Hydraulic Pump - Internals - During Timing Chain Replacement

[boho]

Hi Guys,

I've asked for help before and received some great advice and now I need to ask again.
My nephew has a 2001 3.9 ls and I am half way through replacing the timing chains, tensioners, and guides. Never done a timing chain before, but with all the great advice on this site I thought I could get through it. I have hit a snag and have two questions that maybe you can help me with.

1 - I have the chains and such replaced and the Front Cover is back on. During the teardown I stowed each component and its assciated bolts and hoses in thier own boxes. I went to put back the Hydraulic Fan Pump today and in that box were two NEW pieces. It is a spring and what looks like a shiny cylinder with some groves around it (pressure relief maybe???). Both these parts came out of the 20mm hole where the high pressure hose connects from the Fan Motor to the Fan Pump. This is not the Actuator. I didn't have to remove the Actuator from the pump. I did not remove these parts from the pump. They fell out into the box. Now I don't know how they should go back in? Does the spring go on the bottom or the top. To clarify, these parts come out of the well where the dreaded 20 mm hose connection is. The one that prohibits the top right bolt from coming off the bracket. Does anyone have a diagram of the Pump internals or know how the spring and cylinder should go back in? Spring on top or spring on the bottom? There is a stem on the shiny cylinder that fits nicely into the spring.

2 - I am close to putting the Crank Shaft Pulley back on but I don't know how to arrest the crank shaft while I torque the pulley bolt. I ordered an "Everything Kit" from Christophers but there is no tool to hold the Crank Shaft while I torque that bolt. Can I put the cam shaft holding tools back on and torque the crankshaft that way or am I asking for trouble. Is there a tool I can purchase locally (Sears, Autozone, AdavnceAuto) that will do the job? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I love this site and you guys have some really great information and are always helpful. Thanks

 

[oddball]

1) I think it's spring then valve. Can you post a picture? I **think** I have a pump in my attic, but won't be able to check until Friday.

2) Use the crank flexplate locking tool that replaces the crank sensor that you used to prevent the crank from turning while doing the chains.

 

[joegr]

303-645 in the linked page is the crankshaft holding tool.
http://deneau.info/ls/s6x~us~en~file=s6x31016.htm~gen~ref.htm

 

[boho]

Thanks oddball for responding. I really appreciate it and whatever you can do. I will post some pictures of the spring and the shiny cylnder, plunger, valve, limiter, or whatever it is, tomorrow, if it stops raining here.

 

[boho]

Hi joegr, Thanks for the help. I appreciate it. I read your link and even though it's for a 2006 I think the procedure is the same, except for the variable cam timing (VCT) bush carriers, which this 2001 doesn't have. I did use the crankshaft holding tool while replacing the chains and tensioners, but along with the parts and tools I got from Christophers Foreign Auto there was a photo copied write up that states under no circumstances, UNDER PENALTY OF CASTRATION AND DEATH, should the crankshaft holding tool be used while torquing the crankshaft pulley. Now, I don't know Christopher but, from all the posts I have researched on this site I do see your input and sound advice quite a bit and I trust your input over his and mine. I'm just a little leery of doing this because when I looked at the pulse wheel it looked very thin. I'm afraid of warping or damaging the pulse wheel. I also went to the top of the link you sent and found an alphabetical listing for the crankshaft pulley. In there it says to use a "strap wrench". I never knew such a tool existed.

Please don't mistake my wimpy behavior as doubting your input. You are much more learned than I and probably more than most. It's just, I've never done a timing chain before and I don't want to screw this up for my nephew. I trust you guys here at LVC more than you could know. Without all the great advice and support I've seen here I would never have even attempted this. However, when I get conflicting instructions I like to double check before I proceed because not having done this before I honestly don't know any better.

You can probably tell from my rambling how nervous I am over this whole thing. Tomorrow I'm going to try and find a strap wrench and see how it does. If that doesn't hold, I'll try the strap wrench with the crankshaft hold tool. How's that for belt and suspenders?

 

[joegr]

No, you are probably right. Better to use a strap or chain wrench instead.

 

[boho]

Thanks joegr. I'll let you know how I make out.

 

[oddball]

Alternatively, an air impact wrench will zip down the bolt with plenty of torque (assuming it's a proper tool and not a harbor freight special). If concerned, add some loctite.

 

[oddball]

double alternatively, this is a good time to convert to an electric fan, optionally using my fan controller.

 

[boho]

Here are some pictures of the parts that fell out of Hydraulic Fan Pump. Also a picture of the High Pressure Line that attaches to the pump from the fan motor. Thanks

 

[oddball]

Sorry, turns out I do not have any pumps left, just several fan motors. I would expect you have it assembled right - with the spring on the nipple, and the valve is a press fit.

 

[boho]

Hi oddball,
I really appreciate you looking for the pump. Sorry you didn't have one but thanks for the effort.
I have it put together with the valve nipple facing down at the bottom, the spring on top of the flat of the valve, and then the high pressure connector. The valve is not a press fit and can easily move up and completly out. The reason I chose that is because I can see a faint ring around the top of the flat, the same size of the spring base, so I can assume the spring lived there. If I put the nipple up it could hit the high pressure connection and stop flow completly. I don't think that is the intention, but I'm not sure. Also there are inlet and outlet ports drilled at the bottom of the well where this all sits. I am assuming that as the pressuer builds ATF is allowed to pass by slightly impeded. As pressure builds it raises the valve against the spring, slowing the flow and allows fluid to flow back into the reservoir. Not sure but I think it makes sense. We'll see when I start it up and see the fan moving. I'll let you know. Thanks.

 

[oddball]

Hm. Well, good luck! I never got my high pressure hose off - just cut the tube, swore, then chunked the pump towards the trash can. Seems surprising that a spring would just be hanging out like that. Maybe there's supposed to be a retention clip?

 

[boho]

Thanks, I'm a former sailer and had learned how to swear with the best of them. Taking that line off brought back some cussing that I thought I had forgotten, but like riding a bike, it all came back to me quickly. Through a great deal of practice I can now get that line off and on but not without cussing. If the fan doesn't move when I start the engine, the trash can may be a good alternative. In which case I may take you up on your advice on an electric fan and use your fan controller.

I would be surprised if a retainer clip was not installed at one point. Your guess is as good as mine on where it is now or how it got out.