Engine rattles on startup

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Telco

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2003 Lincoln LS V8
2003 LS V8

I did a search before posting, and the only thing I found was a post that wound up being a stuck solenoid and the accompanying video didn't match the noise I have. When I start the car, it sounds like BBs in a coffee can for a few seconds, which then goes away. It's not a steady sound as you'd expect with a collapsed lifter, more of an irregular clatter. The only thing I can think is perhaps the alternator is crapping out because it kinda sounds like failing bearings somewhere, and I've had an alternator scatter on me before. Unfortunately I have bad hearing and have problems localizing sounds. Due to manning issues combined with holidays and natural disasters I've been working a lot lately so getting under the hood is hard to do lately. Any suggestions?
 
Well engine rattles would be timing chains but that's rare on gen II did you check all the accesory drive pulleys?
 
Not yet, planning on pulling the accessory belt off to see if the problem goes away. Might be able to work on it tomorrow, but as tomorrow is my only day off this week and I can't even guarantee I'll get it off... Maybe I'll leave an hour or two early today and give it a shot.
 
I get a similar rattle when starting it and also when I'm crusing at like 35 in auto and the car is in 5th, if I give it gas suddendly, but not enough to down shift, it with "rattle" for a second. Someone told me misfire, someone said its normal because its in 5th and you're not going fast enough and someone said the cat shield was loose or some exhaust shield. Haven't checked it out yet though.
 
Startup Rattle

Mine does the exact same thing, but only on cold startup. I assumed it was bad secondary tensioners and replaced them but that was wasted time and money. the GenII tensioners that came out looked new even at 130k miles.
Mine seems like timing chain tensioners and i have the primary TC and tensioners. Just haven't had the guts to tear it all apart.
When I did the secondary tensioners the instructions said to remove the fuel pump fuse and crank the engine to get the oil pressure up before firing it up. Tried that after i learned the secondary tensioners didn't solve the problem and found that it works, when the oil pressure is up before firing, I don't get the startup rattle. Or if the car has been fired that day, the rattle doesn't happen.
Anyone solve this one?
 
I'm using Quaker State full synth, 5W20. I put in the weight the car calls for, just don't recall exactly. Also using a Wix oil filter. Both are what I've used for the last 10 years, never had a problem.

Incidentally, never did pull the belt off to check, only had the one day off and it was a busy one. Next week though, hoping to find the time. If not this week though, I'm telling my family that I have to take a business trip and will be gone for a few days so I can have time to do the stuff I need to do.
 
That should be good. You might try 0W20 and see if that helps. (0W20 is on the approved list, and is slightly better than 5W20.)
 
Alax7 said:
I get a similar rattle when starting it and also when I'm crusing at like 35 in auto and the car is in 5th, if I give it gas suddendly, but not enough to down shift, it with "rattle" for a second. Someone told me misfire, someone said its normal because its in 5th and you're not going fast enough and someone said the cat shield was loose or some exhaust shield. Haven't checked it out yet though.
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I have had that on my 2002 since I owned it. Its difficult to localize since it only happens in overdrive and your moving :b But taking a few mechanics for a ride, they all said its the intake manifold. It raddles a bit as its allowing air through.
Given that I have put 130,000 kms on it with that raddle, it seems like nothing to worry about. Just prolly the pressure of the wind.


Not to hijack or anything, but in favor of not starting a new thread, lately my 02 is making a whining noise. I popped the hood and cant tell was it is... its sort of a low pitched humm that gets louder with the RPM. is that the Alternator? My engine itself sounds perfectly fine.
 
Telco said:
I'm telling my family that I have to take a business trip and will be gone for a few days so I can have time to do the stuff I need to do.
Click to expand...

Guilty of this I am... the hard part is getting my wife to play along :)
 
lincoln_zero said:
Not to hijack or anything, but in favor of not starting a new thread, lately my 02 is making a whining noise. I popped the hood and cant tell was it is... its sort of a low pitched humm that gets louder with the RPM. is that the Alternator? My engine itself sounds perfectly fine.
Click to expand...

I'd suggest doing what I still need to do and pull the accessory belt off, and see if the whine is still there. If it is, more checking needed. If not, it's an accessory or the belt itself. Check for frayed threads on the belt. You can also try spraying silicone lube on the pulleys, but not the belt contact point, one at a time to see if this makes the problem go away. When it does, you've found the problem. If none of the pulleys makes it go away, you can then spray the belt itself to see if that corrects it.
 
End Hijack...

Telco said:
2003 LS V8
When I start the car, it sounds like BBs in a coffee can for a few seconds, which then goes away. It's not a steady sound as you'd expect with a collapsed lifter, more of an irregular clatter. The only thing I can think is perhaps the alternator is crapping out because it kinda sounds like failing bearings somewhere, and I've had an alternator scatter on me before. Any suggestions?
Click to expand...

Any luck tracking down the source of the noise? I have the exact same thing and it's only at startup, only for a few seconds. It's not an under load pinging, it is an irregular clatter just at startup.

In my case, I know it's not the alternator because mine went bad and I replaced it but the rattle is still there.
 
Try an automotive stethoscope.. They are cheap and work really well in tracking down noise.. My money is on timing chains. They sound exactly as you described on startup.
 
The Gen II doesn't have timing chain issues.
 
Not yet. Between the overtime, the wife's medical appointments and the other little disasters around here I've not been able to get out there.
 
I haven't seen a single post on this forum regarding timing chains for the gen II. It's all been about the gen I with plastic tensioners and that was updated sometime in 2002 but I suppose it could be possible.
 
BlackLS06 said:
I haven't seen a single post on this forum regarding timing chains for the gen II. It's all been about the gen I with plastic tensioners and that was updated sometime in 2002 but I suppose it could be possible.
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Yeah, I don't remember seeing any either. However, I do know that Jaguar was still getting complaints about it. They eventually changed to a dual chain system and so far that seems to be much better.
 
Do you think mine, which was made in 9/02 would have the update then?
Is there any way to find out?
 
My Gen I was made in 5/02 and I never had any problems with tensioners. Traded at 140K.
 
blwnbyu said:
Do you think mine, which was made in 9/02 would have the update then?
Is there any way to find out?
Click to expand...

Remove the valve covers and look. You can clearly see if they are plastic or metal. These are interference engines so you really want the metal ones to be on the safe side. But with frequent oil changes the plastic ones could hold up.
 
My valve cover gasket is leaking and is getting replaced this weekend. I'll bet they are metal but I will know for sure next week.
 
BlackLS06 said:
... But with frequent oil changes the plastic ones could hold up.
Click to expand...

5K oil changes are okay as long as you use the right oil.
I suspect that not letting the engine overheat may be a factor in tensioner life too.
 
Interesting bit - started the car today, but I was a bit distracted and didn't have a good hold on the key. I turned it, and the key slipped before it did more than turn the engine over a half second or so without starting. When I started the car, no clatter at all. Any thoughts?
 
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