hydrogen assisted

chocolat1701 said:
look at this video have any one ever heard of this.



is this guy a member here
Click to expand...

It's nothing new been talked about for years. Here is why it's not practical:
-Hydrogen has about half the btu content of gasoline so your power output is reduced accordingly. I met a guy that had a Shelby Cobra that ran on hydrogen it was cool but the horsepower output was a little more than half compared to running gasoline when checked on a dyno.
-He probably had an increase in gas mileage because he is adding hydrogen, using less gasoline.
-Your car will run fine on 87 octane gasoline IF you don't lean on it. The ECU is programmed to adjust for knock and retards the spark advance and fuel mixture accordingly (when people say their car runs like crap on lower octane fuel ....well DUH).
-Hydrogen was expensive until a few years ago because most of what is produced in this country is derived from natural gas. I'm sure it has come down in cost but still not viable as a fuel source.
-If you want something readily available that is practical look into CNG or LNG. You can get LNG for about 1.65 a gallon.
 
lets put it this way, if there was some magical device that actually increased fuel economy by a lot, then everyone would have it on their cars...

ford and chevy would be all over this as they are always trying to best each other with millage to sell more cars...
 
What's sad is they do have a magical device that would jump mileage. They just won't build it.
 
Telco said:
What's sad is they do have a magical device that would jump mileage. They just won't build it.
Click to expand...

They don't build it because either no one would buy it or they believe no one would buy it. Its a small low powered car.
 
1LoudLS said:
lets put it this way, if there was some magical device that actually increased fuel economy by a lot, then everyone would have it on their cars...

ford and chevy would be all over this as they are always trying to best each other with millage to sell more cars...
Click to expand...

More importantly, they would be all over it in order to meet the gummints outrageous CAFE standards!
 
Heh heh... now that I've peaked interest... I'm not talking about some magic carb or anything.

In the 1970s a fellow built a serial hybrid car that was able to maintain 45MPH all day long, while getting 70MPG. He used a jet engine starter and a 1950s generator setup to run this 36V system. Mother Earth News duplicated the project, only using a larger car, larger generator and higher voltage, and they were able to get better mileage.

Now picture someone like Ford or GM building one, and taking it seriously. Picture a purpose-built electric motor driven by a purpose-built generator, running 360V. No battery pack for extended range driving, just a small battery pack to act as a load balancer. Picture the genset using a direct injection turbodiesel engine, optimized to run at a specific RPM with the ratio between the generator and engine matched so that the diesel's most efficient engine RPM matches the generator's most efficient RPM. GM actually came close with the Volt, but they saddled it with that useless 1000lb battery pack. Without that battery pack they could size the engine, generator and motor to move a lighter car, and would likely hit the 100MPG mark.

If a man in his garage could build a car that gets 70MPG with a top speed of 45MPH using cobbled together 1950s technology, then an OEM with a multi-million dollar budget could certainly build a car that would operate with the same performance metrics as any gasoline car on the road while getting better than 100MPG.

In fact, rumor control has it that GM already did so. Remember the EV1? One of the engineers working on that project had to build a tow-behind generator for the EV1 because the battery range on the car would not allow the car to pass GM's required 24 hour endurance track test. Supposedly the EV1 pulled down better than 100MPG with that generator providing power to the car. I say rumor control in that I read about it online, but can no longer find the story I was reading about it. Either it's no longer online, or I'm not searching correctly as I read the article several years ago. Since I can't prove it with a link, I expect everyone else to take it as hearsay because I'm here saying it :D.

I went to find the article on the car from 1978, found this 70MPH, 100MPG car instead.
 
If it's too good to be true...............

If what you described was actually achievable (I've read about it before, and I am extremely skeptical) it wouldn't be commercially viable. These gensets don't even buy the leaf.
 
It is achievable. Have you ever calculated the load a locomotive pulls vs semi trucks? I did the calculations once several years back. A diesel-electric locomotive gets roughly 3-4 gallons per mile while pulling a typical load. It would take either 200 or 400 tractor trailers (can't remember which it was) loaded to capacity that are each getting about 60MPG to move the same cargo. A car with a correctly sized electric motor and a correctly sized generator would easily be able to get 100MPG while running at highway speeds.

The hard part about the electric car is not the drive section. You can get purpose built electric motors that will pull a passenger car with no problems. Youtube is even covered with videos showing electric drag racers, so the speed and acceleration are there. The problem with the electric car has always been supplying the electricity to the motor. One day the storage problem will be solved (MIT is currently working on a battery with a replaceable electrolyte, which would mean a 10 minute recharge) but until then a turbodiesel generator would do the job.

It's possible from a mechanical standpoint, but not possible from a business standpoint for an established automotive company heavily invested in gasoline engines, which is the real issue. Wouldn't be a bit surprised to find out that the automotive companies and oil companies aren't cross-invested in each other too.
 
somebody hit the nail on the head: industry is a giant cartel. why build a car that can run on abundant and nearly free hydrogen when you can sell gas for $$$$ per gallon? the cartel killed the people drivin around town in hydrogen fuel cell cars. give a google to 'stanley meyer'.

hydrogen isnt even something you have to buy. its all around you right now. humidity is water vapor. dumbasses will say electrolysis uses more energy than it produces and theyre right... for the first few thousand revolutions. if you wait til that **** gets hot enough you can make all the humidity in the air condensate and recapture the condensation as more fuel (which is not a violation of perpetual motion as other dumbasses might say). h2o in the atmosphere is more pure and better for electrolysis too... cold climates and dry climates would probably be the only places where you couldnt get hundreds of MPG via hydrogen fuel cell and electrolysis.

but its a lot easier for the multinational corporate industrial cartels to poison smart people with the engineering skills to create something like that at cracker barrel than it is to part with millions of dollars in profits
 
Again, I think you guys need to loosen you tinfoil hats a bit.

GT'a in auto applications are not efficient. Maybe if you said single lung diesel running a genset it might be believable, but it's going to be a pretty big genset and need a decent battery backup for higher load (think Prius). Back when I was tinkering with a home built gas turbine for a go cart the fuel numbers weren't that great. 5hp was around 5gph of diesel or kero.

From memory I think it takes @25hp to maintain 60mph. The LS runs around 2.25gph at 60mph (25mpg/60), the Prius I think around 1.2gph (50pmg/60). So unless you go down to motorcycle weight to lower the required HP/speed there's a limit in efficiency.

Hydrogen has a ways to go as it takes more power (electricity) to make the gas than the gas produces. CNG/ Propane is hard to find fill up stations in most of the US where they don't charge by weight. Of course, just like diesel did, if the demand increases so would the price.

Railroads are efficient because they are running steel on steel with controlled inclines / speeds. Tractor trailer, not so much with the surface friction of the tires and normal road conditions.

Mother Earth is a great read, if you take the info with a pretty big grain of salt.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Members online

No members online now.
Total: 272 (members: 0, guests: 272)
Back
Top