aluminum intake tube. I could use my credit card right now to do a tune but I'm waiting til I get a new roommate to go ahead and buy anything for the LS and to see if this new job pulls through as I completely hate working for this chiropractor
 
lostsoul77 said:
I thought about that but figured it may be very loud. Do you have any sound or video clips? I really want it to have a more aggressive sound more than anything; it puts out a nice sound right around 2000 rpm 1-2 gear which is what i would want all of the time. So should I only consider the dyno when I purchase a CAI?
Click to expand...


This is from a few years ago before the WW kit but it still sounds the same.
The Jag Mina mufflers are just straight through glasspacks.
One of them fell off on me and the car wasn't any louder really so I replaced them with straight pipe.
It has the classic muscle car sound without being too loud or droning on cruise where it's quiet like stock.

YouTube- Mina Exhaust on my 04 Lincoln LS
 
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