Heater core replacement

[Elessee]

When I took the car to the shop, the guy told me the heater core was leaking. I was surprised about that and couldn't believe it at first. But sure enough, when I got the car back it was steaming up the windows.

Having replaced a really corroded radiator (likely the original one) a couple years ago, my guess is the heater core is in equally bad shape. I dumped one tube of Bar's powdered stop leak in it today... good luck with that.. but it might help for a little while..

Aside from the work and time, I don't think this old car will survive a dashboard R&R. Lots of rubber parts are getting slightly brittle with age. Mechanic wants $800.

There is also a faulty plenum mixture door. I can live with that. But I gotta have a heater.
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I was reading various webpages and one guy had (i think) a Mustang, and talked about cutting away the plastic shielding under the dashboard, behind the glove box, to access and replace his heater core. Interesting idea.
Anybody think this is possible on the '88 Mark 7?

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EDIT

ok.. it was a dumb idea to post that question without first taking a look at where the core is. No reason to quit while I'm behind, so here's another dumb idea.

Looking under the hood, I see the core's tubes extend through the firewall where the hoses attach. It's high up on the wall. The area is fairly accessible.

Suppose one were to cut a rectangle out of the firewall's sheet metal, big enough to pull the core straight forward and into the engine compartment. It would hit the throttle body, but that can be removed. It's a fairly clear shot that in theory, looks possible.

I'm holding a new core. It has flanges... and they are probably screw-attached to something.
Question is, is this core absolutely secured inside it's housing, and so cannot be pulled out? Or are the heavenly stars aligned and the core only fits snugly in a soft, rubber cushion?

i really really don't wanna do all the things required to replace this..

I know where Lincoln can stuff their core next time around..

 

[Elessee]

This is my first try at posting a photo. hmm.. That looks ok i guess.

This view is of the passenger side firewall, just below the windshield.
The red rectangle is the approximate outline of the tubing-end of the heater core. (I have a new one sitting here.)

There's nothing in the way. Nothing needs to be removed to access the cutting area.

To pull the core forward and completely out, at worst, the upper intake manifold would need be removed (VERY unlikely from my observations. Maybe unbolt it, and lift it upwards an inch or so.) At best, only the throttle body as a unit will have to be moved.

So.. Someone tell me why it's a bad idea or I swear I'm gonna grab the angle grinder and cut a big freakin hole in my firewall.

Is the core screwed or bolted into it's housing? Or does this hack job have a fighting chance?

 

[Elessee]

I may well be a pioneer when it comes to attempting this particular hack. So, I'll just keep notes on my progress (or regress).. but please feel free to weigh in with whatever experience, opinions or knowledge you can spare.

I sliced a small observation hole through the rubber insulation around the two water hose connections. The heater core is about 1 + 1/2 inches in behind the sheet metal. It's tilted slightly downward to the right, about 10 degrees.

I can already see that the copper around one of the tube connectors is green from corrosion.

And I can see the edge of some plastic housing, most likely it's the core housing. It's thin and will be easy to cut or melt (or blast) through.

One encouraging thing: The core moves a bit when I jerk the hose connectors up and down. So, it may be encased in a thick rubbery shell... and the core itself may not even be screwed to anything. But if worse comes to worse, I could break apart the old core just to get it out of there. Slide the new one in.

I wonder if I'll be able to free up my stuck blend door, through this access hole. That would be a bonus.

 

[Elessee]

Pictured below is a section of the exploded view of the "Evaporator Case" assembly. (Vol B Page 36-75-32)
Looks like the core is not screwed into or attached to the housing. I don't see any hidden wiring or booby traps between the core and engine compartment.

Heater Core
Removal
1. Remove instrument panel (yeah.. right..)
2. Remove evaporator case from vehicle
NOTE: Whenever an evaporator case is removed, it will be necessary to replace the suction accumulator/drier (whew..)
3. Remove five heater core access cover attaching screws, and remove access cover (yawn)
4. Lift heater core and seals from evaporator case.
5. Remove the two seals from the heater core tubes.

It seems like the core just sits in a plastic box.

Now I just gotta go out and cut that hole. First remove the EGR and move some wires / hoses out of the way.. disconnect and remove the 2 heater hoses. Figure out what's the best tools to use.
If the firewall sheet metal is not too thick, I might be able to cut most of it with this little shear-nipper thing. Otherwise, it's a power grinder with a cut off blade. I'm a coward.. gonna have lunch and think about it some more.
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EDIT
Looks like the easiest and right way to start is to remove the throttle body / EGR spacer as a whole, leaving the EGR and everything attached. Just disconnect (and label) the electrical connectors and vacuum lines, etc. With that chunk of stuff out of the way, there will be lots of room to maneuver.

I dunno about first draining some coolant or not, since one heater hose end is a bit lower than the radiator's top... This is new to me.

man.. and i just yesterday got this thing running good.. not officially passed smog yet but New ignition wires, plugs, rotor and cap, oil and filter.. did the smoky SeaFoam treatment. I would like to enjoy the car a little bit before I cripple it for days or longer if this project is a screw up.
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Re-Edit
Looking at the engine manual now, Vol D Page 24-04-6

Upper Intake Manifold and Throttle Body Removal
1. through 7. : disconnect a bunch of lines, connectors and stuff.

It might be the same amount of work to just take the upper intake manifold off. I already have a new gasket for it. Then I could tighten my loose, leaking valve covers, and really examine the vacuum lines and electrical stuff under and behind the manifold.

Either the throttle body and/or manifold must be out of the way to pull the heater core forward. So, it's a toss up on which way to go.
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Re-Re...
A slight complication has arisen.
The fuel pressure regulator, which is attached to the fuel rail, is directly in the way, 5 inches from the firewall. I missed it cause it's hidden behind everything.
So, press the Schrader valve on the fuel rail to relieve fuel pressure, and remove 3 allen screws, and remove the regulator.
It really looks like the core will clear the rest of the fuel rail. I won't know for sure 'til i get that far.

Measure 15 times, cut once.
Check refrigerator.. got milk.. not gonna need a car for a while.. I'm ready.

 

[Elessee]

That's enough work for today. Tomorrow I'll clean up, tie off some wires and cables and make more room for the job.

Thus far (see pic) the throttle body and EGR spacer have been removed. The 4 securing studs stuck out of the manifold about 4 inches so they were removed.
I decided to try it this way first, instead of removing the entire manifold assembly, because this might be sufficient.
The upper manifold is at the right side of the pic.

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However, I would now recommend removing the entire upper manifold + throttle body as a unit. Reason #1: It makes much more open space and requires essentially the same amount of work (aside from the disconnecting of all the vacuum lines underneath the manifold.. but I've never done it, and don't really know for sure).

Reason #2.
Water circulates in the EGR spacer. Water + iron studs + air + aluminum causes corrosion (because gaskets may not be perfect after 260K miles). Corroded studs prevent the easy removal of the EGR spacer and throttle body. If you see any corrosion on the outside, around the throttle body or EGR water hose area, I'd be sure the studs' bore-holes are packed with rust and corrosion.

And, you'll need the two mating gaskets (~ $10 for both), so order them ahead of time. Throttle to Spacer gasket will be destroyed. Spacer to manifold is metal and may survive.

If the whole upper manifold is removed at once, you need only the manifold gasket.. don't need to mess with frozen studs.. maybe it all evens out. I dunno.
On the other hand, since the throttle body and EGR spacer are out and separated, I can now see lots of carbon and crud that was missed before, and can clean them up.

About 2 gallons of coolant were drained before the heater hoses were removed. I don't know if it was necessary. The coolant is filthy so it's all getting flushed anyway.

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Pic shows a better estimate of the 2" x 6" outline. If pulled straight out, the core will hit the pressure regulator.
But since the core is actually 1+1/2 inches deep, behind the wall, and that's empty space, it might be possible to angle it out at the end. Or, the hole might be cut longer than the minimum 6 inches to get an angle on it.

There is now access to all the bolts holding this right (left?) rocker cover, so at least this side can be tightened down.

Tomorrow the firewall gets cut, and I'll know if this was a dumb idea or not.

 

[Elessee]

Made a slightly larger hole than planned .. figured it's better to cut just once. However, as shown in the pics, the heater core's true angle slants more than I figured. Might have to cut some more sheet metal.

The core moves easily now. It will come right out once enough plastic is removed.

Cut the tube ends off early on, because they're in the way. Covered nearby stuff with wet cloth , water spray bottle, and aluminum foil to protect from grinding dust and sparks. Space is tight so careful about slicing through wires or something.


Tools: Dremel MotoTool with the EZ-Lock / 1-1/2" wheel setup. That right side and left side are tough to get to with anything else.
Makita 4" disk grinder, and I got by with one 3 inch cut-off wheel. In the photo the guard is removed. Never run it without the guard.
Crayon is good to mark cutting lines.
Long thin sharp knife to cut insulation.
35 Watt Soldering iron to melt the plastic case.

Although the firewall is not thick, and might even be cut with shears, it's difficult to get any tools besides a grinder in there at the proper angle... YMMV, of course. [EDIT: firewall steel is near 0.032 inch... 21 or 22 gauge.]
Lunchtime. More later.

 

[Elessee]

Cutting and melting away the plastic casing is the most tedious part thus far. Used a soldering iron and Dremel with a burr cutter.

The core slides out no problem. There's some slop and it can be moved up and sideways a little. Push hard and it moves further.

Now it's time to examine things and select the best course of action.

The core could be chopped to pieces and removed, but that doesn't help installing the new one.... unless access to the inside box reveals some unsuspected options.

That steep 22 degree tilt changes things a bit. It looks like it's gonna run right into the fuel rail. That would mean upper intake manifold removal plus the rail.

But I'm not too concerned that it may come to that. I would still rather do it this way 50 times than once remove the instrument panel along with the consequences. To get this far again, time spent would probably be 3 hours tops, with an hour of that spent chipping away that dang plastic.

Reassembling and sealing up all the holes doesn't pose any major problems that I can foresee.

 

[xllsc007]

wow gangster . how long did it take you to do? Any pics back together?

 

[Elessee]

It was really close, but there was already enough room to get the old heater core out. Just pulled, turned and jiggled it as it was coming out, and it cleared everything.

The close up pic shows the damage done. The wide pic is just to save that gaping hole for posterity.

I can get my hand on the blend door (see pic). It's streaked with moisture, which must be from the leak. Next I study and play with this system, determine if I can fix anything like that faulty blend door.

Then fill in the gaps I cut open with some kinda expanding foam or rubber or maybe weatherstripping, and seal the hole with a metal cover plate.

New core should slide right in. It's corners are rounder than the stock one, and it has side mounting brackets that can be cut away if necessary.

 

[Elessee]

wow gangster . how long did it take you to do? Any pics back together?

back together.. ?
dude.. i'm working on it right now.. today

So far I put in about 5 hours or 6 total actually on the car. At least half of that was wasted, wondering what to do next, doing the wrong thing, doing useless things, etc.

will post more pix as things happen. Hang in there. Gonna take a nap right now. Getting that core out was a major milestone.

 

[Elessee]

...just noticed something that i think deserves a post.

Space is so tight that the old core was damaged by the edge of the firewall hole, as I pulled and tweaked and wiggled it on the way out. See pic.

Using this method, one must be sure to avoid damage to the new core. You can't see or examine the new core once it's in the hole..
There will be no hint of trouble until you run the car and then smell antifreeze, and the windows steam up.

On the plus side, doing the job over again is no biggee.

This new made in China core has aluminum sheet sides, not delicate, exposed fins / water channels like the OEM. But it's made of aluminum, and is much softer than the copper/brass original.
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It would be much safer and easier to just cut the left side of the firewall hole somewhat larger than necessary. Not knowing what was back there, I only cut the bare minimum to get the core out.

Caution is advised.
The (vertical) AC evaporator core is just to the left of the cut hole. That core is less than an inch away from the heater core. It appears to be inset the same distance, about 1-1/2 inch in and away from the firewall, but I can't see it well enough to be certain of it's size and exact position.

 

[Elessee]

Since I don't see any way to repair or diagnose the blend door from here, I'm gonna install the new heater core and get all this stuff put back together.

Good lighting, a mirror and even an inspection camera shows nothing obviously wrong with this blend door or the area down inside the cavity.
There was a healthy accumulation of plastic bits that fell in and collected on the ledge below the door. Probably best to remove them as the bigger pieces might jam something. Fingers can get in and grab the stuff.

The manual seems to say I can access and even remove the blend door actuator by removing the radio and glove box. To tell the truth, I don't exactly recall what codes came up during the self-diagnostic test procedure I ran a while back, so my ATC problem might not even be the blend door.

Will probably slightly enlarge the side of the firewall hole to more easily slip the new core in. Go to Home Depot and find something appropriate to fill and plug the voids that were created. Then make a metal cover plate and screw it to the firewall.

My new throttle plate gaskets should arrive early today. If not, I'll use some kinda form-a-gasket just to get the car running, and install them later on. Then report on the results.
If all went well, the salient points and procedures in this thread might be compacted into a couple paragraphs. There's really not much to this heater-hack once the uncertainties are resolved.

 

[Elessee]

After that left edge was cut back a little bit more, the new heater core slipped right in without resistance. It did rub slightly on the fuel pressure regulator (seen on the right side of pic). This camera has a panoramic lens that distorts perspective.

The bottom right corner of the cutout is 5 inches down from under that spot-welded flange.
That distance, plus the 22 degree tilt, plus the 6"x2" minimum hole size should provide enough variables to figure the rest of the layout.

[=== Edit.. No, that's not enough info. I can't figure out how to remove and fix the posted photo so here's one more dimension.
See the 3" mark on the ruler? Just below that is a bolt and nut, the bracket that holds the suction accumulator/drier canister. From the center of that bolt to the lower right corner of the cutout is 4-3/4 inches. Now you know where the lower right corner is.===]


On the left is a strip of metal remaining between the cores. Trimming it to just 3/8 inch wide seemed to be the deciding factor in getting this core in easily.

..still waiting on the throttle gaskets, but there are plenty of little things to do in the meantime.
The new core is a sloppy fit, and might even rattle. Tucking some foam in the corner should fix that.

I'm debating what's best to use to pack in where all the plastic and rubber was cut away. While even the slightest air leak between the chambers would be avoided by the designer, it's not critical to me. Although it's not clear in the pic, there's a good 1-1/2 inch between the core's front surface and the firewall, a volume that needs to be filled in.
The easy way might be to stick duct tape all around in there as a back-stop, and then spray some expanding foam (do they make non-flammable? (yeah HDepot $8)), creating a solid plug. Shave the hard foam off flush with the firewall, and install a cover plate.

 

[Elessee]

The foam padding, rubber pads and sound insulation materials that Lincoln used around that heater are all quite flammable, so flame retardant material would seem unnecessary.

Expanding foam construction insulation is out because it cures hard, has no springiness. Vibration and movement could crush it eventually, leaving voids, and perhaps an annoying rattle.

But I found something I like. A ground mat for a sleeping bag. It's a tough rubbery closed cell foam, 5/8" thick, was cheap when I bought it, it's free now, and i don't have to go shopping for something.

========
That rubber sleeping pad material is nice to work with. It's not like the really inexpensive ones that have more of a plastic feel.
Cut 3 layers, each one roughly contoured to it's particular position, and just slightly over sized, compressed into place.
The outermost is about 1/4" larger all around than the hole, and squeezed in snug.

Next the cover plate. The firewall has ridges on the right side. A simple, flat plate won't lay flat. <--- This might be a hint to cut the hole very carefully, and preserve the original cut out piece as well as possible. Then use it as a foundation for the cover plate.

 

[Elessee]

The last step is the cover plate. A piece of aluminum shaped to conform to the firewall's surface would be preferred, but I had nothing laying around..

I can't take pix right now, but will describe what I ended up doing.
Start with a flat plate, cut slightly larger than the cutout hole.

Notice the firewall's raised ridges on the right side of the hole. Instead of struggling to conform to them, I used them as a locking device.

The plate's right side edge has tabs cut into it. These tabs slip under and into the raised ridges. The tabs essentially lock the plate's right edge to the firewall.
This eliminates the need to drill some screw holes behind the engine... which looks kinda impossible anyway... unless you lend me your angle drill.

At the left side of the plate, one or two screws will hold it all down. Don't drill into an area you're not sure is empty. Stay close to the cutout perimeter and avoid the AC evaporator area.

Paint the plate and any cut, exposed metal edges to retard rust, like around the cutout.
I also ran masking tape around the sharp edge of the cover plate prior to painting. The plate doesn't lay perfectly flat, and it's too sharp to leave edges exposed. Don't wanna reach back there for something a year from now and get a cut.

I doubt much water can get in. The inch-wide metal ledge just above it diverts whatever water finds it's way under the hood. But after thinking about it, will remove this cover and run a bead of silicone around the cut.

If I had the original cut-out metal form, in one piece, it may have been adequate to do nothing more than silicone it back into place.
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..thinking out loud here.. it's not easy to foresee things.. to prepare for the unexpected.

I know the core could probably be yanked out of there if you pull real hard, but why would someone do that? Well, it's gets yanked on pretty good when disconnecting the hoses. So.. maybe the cover deserves a couple tack-welds around the edge. No way will I do it to mine. Any welding done back there will be as a last resort. There's probably other ways to secure the core if one wants to do that.

otoh, it is called a firewall for a reason.. and welding it all up is probably the safest way to go. Of course, any welding done on that wall at this point is more likely to destroy unknown things and even start a fire behind it, than to increase fire safety.

The ideal cover plate is probably some 22 gauge steel, slightly larger than the hole, with edges formed to match the firewall's bumps and ridges, and screwed into place.
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Does it even need a cover plate? Look to the left of the heater core tubes and there are the evaporator core tubes sticking out. They have an unshielded, exposed rubber seal around them, which is about 4" x 4".. and that seal material is flammable enough to support a flame.

 

[Elessee]

After some study and much deliberation, I've decided to clean these fuel injectors. I think I can, but if not, I'll send them out to be cleaned properly.
All the tune-up work done so far did not make much improvement in any seat-of-the-pants way.
Immediately after the mechanic said "Nope. It did not pass smog.." my brain started buzzing real loud, while he continued talking..... but I did catch the words "fuel injectors" and "probably filthy",and "...mileage equivalent to a few trips around the equator and then all the way to the moon".

Anyway, this photo illustrates how much more room there is to work with, affording additional angles of attack, should the heater-hack be attempted with the upper intake manifold removed. I'd already disconnected most things and the manifold was off in like 10 minutes.
All those hoses and stuff can be tied off away from the area.
Only thing still in the way is that fuel pressure regulator, which is coming off along with the fuel rail as soon as I get to it. Relieve fuel pressure and disconnect some tricky little spring loaded connection, and four bolts later it's off too.

The red cover plate is the cleanest thing in there and really stands out. I like it. Actually, the filth is a big reason the intake came off. No way to track down a couple oil or fuel leaks without removing the intake and cleaning everything up.

oh yeah.. I already got rewarded for pulling it off. Found a cracked vacuum hose (small one, in front of manifold), a leak which could be the reason it failed the low pressure fuel vapor smog test. I think it leads to the charcoal canister.

 

[Beagle]

Thanks for posting this up - I think you just saved me a ton of time!! I'll have the engine out of mine so it will be cake. I wouldn't have thought about pulling it out this side.

Good luck on your smog, I've heard some guys say they've put alcohol mix in to get marginal cars to pass? There's probably a bazillion 19# injectors out there from the Mustang guys pulling them for bigger injectors... maybe a set of low mile ones would be less than getting yours cleaned if your cleaning job doesn't take care of it?

 

[Elessee]

Thanks.. getting past smog gives it another two years of life. I'll look into new-used injectors if I ever need to do another cleaning. The new retail price is terrible @ $200 per. Professional cleaning is.. hmm.. I recall reading it's about $20 each.

And somewhat off topic, there's no such thing as "matching" injectors' flows by the cleaning methods. They are not adjustable. If one flows more than another and they are both clean, that's the end of the story.
I mention this in regards to having injectors professionally cleaned, because some of the cleaning places advertize their ability to match-flow your 8 injectors. If you see someone claiming they can do it, be careful.
You can find a matched set that naturally flow the same by testing and selecting 8 from hundreds of them, which is what I think serious performance addicts do. A random set of stock injectors flow within roughly 5% of each other. That's close enough for car manufacturers.

This is my first fuel injected car... or is it? I dunno for sure. But it was the first time I worked with injectors and it was all new to me. Now I know just enough to get me into trouble.

As for alcohol additive improving test results, it might, but maybe that depends on which test failed. Carbon Monoxide (CO) is one.. Nitrogen oxides (NO) is another.
This car was high hydrocarbons (HC), meaning raw fuel is coming out the tailpipe. That means poor fuel economy and wasted gas.. and I want to fix that almost as much as I'd like it to pass smog. A bottle of that "Guaranteed to Pass" did not do the job, or maybe it just couldn't do this job, given the circumstances.

As of now it's almost all back together.. waiting on some form-a-gasket to set up so the throttle body can get attached. After that, give it a test run and look for leaks or whatever.. maybe tonight or in the morning.

If you pull your heater out the front way, post the results. It would be interesting to see how someone else goes about it.

 

[Elessee]

All back together and no fluid leaks anywhere. Next is a smog check. It runs very nice. Smooth.. Then hit the power spray car wash and take the top layer of dirt off the engine.

Assuming you already have any needed gaskets and other supplies at hand, and aren't surprised by something unexpected, this core replacement is a one day job. The only place you might break a little sweat is cutting through the core's plastic case. That part is tedious and just plain uncomfortable. Right-handers have a decided advantage over lefties.

I put big masking tape labels on things as they were disconnected (wimp!), and made a list of things to do as the job progressed, and it helped a lot... got it all back together on the first try.

My mechanic is gonna ask me what that plate is. I don't think I like him enough to be truthful about it and need to come up with a plausible explanation.
"I tried to install a speaker, but it didn't work out. Did you know the heater core is right there and in the way??"

 

[xllsc007]

nice bro. wow so you have heat now..

 

[Elessee]

nice bro. wow so you have heat now..

The leaking core steamed up the windows. Now, there is dry heat.

The Automatic Temperature Control still has a problem and something needs fixing.

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Edit..
Now that the car is running again, I warmed it up and ran the ATC Self-test diagnostic and the code was 88. "No Faults Found".
Somehow, somewhere during all the tuneup and heater work, one of the climate control door actuators musta fixed itself. Or, maybe just having the battery and a bunch of other stuff disconnected for a day or two, cleared an electronic glitch...
======
gaaaaaa... spoke too soon. Ran a bunch of errands and on an engine restart with the AC on, it started blinking again. Code #2. "Floor/Panel actuator out of position."

 

[Lux]

Although I can appreciate the ingenuity its lazy and sloppy at best.


The heatercore could have easily been bypassed until properly fixed with a small piece of tubing, which unless you live in cold temps...heat isnt so much the issue as leaking coolant steam on the windows is.

You spent more time cutting up the firewall which, to me, is completely absurd in the first place...and then into layers of insulation followed by the heaterbox which now is not properly sealed from the elements, allowing even more moisture to penetrate the inner workings of it, the blower motor, doors, etc...

Rather then, properly removing the dash and the box, this way you can give the ac a good flushing while your at it AND can take a look at the evap core since you already have problems i bet thats not to far behind...or if you didnt want to discharge the ac...

You could still cut through the heaterbox box and not the firewall if you were going to "cut corners" and "hack" away at something....why not be on the inside @ the heatbox...its been tried and trued for anyone not wanting to break loose the ac but wanting to put a heater core for quite some time.

The leaking core steamed up the windows. Now, there is dry heat.

The Automatic Temperature Control still has a problem and something needs fixing.

Dry heat comes from the a/c thats what your climate control is, and how it works. Which is another reason to check the box and the evap, blend, blower motor etc. The reason a leaky heater core causes steam on the windows is because pumping hot moist air/anitifreeze on the inside of the vehicles windshield.

Properly removing the dash the first time can suck, especially if you've never done it...but once you get those bolts/nuts that are a real pain to get to...leave them out on reassembly, Theres one or two that really makes the dash on these cars a little annoying to take out.

After that you have some connectors under the hood and your good to go. The dashboard can be out laying foward and the heaterbox coming out in an hour...or cut through the box on the inside and just swap cores, at least this way you only cut through the box and have a plastic piece to silicone back much in place, exactly as you could have done if not hacking the square you cut out all up, but you probably had to due to the angles you were cutting at..still, even hacking into the heaterbox isnt worth it when you've come that far if you plan on keeping the vehicle.

Just leave the 1-2 or 3 nuts/bolts out off on reassembly and if you ever have to pull the dash again (which you shouldnt when you flush the ac, check the core, check the blend door, etc, wiring harness EVERYTHING is accessible now even the carpet if you wanna switch it out or just give it a nice vacuuming and wipe down everything real clean) it goes back in pretty easy. Or if you ever find a mint dash to replace it...its easy to take out.

I once found a mint black dash for my lsc...but the wiring harness was cut...theres only a couple connectors under the hood and the whole dash comes RIGHT out, but instead they cut the harness at the door...talk about lazy. Swapping my original 90 harness into a 92 mint dash...now THATS a fun job.

Its literally like 10 bolts/nuts that hold the dash in, drop the steering column, the seats and console come out like a breeze and few connectors under the hood and the ENTIRE dash is up and out of the vehicle in an hour or so if you leave a few bolts down.

Not to rain on your parade but I HIGHLY recommend anyone thats reading this AGAINST THIS procedure on their vehicle.

Numerous reasons ranging from integrity, to safety, grinding and cutting into insulation and plastics.. which will and can catch onto fire, fabbing an unnecessary plate without removing the intake (thats a joke) to drill into the body or rtv the plate back on the firewall (when you can just do it on the inside much simpler) where now your having an improperly secured/sealed heater core...and by the way the slightest bend/angle on those pipes for the heater hoses and thats all it takes to crack and start leaking again all come to mind...of why this should not be attempted.

As stated earlier, I can appreciate the ingenuity as its similar to cutting a hole through a trunk to replace a fuel pump instead of dropping the tank...which is still questionable as its lazy and sloppy, at best...

But I dont recommend anyone to try this...please put down the grinder and step away from the vehicle.

 

[Elessee]

"...Properly removing the dash the first time can suck, especially if you've never done it...but once you get those bolts/nuts that are a real pain to get to...leave them out on reassembly, Theres one or two that really makes the dash on these cars a little annoying to take out..."

You left a few bolts on the bench, eh? And yet you got the guts to call my method lazy and sloppy. Well, I can assure you that every bolt and nut that I had to remove was reattached, regardless of how annoying it was.

When it comes to maintaining a car, everybody has their own amount of experience, mechanical ability, tools and equipment, time, and money and patience to spend on things. What is or is not appropriate depends on the person, the car's condition and the circumstances, imo.

Thanks for critiquing this method. The post was informative.

 

[Lux]

You left a few bolts on the bench, eh? And yet you got the guts to call my method lazy and sloppy. Well, I can assure you that every bolt and nut that I had to remove was reattached, regardless of how annoying it was.

When it comes to maintaining a car, everybody has their own amount of experience, mechanical ability, tools and equipment, time, and money and patience to spend on things. What is or is not appropriate depends on the person, the car's condition and the circumstances, imo.

Thanks for critiquing this method. The post was informative.

The dashboard is not a critical part of the vehicle's safety and operation... such as the firewall, steering, your wheels and/or brake system, air bags, etc. It is important to make sure it attached securely, so im not suggesting leaving out anchor bolts that would allow it to come loose over time.

The dashboard is attached to the body with 10 or so bolts, leaving one or two of them out doesnt affect ANYTHING as far as safety, structural integrity, and attachment of the dash to the vehicle...for instance, its not going to fall out into your lap because you left a nut or two out as theres only IIRC 4 bolts that really "HOLD" the dash to the body, the rest just go into place and help secure it more. I still wouldnt suggest doing this on a customers car but after having 3 different dashboards in my 90 LSC and having the dash in and out more times then I could count, i know my way around a Mark VII dash and how to remove it, how to install it...

Thanks for not taking it to personal - and as i said, if i were to cut corners it would be leaving one or two bolts out on re installation of the dashpad (im not the first person to do this, been very common practice on the Mark VII for years) and then cut the HEATERBOX to pull the core out. Which i still dont recommend but at least this can be fixed. To fix what you did you would weld the firewall, remove the dash completely, remove the heaterbox completely, replace the box, replace the insulation, etc...have fun.

No time was saved by cutting the firewall, if anything it has only opened up future problems for down the road.

Take care.

(and yes thats a tremec tko600 gear shifter you see)

 

[Elessee]

It doesn't matter to me how someone replaces a heater core. If they know it can come out through the firewall but choose to remove their dashboard, they have their reasons.

Take it for what it's worth. Or don't. I'm moving onwards and upwards (more like backwards) to my left rear caliper. The O-ring behind the parking brake lever has been dripping for months. Already got the rebuild kit. Haven't dreamed up any shortcuts... yet.