Another will not start thread...

Lincoln LS

  1. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    I have a 2001 Lincoln LS V8 with 124,000 miles on it. The care will crank normally, all of the gauge lights are correct and the PATS comes on solid red when I insert the key and turns off completely when I begin cranking.

    I have not been having hard start problems or rough idle problems.

    I am thinking PCM relay but I would greatly appreciate any advice or alternate ideas.

    Thanks,
    Eric
     
  2. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    I think that the PATS light would be flashing if it were the PCM relay. Still, it doesn't hurt to check it.
    How about your fuel pump. Can you hear it run briefly when you turn the key to the run position? If not, then you may have a bad fuel pump, relay, or REM.
    If so, then it may be time to check fuel pressure. If you can't do that, then you could spray some starting fluid into the intake. If that causes the engine to fire for a moment, you'll know it's fuel and not ignition. If it doesn't then you'll know that its PCM or electrical power related.
     
  3. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    I am wondering if it is the fuel pump or the fuel pump relay- I am not hearing the pump engage when I turn the key. I am going to spray some starting fluid and see what happens.

    If it is fuel related it seems to me that it is probably the pump with the miles that are on the car. Has anyone ever had any luck with tapping the pump to get it to work tempoarily? I don't want to drive it- just another level of checking.
     
  4. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    Sorry- I missed this before. What is an REM?
     
  5. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    Rear Electronics module.
    It does several things, but one of them is to drive the fuel pump. The PCM reads the fuel pressure at the engine and decides what the fuel pressure should be. From that, it send commands to the REM to speed up or slow down the fuel pump as needed to get the desired fuel pressure.
     
  6. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    joegr- Thank you.
     
  7. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    OK- changed the fuel pump, fuel pump relay and the diode. Still no start.

    When I sprayed starter fluid into the intake the engine would start for a second or two.

    I am unsure where to go now. What are the next steps I should take?
     
  8. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    With the fuel pump connected, and within a second or so of turning the key on, do these tests. (Will require at least two people).

    Measure the voltage between the negative fuel pump lead and ground.
    Post what you get.
    Measure the voltage between the positive fuel pump lead and ground.
    Post what your get.

    Just for sanity, also measure the voltage between the positive and negative fuel pump leads and post that here too.
     
  9. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    OK- just so I have this correct. Pull the fuel pump out but leave it connected to run these tests?
     
  10. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    No, don't remove the fuel pump. Leave it in the tank Probe the wiring at the connector outside of the tank.
     
  11. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    Cool. I was a little concerned before.
     
  12. Hawk03

    Hawk03 Dutch User

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  13. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    Thank you Hawk. I read the threads and can see several options I need to explore in addition to getting the power reads from the pump. This is a frustrating problem and I bet that when I find the solution I will wonder why it took so long.
     
  14. tireman

    tireman Dedicated LVC Member

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    IAC valve stuck

    If you have an IAC valve on this engine, if it is bad them car will crank but will not run,,,,,hold down the gas peddle half way and try and start the car.
     
  15. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    I tried the pedal halfway down- no go.
     
  16. tireman

    tireman Dedicated LVC Member

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    fuel pump

    if all checks out and you can crank the engine. turn key and listen for fuel pump to function, if you don't hear it windup then you need another fuel pump. my guess is a bad fuel pump, pull the back seat, check the wire leads to the fuel pump for 12V with key turned on. If no power then check all relays and fuses to fuel pump, if 12V present and no noise from pump, then replace pump. Mine quit about 128K miles.
     
  17. regiment1

    regiment1 Dedicated LVC Member

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    Aren't there two fuel pumps on these cars? I believe I had both replaced a few years ago.
     
  18. joegr

    joegr Dedicated LVC Member

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    Yes, one the the electric one, and the other is a mechanical jet pump that is powered by the flow of fuel from the electric pump.
     
  19. cirelle

    cirelle Active LVC Member

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    I've had 2 issues so far where my 2000 ls would not start, (cranks and cranks). One time at the mechanics after an oil change and another at the cigar shop.

    Both times I used the key to lock and unlock the car, then it started right away.

    The mechanic seemed to think it was the security system intervening. I think it might be a weak battery, just haven't had time to do full research since it works 99% of the time.

    The way things have been going, it's probably more than the battery.
     
  20. Rivers

    Rivers Active LVC Member

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    I think I broke my fuel pump yesterday after some hard acceleration on an open road racing one of my friends.. Got a block from where we were headed, was flipping a three point turn and the car stopped moving, but I still had electricity.. Got it back on, just in time for the lovely ladies turning the corner to think I had a working car, went around the corner, it was shaking, then the power steering died, then the car. pushed it into a parking lot, got it towed and last I saw of it, it had the same symptoms as yours
     
  21. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    I am checking the voltage today -haven"t had a chance till now- but I did try the "cycle the key 10 times" trick yesterday and got a strange result. The car started for about 1 second and then died. Then to make it stranger -to me anyhow- I listened at the fuel pump and I cannot hear anything happening.

    Obviously I need to see if there is power going to the pump -which is new- to see where to go next but does this point in a particular direction to anyone?
     
  22. pektel

    pektel Dedicated LVC Member

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    Have you had any marginal COP problems that you let go for a long time? Sometimes that can fry the PCM. I know that happened to Alax7.

    How is your fuel filter? I've never had a completely clogged filter before, but that could be a possibility.
     
  23. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    I hate to admit that I don't know what a COP is but I have not been having any check engine lights, hard starts, misfires, etc before this.

    I am going to replace the fuel filter this afternoon as a just in case.
     
  24. BlackLS06

    BlackLS06 Dedicated LVC Member

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  25. Eric Cooke

    Eric Cooke LVC Member

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    Coil on Plug- that makes sense. I need to memorize all of these.

    Problem is fixed. I checked the pump with a multimeter and guess what- no juice. Fuel pump fuse was blown- It was the first thing I checked originally so my best guess is that it blew when the car started for a second yesterday. Go figure.
     

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