1987 Towncar ignition woes..

[ehrichweiss]

Hi,

As per the subject, I have a 1987 Lincoln Towncar that is giving me fits, in more ways than one.

I was driving it Sunday and it suddenly died. Once I got someone who could help me, I diagnosed it to be the ignition system and so I started buying parts for it immediately so I could be ready for whatever came my way. It took me 2 hours to pull the ignition module off thanks to the 5.5mm "bolts" and the deep and NARROW holes they made for these things...we had to cut the plastic away to pull it off. That's my first woe...anyone know what I can do to remove it more easily? I'm thinking that I'll go find some replacement screws with phillips or torx heads and never hafta think about that again...

So I managed to replace that and due to what I eventually discovered to be extreme difficulty, I did not replace the pickup coil.

Anyway, yesterday(Weds) I had it running while I tuned it up a little(had to adjust the timing, etc. and find a bad plug wire) and it suddenly died again. Same thing, no spark. I'm assuming that it's probably the pickup coil. When I tried to dismantle the distributor according to how my manual stated, with gear pullers, etc., I somehow damaged the distributor shaft itself and had to get one from a junkyard(which I think is fully functional but I haven't tried it yet because I don't want to go through this again).

Now, is there anything else I should check before I start this thing up? I've tested the coil and it seems fine(though measures completely differently from what the manual says...I get 7kohm on this and a new coil...manual says 14kohm or more on one).

If I've left anything out that is crucial, let me know and I'll be happy to fill in the blanks.

Thanx

Eric
:L

 

[Pepsi2185]

Be glad you changed the ignition, some are recalled and start fires. So that was not in vain. As far as the shutting down, there is module on the front of the distributor that says motorcraft on it. That is the ignition module. That is one possibility. But as always it can be anything. Shutting down can range between the coil to the ignition module to a wiring issue. Make sure you give the harnesses the ol wire wiggle test. See if you can get it to shut down by moving the harnesses and plugs. Does the junk yard distributor have the ignition module on it??? You might have killed two birds with one stone. When the car shuts down does it shut down for a few minutes or just for a sec???? If it is for a few minutes, bring some tools with you and do some tests when it shuts down.

 

[ehrichweiss]

Be glad you changed the ignition, some are recalled and start fires. So that was not in vain. As far as the shutting down, there is module on the front of the distributor that says motorcraft on it. That is the ignition module. That is one possibility. But as always it can be anything. Shutting down can range between the coil to the ignition module to a wiring issue. Make sure you give the harnesses the ol wire wiggle test. See if you can get it to shut down by moving the harnesses and plugs. Does the junk yard distributor have the ignition module on it??? You might have killed two birds with one stone. When the car shuts down does it shut down for a few minutes or just for a sec???? If it is for a few minutes, bring some tools with you and do some tests when it shuts down.

The junkyard distributor had everything on it but it, again, doesn't seem to want to work..BUT I haven't tested that there is actually voltage at the module yet so I'm uncertain if it was already blown, if the wiring blew it(though I thought it was supposed to overheat, not simply burn out in under 1/2 sec), or if the wiring is the culprit.

As for it shutting down, when it happens, it seems quite permanent. And I haven't gotten it running again to see what the difference is yet.

 

[ehrichweiss]

Ok,

I got another distributor from the junkyard, installed it..no spark..or so I thought. I haven't yet gotten to test this fully but while the engine was cranking, I happened to just grab the coil wire to see if ANY voltage was there and there wasn't..so I told my assistant to stop and THEN came the shock...literally..voltage THEN came across the wire and gave me a jolt. Figuring that was a sign that maybe the wires needed wiggling, we got it cranking again..and I got a small shock when it started cranking and one when she stopped cranking it but the wires didn't seem to have any effect.

Now in the old days of breaker ignitions, I'd say that was the condenser BUT this thing apparenty doesn't have one since it's TFI-IV but does have a "radio interference capacitor"(that no parts store has in stock around here apparently). Could this be the cause? I surely hope it's not been something this silly all this time.

Thanx again for any help

Eric

 

[Pepsi2185]

Test for voltage at the coil. When you are cranking, test for negative and positive into the coil. Sometimes i jump the coil straight from the battery, but unplug the coil first, it may feedback into the computer. If it fired up, check the links blue, and wiring, possible ignition supressor or something like that.

 

[ehrichweiss]

Test for voltage at the coil. When you are cranking, test for negative and positive into the coil. Sometimes i jump the coil straight from the battery, but unplug the coil first, it may feedback into the computer. If it fired up, check the links blue, and wiring, possible ignition supressor or something like that.

What do you mean by "check the links blue" and "possible ignition suppressor" exactly?? BTW, I shorted around what I *think* is the ballast resistor(I don't know for certain..didn't think electronic ignition had those but it is a resistor, I know that for sure) that goes to the coil. That gave me some tremendous voltage going through the coil...even when the engine wasn't cranking...but wasn't enough to cause a spark apparently.

Anyway, I've replaced everything I can think of at this point...ignition module, pickup coil, computer, and I tested a new coil(that I took back because mine seems fully functional) all to no avail.

Another week of this and I'm gonna have a lot of parts for sale....

 

[Pepsi2185]

Wow!!!!!!! You cannot win!!!!!!

-20ga blue is a fuseable link. This problem may take a lot of testing. At the distributor i am seeing yellow/light green, Dark blue, and black/orange between the ignition module on the distrubutor and the Engine controller.
-Red/ light green should have 12volts in run at the ignition module at the distributor, it should go between the ignition module on the distributor and one side of the coil that is attatched to the capacitor.
-white/lightblue at the ignition module on the distributor should have continuity with darkgreen/ yellow at teh coil. Between the Engine controller at the firewall (dark green/yellow) and the coil is the suppression resistor.
-red/ light blue should have continuity from the starter solonoid on the fender and the ignition module.

When check continuity unplug one side of the circuit. The meter will measure continuity through the other parts of the circuit if unplugged even if the wire is cut.

Also unplug the engine controller and make sure all the pins are connected. I had an issue with this in my 88. Keep us posted. If you do not have a meter you can try back probing with a test light or a light bulb, but unplug both sides of the wire.

 

[ehrichweiss]

Wow!!!!!!! You cannot win!!!!!!

That's the most accurate statement to date. I finally found my engine code scanner, plugged it in and.....got absolutely nothing..at all. It seems the wiring is shot and I'm not about to a)trace the problem myself or b)spend the $$$ having someone else do it. I'm seriously considering going to a junkyard, finding an older 302 with carburation and points(temporarily anyway) and putting it in it as a winter project. But at the same time, I've been considering checking out how easy it is to make such a big car run on water that's been split into hydrogen and oxygen(actually something close to it anyway).

 

[Pepsi2185]

Could be an ECU issue too. It wont be that bad to test it. Check continuity of all of your ignition system wires, lol. Hang in there bro. Hell, do you live in mich, we can have a car repair party.

theoretically that works but the amount of energy needed to convert water into separate components makes that setup completely inefficient.