Using Hydraulic cooling pump as idler pulley in electric fan conversion Ls V6

Thomw

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Just finished the electric fan conversion on my '01 Lincoln LS V6. I ran it with the pump looped for about a week until it froze up and spun the pulley. I couldn't bring myself to fork out $175.00 (Ebay) for, what in essence, is an idler pulley. The cheap and, hopefully, reliable solution was to gut the frozen pump and install an idler pulley in place of the pump shaft.

Here's a list of off the shelf parts:

Gates 38009 Idler Pulley (I went with a 3” thinking it would decrease the torque on the idler bolt)

4-1/2” x 5/8” bolt (went with that length to get enough shoulder for the pulley and and pump bearing)

(11) 5/8” flat washers

(3) 5/8” nuts

13/16” x 107-1/8” belt (Napa by Gates Micro-V AT 25/061066)

I started out by removing the large rear snap ring and pretty much just dumped out the guts of the pump. There was a second, small snap ring, more parts and that released the pump shaft to pull out from the front. I left the original (frozen) bearing in place. I mounted a flat washer that fit nicely against the bearing of the idler pulley. I purchased everything from Napa and made sure their washers would seat okay. I went to Home Depot later that day and their washers would not have worked: too large of diameter. Next the idler pulley was placed on the bolt with four more washers between the pulley and pump bearing (face of the pump). Four worked for me, but these are not precision parts, so the idea is to place the pulley the same distance from the pump as the original. YMMV.

The bolt was placed into the pump and I added enough washers to cover the shoulder of the bolt, plus a couple more. I installed a 5/8” nut and tightened it with a 13/16” deep socket on a 1/2” drive and a 13/16 box end. Two grunts worth. Plenty tight, but not insanely tight. I've sheared off or stripped more bolts than I care to remember. I added half a dozen more washers to finish off the end of the bolt with a nut just for good measure. I would like to have double nutted the first nut, but obviously couldn't bet a wrench in the pump body. If I was to do it again, I might use a longer bolt to at least get a double nut in
there somewhere but this is flush with the back of the pump. The bolt could also be cut and the original back and snap ring could be reinstalled.

It took two tries on the belt to get the right length. The size up from the 107-1/8 was too long. The 107-1/8” took a lot of torque on the tensioner, but it worked. One 3/8” longer may have been better. I used a large Crescent wrench on the tensioner with a cheater bar and prayed it didn't slip and shear off the infamous small nipple on the overpriced/overengineered radiator hose assembly. I've replaced that hose twice because of the broken nipple.

Total outlay was just under $75.00 and took about 5 hours including shopping.

Washer spacing.jpg


Pump Front.jpg


Pump Rear.jpg
 
Nice work. I don't know how the belt is setup on the v6 but on the v8 you can just remove the pump and use a shorter belt.
 
Yahoo!

Been wondering what to do with my V6 pump when it dies again. Not gonna spend a ton of money repairing the hydra. Great work! Now I know what to do with the pump. What type of fan did you use and what about the electronics?
 
As other v6 owner's have found, the belt would run over top of itself if the pulley is not there. Jealous of V8 owner's in that respect.
 
I originally bought a 2003 LS V6 electric fan with shroud off ebay. Hooked it up to 12V expecting it to run at full speed because of no signal to controls inside fan. Nada. Removed fan from shroud and installed a 16" electric fan I had in the garage. I looked online and 16" seems to be at the upper end of fan diameters, so I took a chance on it. It fit nicely into the 2003 shroud with no duct taping or sealing of gaps needed. I bought it at Pep Boys probably 10 years ago and never used it. No name on it and no box. Sorry.
The controller is a Compressor Works Model # 733647 from Autozone for $35 because I was in a hurry. Napa had one for $75 but I knew it was going to be temporary. None of these had a speed control, only adjustment for temperature on from the probe in the radiator. I'm probably going to go with the Delta Controls shown it Telco's post "On a hard search". It has temp and speed controls and ramps up the speed rather that instant on.
I'm in the High Desert of California so it's a good test ground for the setup, however it's only been around 70 degrees max since the conversion. I'm not convinced this vehicle needs the 3000 cfm talked about in the forum, but I'm sure I'll be posting this summer.
 
i would like thank you for your information. i have a 2002 ls v6 with a leaky pump, the car had been out of commission for almost 6 months. i used this thread to convert my pump into a idler pulley and it works amazingly. i went with a 16 inch electric fan that flows 1500 cfm and it has stayed at n.o.t. ever since. i just wanted to thank you and also attest to this method working.
 
I originally bought a 2003 LS V6 electric fan with shroud off ebay. Hooked it up to 12V expecting it to run at full speed because of no signal to controls inside fan. Nada. ...

The fan has four wires. You must connect three of these four to get it to run at full speed. One of the heavy wires is ground, and the other heavy wire is constant power. One of the small wires (sorry, forgot which color) is power for the electronics and you must connect it to 12V when you want the fan to run.
 
Ooops.... Never mind, I solved my question. Thanks for the info. This solved my whole issue. Was gonna use a 6 inch pulley to match the existing pump, but couldn't get one fast enough. Went with a 4 inch pulley, and a brand new belt stock size, and works fine.
 
I originally bought a 2003 LS V6 electric fan with shroud off ebay. Hooked it up to 12V expecting it to run at full speed because of no signal to controls inside fan. Nada. Removed fan from shroud and installed a 16" electric fan I had in the garage. I looked online and 16" seems to be at the upper end of fan diameters, so I took a chance on it. It fit nicely into the 2003 shroud with no duct taping or sealing of gaps needed. I bought it at Pep Boys probably 10 years ago and never used it. No name on it and no box. Sorry.
The controller is a Compressor Works Model # 733647 from Autozone for $35 because I was in a hurry. Napa had one for $75 but I knew it was going to be temporary. None of these had a speed control, only adjustment for temperature on from the probe in the radiator. I'm probably going to go with the Delta Controls shown it Telco's post "On a hard search". It has temp and speed controls and ramps up the speed rather that instant on.
I'm in the High Desert of California so it's a good test ground for the setup, however it's only been around 70 degrees max since the conversion. I'm not convinced this vehicle needs the 3000 cfm talked about in the forum, but I'm sure I'll be posting this summer.

If you do use the Delta control post up how you like it. I used one of their older ones, but the company shut down for a while and then came out with a redesigned version that I've not used so I have no idea if they are still as good as they used to be. They seemed to care about making a quality product then, hoping they still do.
 
Ooops.... Never mind, I solved my question. Thanks for the info. This solved my whole issue. Was gonna use a 6 inch pulley to match the existing pump, but couldn't get one fast enough. Went with a 4 inch pulley, and a brand new belt stock size, and works fine.

I haven't changed the pully on mine. is that why its making a loud ticking noise?
 
Just finished the electric fan conversion on my '01 Lincoln LS V6. I ran it with the pump looped for about a week until it froze up and spun the pulley. I couldn't bring myself to fork out $175.00 (Ebay) for, what in essence, is an idler pulley. The cheap and, hopefully, reliable solution was to gut the frozen pump and install an idler pulley in place of the pump shaft.

Here's a list of off the shelf parts:

Gates 38009 Idler Pulley (I went with a 3” thinking it would decrease the torque on the idler bolt)

4-1/2” x 5/8” bolt (went with that length to get enough shoulder for the pulley and and pump bearing)

(11) 5/8” flat washers

(3) 5/8” nuts

13/16” x 107-1/8” belt (Napa by Gates Micro-V AT 25/061066)

I started out by removing the large rear snap ring and pretty much just dumped out the guts of the pump. There was a second, small snap ring, more parts and that released the pump shaft to pull out from the front. I left the original (frozen) bearing in place. I mounted a flat washer that fit nicely against the bearing of the idler pulley. I purchased everything from Napa and made sure their washers would seat okay. I went to Home Depot later that day and their washers would not have worked: too large of diameter. Next the idler pulley was placed on the bolt with four more washers between the pulley and pump bearing (face of the pump). Four worked for me, but these are not precision parts, so the idea is to place the pulley the same distance from the pump as the original. YMMV.

The bolt was placed into the pump and I added enough washers to cover the shoulder of the bolt, plus a couple more. I installed a 5/8” nut and tightened it with a 13/16” deep socket on a 1/2” drive and a 13/16 box end. Two grunts worth. Plenty tight, but not insanely tight. I've sheared off or stripped more bolts than I care to remember. I added half a dozen more washers to finish off the end of the bolt with a nut just for good measure. I would like to have double nutted the first nut, but obviously couldn't bet a wrench in the pump body. If I was to do it again, I might use a longer bolt to at least get a double nut in
there somewhere but this is flush with the back of the pump. The bolt could also be cut and the original back and snap ring could be reinstalled.

It took two tries on the belt to get the right length. The size up from the 107-1/8 was too long. The 107-1/8” took a lot of torque on the tensioner, but it worked. One 3/8” longer may have been better. I used a large Crescent wrench on the tensioner with a cheater bar and prayed it didn't slip and shear off the infamous small nipple on the overpriced/overengineered radiator hose assembly. I've replaced that hose twice because of the broken nipple.

Total outlay was just under $75.00 and took about 5 hours including shopping.

View attachment 828452972

View attachment 828452973

View attachment 828452974
 
My pump is still good, the pulley itself broke off. Can’t find a replacement pump anywhere. I saw your thread about converting it to an idler pulley. Where is the snap ring on the pump itself so I can dump out the guys if the pump. Tried running a shorter belt and just bypassing the pulley, but that won’t work. Here is what my hydraulic pump looks like.
Just finished the electric fan conversion on my '01 Lincoln LS V6. I ran it with the pump looped for about a week until it froze up and spun the pulley. I couldn't bring myself to fork out $175.00 (Ebay) for, what in essence, is an idler pulley. The cheap and, hopefully, reliable solution was to gut the frozen pump and install an idler pulley in place of the pump shaft.

Here's a list of off the shelf parts:

Gates 38009 Idler Pulley (I went with a 3” thinking it would decrease the torque on the idler bolt)

4-1/2” x 5/8” bolt (went with that length to get enough shoulder for the pulley and and pump bearing)

(11) 5/8” flat washers

(3) 5/8” nuts

13/16” x 107-1/8” belt (Napa by Gates Micro-V AT 25/061066)

I started out by removing the large rear snap ring and pretty much just dumped out the guts of the pump. There was a second, small snap ring, more parts and that released the pump shaft to pull out from the front. I left the original (frozen) bearing in place. I mounted a flat washer that fit nicely against the bearing of the idler pulley. I purchased everything from Napa and made sure their washers would seat okay. I went to Home Depot later that day and their washers would not have worked: too large of diameter. Next the idler pulley was placed on the bolt with four more washers between the pulley and pump bearing (face of the pump). Four worked for me, but these are not precision parts, so the idea is to place the pulley the same distance from the pump as the original. YMMV.

The bolt was placed into the pump and I added enough washers to cover the shoulder of the bolt, plus a couple more. I installed a 5/8” nut and tightened it with a 13/16” deep socket on a 1/2” drive and a 13/16 box end. Two grunts worth. Plenty tight, but not insanely tight. I've sheared off or stripped more bolts than I care to remember. I added half a dozen more washers to finish off the end of the bolt with a nut just for good measure. I would like to have double nutted the first nut, but obviously couldn't bet a wrench in the pump body. If I was to do it again, I might use a longer bolt to at least get a double nut in
there somewhere but this is flush with the back of the pump. The bolt could also be cut and the original back and snap ring could be reinstalled.

It took two tries on the belt to get the right length. The size up from the 107-1/8 was too long. The 107-1/8” took a lot of torque on the tensioner, but it worked. One 3/8” longer may have been better. I used a large Crescent wrench on the tensioner with a cheater bar and prayed it didn't slip and shear off the infamous small nipple on the overpriced/overengineered radiator hose assembly. I've replaced that hose twice because of the broken nipple.

Total outlay was just under $75.00 and took about 5 hours including shopping.

View attachment 828452972

View attachment 828452973
Here’s what my hydraulic pump looks like. I can’t find one anywhere. Where is the snap ring so I can attempt to convert mine to an idler pulley like yours?

2B20A0A3-50AC-47A2-9A1A-28862C28E0DE.jpeg
 
Use the search function at the top of the page... and type in "hydraulic pump bypass" (without the quotes)

That will give you a few links to read on how to delete the hydraulic pump completely.
 

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