2000 Lincoln LS 3.9 v-8, I've had the car for about 3 years, bought used, always ran great. I let it sit for about a year with routine start-ups once a month or so. Two weeks ago I was having what felt and seemed like mis-fires as well as strong shaking of the engine as well as the car itself. I than checked the plugs and right away noticed oil in the spark plug wells, all 8 of them had oil in them. worth noting;(two of the wells had evidence of water mixed with oil, in the form of milk-shake color as well as being able to see the water floating atop the oil around those wells.) I than came to the conclusion of replacing the valve cover gaskets, coils & boots, as well as all new plugs. I just finish the job and put the motor back together and went to go start it, and right away noticed thick white smoke from the exhaust, at first I was not to concern because I just got done doing maintenance however after a little bit of acceleration and a few minutes of idle it was getting clearly more thicker and worse until finally the engine just slowly idle down to a stop, I than re started the engine in which again the thick heavy white smoke re appeared and the motor again came to a slow idle in which it stopped. Its worth noting that my exhaust pipes as well as the muffler is a little rusted and there is clear sign of water dripping from the rust spots where rust has made a whole. I moved the car and was astounded to see how much water and what looked like a hint of a rainbow like appearance in mist of the water on the ground. Two questions. Do I have a blown head gasket? Can anyone give me another idea of what to look for as to what it could be?
Need help with diagnoising 2000 Lincoln LS 3.9 v8
- Thread starter GearHead
- Start date
Yes, as much as I could, with a syringe and hose. Very little if any was left. I am pretty sure that the water out of the exhaust is the coolant that is being burn off and causing the smoke and the water is whats left of the burning process that is being expelled out of exhaust with the white smoke.
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
Odd. It's not impossible, but if it is, it will be only the third that I have ever heard of.
You should be able to rule it out or in with a cylinder leak down test.
The water that was in some of the wells was probably rain water due to failed seals under the wiper cowl.
You should be able to rule it out or in with a cylinder leak down test.
The water that was in some of the wells was probably rain water due to failed seals under the wiper cowl.
If the water and oil mixture did somehow manage to be more than I thought and was able to go into the engine from the well, we`re still only talking max perhaps 20cc`s of water, how long would it take for that to burn off?
For the record I just made the worlds first lincoln ls SMOKE FOG machine lol. thats how much smoke i am referring too.
For the record I just made the worlds first lincoln ls SMOKE FOG machine lol. thats how much smoke i am referring too.
Well I plan running an compression or cylinder leak down test tommorow as well as a dye test. That should give me a base line or put me on the right track to the culprit. I see what ur saying about the incompression, but doubt it for one because on my boat i have hydroloc the engine and have gotten back splash through the exhaust into the engine manifolds that I would have to drain to get right, and that never caused damage to gasket or heads. But rn i am assuming anything is a possibility. But the more I think about it, your thought sounds really good, I didnt have the smoke before doing the valve covor gaskets, I do the job, left some water/oil in the spark plug wells, it goes into the engine, I slap it all back together and right away at first start-up new syptom of white smoke from the incombustable/incompressable water and or oil blowing a gasket and or hopefully not damage to head. It`s worth noting if we are on the same page here that the first start up of the engine, I had no signs of trouble, engine turned over smoothly and idle smoothly before slowing down after a min of white smoke (i think the slow idle was just side effect of the engine not being able to breath from the thick smoke)
also thank you for all the in-put, it`s good to have someone to bounce ideas off of and too
Quick Update for what it`s worth may help with diagnosing: I have been busy last couple days getting the boat in shape and dropped in the water, so have not had the time to do inspect or look at the lincoln in question, went out to the garage today to take a look at it and started her up and was again flogged down by a bad battery, i have it on the charger now awaiting a pressure test. I took a quick glance at my coolant levels and I am def. down a good QT. if not more. I plan to also fill that up and let it run to see if I am loosing it and perhaps where. Also worth noting is that when I replaced the cover gaskets, I had to take the hydraulic-fluid reservoir out, and upon disconnection of hose`s I noticed the fluid was very milky in color, almost thick and pink. Once I put it all back together after the cover gasket job I tried to expelled and drain as much as possible to re-fill it up with fresh fluid; Today on my quick inspection I noticed it is again milky and pink in appearnce instead of the bright and rich red color of the Mercon V. Not sure if this has much to do with anything doubt it, for could have been old fluid in the system in which I was not able to drain. Any suggestions would greatly be apperciated as I try to diagnose and repair with limited expertise to this engine.
Also does anyone know if the Lincoln Ls 3.9 v8 uses a proprietary coolant? I believe I read somewhere that it did, something rather Fords concentrated that mixes parts?
Also does anyone know if the Lincoln Ls 3.9 v8 uses a proprietary coolant? I believe I read somewhere that it did, something rather Fords concentrated that mixes parts?
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
The normal extended life 5/150 should be fine for all years of the LS. I've had it in both of mine for a pretty good while.
Someone probably added water or coolant to your fan reservoir (common iffy lube mistake). It takes a pretty good bit to flush it all out.
Someone probably added water or coolant to your fan reservoir (common iffy lube mistake). It takes a pretty good bit to flush it all out.
I am just getting my check list in order and taking some notes and trying to come up with a game plan before I get the grease all over me. For what it is worth I dug up the manual for the car, and it does specifically states "do not use Fords Extended Life" as alt for coolant, however right under that it states to use their product MOTORCRAFT CXB, lol. For what its worth I have some extended life in the garage which will suit my needs just fine. Thanks
This was in my coolant tank.... any suggestions? I can def feel oil in the mix.
Also I am just now doing the cylinder leak down test, I am unsure of the exact procedure. Do I take all 8 plugs out and check individially, or one by one? Also after I have the gauge on the cylinder do I crank the engine over by attempting to start the car or hand crank the engine? If their is a youtube video showing me the correct way for this LS please lmk. Thanks for the help guys
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
Wow....
That's your brake fluid reservoir! Brake fluid normally feels a little oily. You haven't added anything to it have you?
The coolant reservoir cap is at the base of the windshield.
Take all eight plugs out. For a compression test, you crank it over (with the starter). However, for a leak-down test, you move each piston to the bottom of the compression stroke (one at a time), apply pressure, then watch and see how long it takes for that pressure to drop (after disconnecting the pressure source).
That's your brake fluid reservoir! Brake fluid normally feels a little oily. You haven't added anything to it have you?
The coolant reservoir cap is at the base of the windshield.
Take all eight plugs out. For a compression test, you crank it over (with the starter). However, for a leak-down test, you move each piston to the bottom of the compression stroke (one at a time), apply pressure, then watch and see how long it takes for that pressure to drop (after disconnecting the pressure source).
Hey joegr let me start off by just saying thank you for all your help. That is not the brake hydualic fluid tank, it is def my coolant tank at the top right of my engine right under the windshield. The plug you see is the device I un screwed to have better access to my plugs to be able to pull them out.
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
Look. No offense here, but maybe you don't need to be working on this if you can't tell that is the brake fluid reservoir. That is in front of the windshield on the driver's side on top of the master cylinder that is attached to the vacuum booster. The coolant reservoir (degas bottle) is right at the base of the windshield hidden behind all that stuff.
Again, wow, just wow....
Ah , im sorry joe its been a long day, dealing with the boat and those 2 engines and a 2006 caddy with timing chain problems, your right that is my brake tank no worries the coolant tank looks all clear,
Which test should I run the comppression or leak down? to help me better diagnoise the white smoke from exhaust?
Which test should I run the comppression or leak down? to help me better diagnoise the white smoke from exhaust?
I can manage it. My older brother is a mechanic whom is helping me along and kinda of threw me to the wolves on this one and is over seeing my work when he gets off work and comes home. However I am trying to get as much done for him to overlook. We have 3 cars going on the one in the cover is a 87 mustang with new built engine with nitrus and a roll frame that we both out all in by ourselves
oddball
Dedicated LVC Member
Leak-down testing uses a different tool than a compression tester, and the leak down tester is harder to find. If you're loaning the tool from a part store, it's almost certainly a compression tester.
If you're worried about the white smoke means a cracked head or leaking head gasket, testing the coolant for combustion products is a better choice. That is, again, a special tool. Probably better to have a diagnostic done by a shop then decide what to do.
If you're worried about the white smoke means a cracked head or leaking head gasket, testing the coolant for combustion products is a better choice. That is, again, a special tool. Probably better to have a diagnostic done by a shop then decide what to do.
I do have the compression tool, my brother seems to want me to run it regardless (i think for the know how than anything else) Again I believe he knows it is a cracked head or gasket but wants me to tell him for sure how I know. thanks for help
compression test result L1-145 PSI L25- 125 L3-125 L4-140 ,,, R1-105 R2-105 R3-95 R4 110,
the right side cylinders are yielding a lower pressure result than the left, I might have had the cover gasket come off in the middle and not a perfect seal, or because of the white smoke we can def say we have a head issue or gasket, would that be a cause for the lower psi on that side? Do I break the top down again and re-check work, or just go ahead and try the gasket sauce and see if that if I am lucky (which so far isnt the case) does the trick??? Choices, choices, and the easier of the two seem tempting..................
I think imma try the BARS fix, simply because if it fails to patch, and I have to break the top down, no sense in re-assembling once broken that far down mind as well just complete the break down and replace the actual gasket and look at the head...
the right side cylinders are yielding a lower pressure result than the left, I might have had the cover gasket come off in the middle and not a perfect seal, or because of the white smoke we can def say we have a head issue or gasket, would that be a cause for the lower psi on that side? Do I break the top down again and re-check work, or just go ahead and try the gasket sauce and see if that if I am lucky (which so far isnt the case) does the trick??? Choices, choices, and the easier of the two seem tempting..................
I think imma try the BARS fix, simply because if it fails to patch, and I have to break the top down, no sense in re-assembling once broken that far down mind as well just complete the break down and replace the actual gasket and look at the head...
joegr
Dedicated LVC Member
Those results are not enough to conclude for certain. You would need to do a leak down test on the cylinders, or a hydrocarbon test on the coolant to be sure.
You can try the leak stop stuff if your choices are to do that or to scrap the engine. On the other hand, if you plan to fix the engine, whatever you do don't put the stop leak in. If you do, there's a good chance that the engine will forever overheat after that (has happened to another member). There is a somewhere close to a 0% chance that it would actually fix your problem.
You can try the leak stop stuff if your choices are to do that or to scrap the engine. On the other hand, if you plan to fix the engine, whatever you do don't put the stop leak in. If you do, there's a good chance that the engine will forever overheat after that (has happened to another member). There is a somewhere close to a 0% chance that it would actually fix your problem.
hydrocarbon test similar to the dye so you can see the color of it and if it is related to (in my case the exhaust)? Thanks for the heads up, I soley decided to go with the BARS simply because before my brother and I put it the re-built engine in mustang the orginal had a gasket issue and the BARS did work. (we put new engine in simply to make it run 11`s new cams, air system, cylinders etc etc, not because it failed the bars actually worked for tens of thuasands of miles until the graveyard with it) but thanks for heads up.
OKay ill have to get the hydrocarbon test kit, until than to stay productive and one step ahead I am going to drain oil and see if I see water mix or anti freeze comes out first that would be a give way also.
Just put plugs, coils back on to start her up to see if I could find anything something dripping maybe a hose, sounds anything etc. I filled up cooolant before hand started her up let her run for no more than 4 seconds Looking into the coolant it clearly used all of it in the resovior, re filled and started again let it run for 4 seconds, shut her down, again all drained, however this time could clearly see it bubbling (air?) when I did the valve cover Gasket I had a lil water in plug well, I am going all in on bad head gasket, specificly the right side with water in well between 2 and 3 water way holes in gasket is were it gave in at, perhaps a crack that runs right to the cylinder cut out.. more so when I just started her up the same side exhaust pipe was the only giving off a clear sign of NOT smoke but what I know realize was water vapor.... smh.. Just too bad you told me another member here had bad exp. with the BARS, I guess now I will start the break down. THANKS everyone for the help and suggestions. I will update you when I get her done and purring as so you can be armed with this information to perhaps help out a fellow member with same issues...
Hey joe just wanted to give you an update..... Long story short when I first joined the forum I left out one HUGGGEEE problem that would have prolly solved my orginal problem that led me to believe it was a tune up and cover gaskets that needed to be replace and that was a rough idle.. I know know that it was not a tune up and cover gasket that I needed but instead a timing chain. I say this because when I had the covers off I noticed the guide rail for the timing chain was broken off and stuck to the chain. I noticed it but did not think twice about it. I am only 17 and my first car Ive ever broken down and diagnoise. All in all it was the timing chain. Yesterday upon starting her up it finnaly gave and broke and I heard the crack of it. Thanks for the help