Thank Obama for the upcoming depression

MonsterMark

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The FEDS have finally sounded the alarm bell by tapping a pencil on the desk.
The Obama administration is driving the US economy over the cliff.

The 3 Republican RINO's that voted for Finance Reform just put the final dagger in the U.S. economy.

Too stupid to know they're stupid. That explains the Obama administration.

Fed hints at upcoming depression
 
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Obama and Eminem should get together and rap about the destruction of the USA.

Time to celebrate.

rap.jpg
 
I have been saying since last winter, hell fall even, that this recession would probably last for around 5+ years....

I'm not really worried about it. I don't forsee our economic situation getting much worse. Especially not after elections, since we will just be left with squabbling and fighting between the legislature and executive branch, and not a whole lot being done by either.

Of course you know, a euro being worth $1.29..... pretty weak euro still. What interests me is how high the yen has climbed, ¥83 to the dollar... wow. When the dollar was still strong, it always hovered around ¥100-108 to the dollar. This really goes to show how weak the euro and dollar are right now.

Oh well, we are going to have to learn to stop comparing our current economy to the unnatural growth we had all become accustomed to for the past 10+ years.... This was inevitable.
 
There's simply no excuse for a prolonged depression. None. There are so many ways that this recession could be shortened, and Obama is deliberately avoiding all of them.

Running up record trillion-dollar deficits, passing mountains of legislative paperwork with tax increases embedded, and increasing regulation on businesses has forced companies to downsize and sit on cash out of uncertainty of what Obama is going to do next. If he would cut income and capital gains taxes and slash spending, corporate and consumer confidence would come back very quickly.

This is a clear cut example of intentional destruction - and I am worried about it. My wife is going to lose her job thanks to this economy. This situation can only be forestalled if the Republicans win in November, grow some balls, and start rolling some of this reckless, destructive stuff back. Otherwise, we're sunk - fiscally we're already dead man walking.

There's no reason we should have to get used to this. That's Jimmy Carter talk.
 
How much of this debt is due to the damn war?

We've spent about a trillion dollars since 2001 on the "War on Terror."

Our federal government has run up a trillion dollar deficit ALREADY this year- and there are still three more months until the end of the fiscal year.

The problems didn't start with Obama, but he is compounding them at a revolutionary rate.

It'd be like if we were in a plane that was suffering engine failure, so we turn to the cabin and ask if anyone knows how to fly. And the guy the passengers pick has not only never flown before, but decides to push the sticks forward and give it full throttle...because he's got somewhere to be quickly and he'll just clean up the mess after they get there.
 
How much of this debt is due to the damn war?

Projected from the deficit over the next 9 years, MUCH MORE than what is due to TARP and stimulus. But not as large as what is due to BuSh's destruction of the economy. ALL of which pales in comparison to the debt that results from the BuSh tax cuts.

Deficit hawks, you can THANK YOUR REPUBLICAN REPRESENTATIVES AND THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION for the largest majority of the deficit burden being placed on your children, and for doing everthing they can to prolong it by fighting Obama's stimulus, fighting unemployement benefits, fighting to continue BuSh's tax cuts.
 
There's simply no excuse for a prolonged depression. None. There are so many ways that this recession could be shortened, and Obama is deliberately avoiding all of them.

Running up record trillion-dollar deficits, passing mountains of legislative paperwork with tax increases embedded, and increasing regulation on businesses has forced companies to downsize and sit on cash out of uncertainty of what Obama is going to do next. If he would cut income and capital gains taxes and slash spending, corporate and consumer confidence would come back very quickly.

This is a clear cut example of intentional destruction - and I am worried about it. My wife is going to lose her job thanks to this economy. This situation can only be forestalled if the Republicans win in November, grow some balls, and start rolling some of this reckless, destructive stuff back. Otherwise, we're sunk - fiscally we're already dead man walking.

There's no reason we should have to get used to this. That's Jimmy Carter talk.

I hear a lot of strategies that people insist would work.... but honestly, in my opinion, it is generally just talk. I don't see any of those things really working. The economy overinflated at an unnatural rate. We could bandaid everything and be right back where we are in another 5 years, or we could settle into a pattern of slow steady growth like we are doing now.
 
Projected from the deficit over the next 9 years, MUCH MORE than what is due to TARP and stimulus. But not as large as what is due to BuSh's destruction of the economy. ALL of which pales in comparison to the debt that results from the BuSh tax cuts.

Deficit hawks, you can THANK YOUR REPUBLICAN REPRESENTATIVES AND THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION for the largest majority of the deficit burden being placed on your children, and for doing everthing they can to prolong it by fighting Obama's stimulus, fighting unemployement benefits, fighting to continue BuSh's tax cuts.
Convenient that your chart doesn't show Obamacare and the $20 trillion in bailouts as well as Porkulus, and assumes the Bush tax cuts will NOT expire. You can't cherrypick your stats and still maintain your pitiful integrity.

FIND said:
we could settle into a pattern of slow steady growth like we are doing now.
There is no growth. Raising taxes and overspending only stunts growth.
 
Convenient that your chart doesn't show Obamacare and the $20 trillion in bailouts as well as Porkulus, and assumes the Bush tax cuts will NOT expire. You can't cherrypick your stats and still maintain your pitiful integrity.

Read the full article (you apparently failed to do so when I posted the link in the other thread). Health care reform & stumulus is in there, it's the teensy weensy light blue line that hardly adds anything long term called "recovery measures", see Table 1 of the article.

What $20T bailout?? Oh, the one extrapolated projection made that "might" be worst case if an impossible event occurs??

"The $23.7 trillion estimate generally includes programs at the hypothetical maximum size envisioned when they were established,” Williams said. “It was never likely that all these programs would be ‘maxed out’ at the same time.”

Yeah, well that's in there too.

As for the extension of the BuSh tax cuts?? Well, thanks for acknowledging what a debt burden the WOULD create if they are extended, like every REPUBLICAN and tea-bagger wants to do. So now you are advocating letting them expire?? No? Didn't think so. Can't have it both ways cry-baby. Any idiot can see from the chart the effect they have by themselves, that was one of the main points of the study, idiot.
 
Blame anybody but that A S S H O L E that's now been coronated.

Projected from the deficit over the next 9 years, MUCH MORE than what is due to TARP and stimulus. But not as large as what is due to BuSh's destruction of the economy. ALL of which pales in comparison to the debt that results from the BuSh tax cuts.

Deficit hawks, you can THANK YOUR REPUBLICAN REPRESENTATIVES AND THE BUSH ADMINISTRATION for the largest majority of the deficit burden being placed on your children, and for doing everthing they can to prolong it by fighting Obama's stimulus, fighting unemployement benefits, fighting to continue BuSh's tax cuts.

Actually, it's all Lincoln's fault. If he'd only been a better liar...

No, wait a minute. If that son-of-a-BITCH Washington... Or maybe it was Adams...

KS
 
As for the extension of the BuSh tax cuts?? Well, thanks for acknowledging what a debt burden the WOULD create if they are extended

You have absolutely no grasp of economics, do you. Incentives matter and your entire "analysis" ignores that fact; which makes it absurd from an economic point of view.

This line is the best example of that. The ONLY way you could conclude that tax CUTS are a debt burden is by ignoring the incentive structure involved and how tax cuts and/or tax increases alter that incentive structure; static vs. dynamic analysis.
 
we could settle into a pattern of slow steady growth like we are doing now.

What growth?

At best, production and consumption from next year is being pulled into this year. We will have a double dip recession after the Bush tax cuts lapse. It is all about incentives.
 
Johnny is so myopic, he will never blame Obama, even after the US goes under.
 
You have absolutely no grasp of economics, do you. Incentives matter and your entire "analysis" ignores that fact; which makes it absurd from an economic point of view.

This line is the best example of that. The ONLY way you could conclude that tax CUTS are a debt burden is by ignoring the incentive structure involved and how tax cuts and/or tax increases alter that incentive structure; static vs. dynamic analysis.

I'm supposed to believe some dumb a s s on a car site politics blog before I believe BuSh's OWN economists???

Hey Mitch McConnell, Bush Economists Said Tax Cuts Did Grow the Deficit
Jul 14 2010, 10:36 AM ET

Republicans are entitled to their own opinions, but they're not entitled to their own separate reality. When Republican Sen. Jon Kyl said on Fox News that tax cuts had no impact on the deficit, that was bad enough. But Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell grabs the wacko baton and sprints ahead when he tells TPMDC's Brian Beutler that "there's no evidence whatsoever that the Bush tax cuts actually diminished revenue. They increased revenue because of the vibrancy of these tax cuts in the economy."

Sen. McConnell might not believe the evidence provided by the Congressional Budget Office, the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget, the Joint Tax Committee, or the Brookings Institution, all of which concludes that the Bush tax cuts added to the deficit.

But surely he should believe President George W. Bush's own Ph.D-wielding economists. Many of them have gone on the record to say that while they supported the tax cuts, they didn't for one second believe they raised government revenue.

1) The Council of Economic Advisers' Report to the President, 2003: "Although the economy grows in response to tax reductions (because of higher consumption in the short run and improved incentives in the long run), it is unlikely to grow so much that lost tax revenue is completely recovered by the higher level of economic activity."

2) The chair of CEA from 2003-2005, Greg Mankiw: "Some supply-siders like to claim that the distortionary effect of taxes is so large that increasing tax rates reduces tax revenue. Like most economists, I don't find that conclusion credible for most tax hikes, and I doubt Mr. Paulson does either."

3) He's right! Hank Paulson, Bush's last Treasury Secretary, doesn't: "As a general rule, I don't believe that tax cuts pay for themselves."

4) That opinion was shared by Andrew Samwick, Chief Economist on Council of Economic Advisers, 2003-2004: "No thoughtful person believes that this possible offset [the Bush tax cuts] more than compensated for the first effect for these tax cuts. Not a single one."...

5) ... and Edward Lazear, chair of the Council of Economic Advisers in 2007: "I certainly would not claim that tax cuts pay for themselves."

Are you calling BuSh's own economic advisors liars too? Or are you just spouting the same tired rhetoric spewed by the right wing whackos?? You have extablished ZERO credibility WRT econimic issues. The ONLY thing you know anything about is obscure rules of debate and right wing talking points. If you have nothing to add except dismissal and insults and are unable to challenge me w/ facts or evidence, STFU.
 
The argument that the "tax cuts pay for themselves" largely comes from the left in setting up a straw man misrepresentation of supply side economics. While the tax cuts often do pay for themselves (like the capital gains tax cuts in 2003 did) they don't always do so. From this link:
Myth: Supply-side economics assumes that all tax cuts immediately pay for themselves.

Fact: It assumes replenishment of some but not necessarily all lost revenues. Supply-side economics never contended that all tax cuts pay for themselves. Rather the Laffer Curve merely formalizes the common-sense observations that: Tax revenues depend on the tax base as well as the tax rate; raising tax rates discourages the taxed behavior and shrinks the tax base, offsetting some of the revenue gains; and lowering tax rates encourages the taxed behavior and expands the tax base, offsetting some of the revenue loss.

However, they are not automatically a loss because people adjust their activities in response to the tax cuts (which was my original point). We will see this when the Bush cuts lapse next year. If the Dems had any interested in truly "helping the little man" they would extend those cuts. Instead, they are insuring a double dip recession by not extending those cuts.

Tax cuts are unquestionably stimulative. Whereas the Keynesian approach to stimulus has been shown to fail. You cannot "prime the pump".

The only way you could think tax cuts are an automatic contributor to the deficit is to use a static analysis which ignores the fact that humans adjust their activity, in both production and consumption, in response to tax cuts and tax increases. This reality will be all to clear next year.

FYI: the CBO as well as the Joint Committee on Taxation (JCT) uses static analysis, which is why their estimates tend to be practically worthless. They underestimate the negative impact of spending increases and/or tax increases as well as overestimating the negative impact of tax cuts and decreased spending. No wonder liberals love to use static analysis. :rolleyes:

Here is a decent little blog highlighting the flaws of static analysis:
It is absolutely mind boggling how people continue to confuse higher tax rates with higher tax revenues. Numerous pundits continue to argue that we need to raise tax rates to fund the growing budget deficit. But raising tax rates is one sure way of making sure the budget deficit grows even larger.

There are only two ways to shrink a deficit: 1) Spend less money. 2) Generate more revenue. Spending less money is a great idea, but given all the promises the government has made to various constituents, this is not likely to happen in the near future. Therefore, we must raise more revenue, but that will not happen by raising tax rates.

Higher tax rates are a recipe for reduced employment and slower economic growth (or a more severe recession). Time and time again, we have seen how tax rate cuts have spurred employment, economic growth, and tax revenues. Budget deficits during such lower tax rate/higher tax revenue eras are the result of uncontrolled spending, not the result of less revenue.

Politicians should be clear and honest. Tell us we need more tax revenue, not higher tax rates. Then lower tax rates to make sure we get the revenue we need.​
It is also worth noting that most economists are empiricist in nature and Bush's economic advisors where generally Keynesians. This leads to exceedingly conservative estimates of when it comes to the effect of tax cuts.

The truth is that tax policy was hardly even a factor in this recession. However, Dem's love to use Bush's tax cuts as a scapegoat.
 
I'm supposed to believe some dumb a s s on a car site politics blog before I believe BuSh's OWN economists???



Are you calling BuSh's own economic advisors liars too? Or are you just spouting the same tired rhetoric spewed by the right wing whackos?? You have extablished ZERO credibility WRT econimic issues. The ONLY thing you know anything about is obscure rules of debate and right wing talking points. If you have nothing to add except dismissal and insults and are unable to challenge me w/ facts or evidence, STFU.
Once again, Johnny "EXTABLISHES" the low bar for class and literacy on this forum. :bowrofl:

And notice - his arguments always boil down to BUSHBUSHBUSHBUSHBUSH. Talk about tired rhetoric.
 

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