AdvanceTrac problem,,yes,again....

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roncoinc

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Ok,,after a week of reading three to four hours a day on this site i think i read almost everything ever posted on this subject..
Next was google and yahoo search.

As a forum owner on another subject i am familiar with the need for "newbs" to do search and research so it is with some trepidation i post my inquiry.. :)

Not finding an answer or resolution to the problem with the specific's i have i hope somebody can be of help.

The car is not in my possesion at this time,a deposit has been made and waiting for paperwork.
2004 V8.

AdvanceTrac light is on,stays on,not flashing,constant on.
pressing "reset" clears the notice in the message center but the light stays on steady.


on test drive NO problems or symptoms related to AdvanceTrac showed.
handling around corners at speed was fine,,acceleration was acceptable..
braking was sufficient.

Note: the closest vehicle i have to compare to is my corvette.

Owner bought it with front end damage.
replaced bumper and cover.
Had front end gone through by shop and four wheel alignment.
Also had same shop read error codes,,none showed.

With the light still on he paid a ford dealership to check for codes,,no codes again.
he has driven it over 7K miles with no problems.

As far as anything else concerned with the car i have no idea and neither does he.
he has all his auto work out sourced.

The only thing i have found close to this particular problem is this.

" A Lincoln mechanic says "I have seen a lot of the ADVANCE TRAC lights staying on, its a common problem(It happened on my LS). 99% of the time you just need to have the computer reflashed. This must be done by the dealer and it is usually about an hours worth of labor, so around 90 bucks depending on the dealer. This will fix all concerns""


Anybody lead me to more insightful info ??
or should i just ignore the light,put tape over it and keep on driving ??
Tnx..
 
That light being on means that AdvanceTrac will not kick in to help you if you start to loose control. It's a pretty neat feature, and I'd want it to work.
Usually, the AdvanceTrac light being on without the ABS light on means it is the steering angle sensor, the yaw sensor, or an ABS module calibration issue. I promise there were codes, it just takes the right scan tool to read them. The one possible exception (maybe) is if someone replaced the AdvanceTrac ABS module with a non-AdvanceTrac ABS module. The module is at the front right of the engine bay.
 
You are likely missing an input like a wheel speed sensor.
The ABS and advancetrac will be disabled; you could drive it like that but it is not as safe as Lincoln intended.

The ford dealer could not read any codes? ABS AdvanceTrac do not set OBD codes so they should know better.
 
02_LS said:
You are likely missing an input like a wheel speed sensor.
The ABS and advancetrac will be disabled; you could drive it like that but it is not as safe as Lincoln intended.

The ford dealer could not read any codes? ABS AdvanceTrac do not set OBD codes so they should know better.
Click to expand...

1. He does not say that the ABS light is on. I'm sure he would have if it was.
2. ABS and AdvanceTrac most certainly do set On-Board-Diagnostic code that are read from the same interface under the dash. However, most generic code readers will not pick them up. It takes an OBD reader that also covers Ford specific ABS and body codes.
 
Tnx for reply's guy's.
I tried to be clear and concise in my post but to clarify even more,,,,,,,,,,,,
Advtrac light only on,,no others.
ford specific code reader found NO codes first try.
second try ford/lincoln dealer also found NO codes,cost him $90 :)
i read and consider your replies very relevant,,thank you.
However,,,,,,....
advtrac not working,,meh,,no concern...not a play car for me,,i have a vette.
At and abs disabled,,no prob,,been driving 50 years without :)
joegr,,the owner told me no codes,from two diff places..
how competent the mechs,,i dunno ??
02_ls,,the second place was a lincoln/ford dealer,,again,,who knows competency of mechanic ??
reading down,,joegr,,last code read was done at one of the largest lincoln/ford dealers in southern maine.
for whats that's worth ! :)

my take on this from your replies is the worst case is i may be without some features that i have not known about in my last 50 years of driving cars ??

excuse me if i seem flippant but going from " three on the tree " to a LS is a jump for me !!
my 88 Maserati is spartan compared to the LS.

I will now take more time to consider your replies and read and research more.

researching user names i have found how those of you that replied have grown in knowledge and shared it,,a needed thing in any forum as the old commentators leave and let the newbs to carry on to help others.

As this is the best forum on the LS i have found so far i will glean what i can here and use the info but doubt i will ever be able to
contribute as useful info as i have found in the week or so since i joined.

So,,i have possibles and likely's as expected with such a tech advanced car but nothing like " it is this ! " ..
and thats fine as long as it's not like " DONT DRIVE IT YOU WILL DIE ! " :)

maybe i will just put tape over the light and carry on ??

ANY other suggestions or input or info or comments will be gratefully considered.
tnx from a newb :)
 
If your ABS light is not on, then your ABS is working (I am assuming that the ABS light proves out at start up.)

We've both driven without airbags, but now that they are available, I want them and I want them to work.
I've driven without seat belts, but I wouldn't do it now. The point is that safety advances aren't a bad thing. Just because you've survived this long without one or two of them, doesn't mean they might not benefit you now. (I do understand that it's not the end of the world without it, but I don't think it will take much to fix it.)

For a while, Ford/Lincoln/Mercury was the place to take the LS. Unfortunately, it was more or less a one off car for them, and many dealers may not have mechanics that know how to best work on this mostly Jaguar car anymore.

Why don't you copy down the numbers on the ABS controller and first find out if it is the correct one...
 
joegr said:
If your ABS light is not on, then your ABS is working (I am assuming that the ABS light proves out at start up.)

We've both driven without airbags, but now that they are available, I want them and I want them to work.
I've driven without seat belts, but I wouldn't do it now. The point is that safety advances aren't a bad thing. Just because you've survived this long without one or two of them, doesn't mean they might not benefit you now. (I do understand that it's not the end of the world without it, but I don't think it will take much to fix it.)

For a while, Ford/Lincoln/Mercury was the place to take the LS. Unfortunately, it was more or less a one off car for them, and many dealers may not have mechanics that know how to best work on this mostly Jaguar car anymore.

Why don't you copy down the numbers on the ABS controller and first find out if it is the correct one...
Click to expand...

I agree with you on the safety features.
however ,after reading the owners manual ...

" The system is a driver aid which makes your vehicle easier to handle primarily on snow and ice covered roads "

and on it goes describing how to disable AdvanceTrac when getting stuck in the snow.

That could be a plus if it could do it better than i can but i don't think that's possible.
that's all moot as it will probably never be driven in snow or on ice :)

Another however,,i would like everything to function properly if possible,,at least to get the durned light to go out !! LOL !!

ABS controller numbers ?? correct one ??
are you saying the controller has something to do with the AdvanceTrac and may have been replaced with an improper unit ??

What do you think of the reflashing of the computer ??
 
when i changed out my front abs / hubs the dealer had to reprogram the advancetrac system.
maybe someone changed them out before you bought..?

in any case, i couldnt stand that dam light on in my face at all times, so that alone would be
enough to get it figured out.

good luck.
 
It can do things you can't do. You can't apply the brakes to single wheels (you don't have four pedals and four feet) to try and correct the direction that the car is traveling in.
The ABS controller is the heart of the AdvanceTrac system. AdvanceTrac was an option (LSes without AdvanceTrac got just traction control instead), so it is possible that your ABS controller could have been replaced by one without the AdvanceTrac feature.

Which of the several "computers" on the LS did you plan to re-flash? Depending on what you mean by re-flashing, I don't see it helping this. There certainly is a calibration procedure that can be run on the AdvanceTrac system. If that was your problem, there would definitely be a DTC to read from it (unless they didn't use the right tool/settings). BTW, the good Ford specific, complete system, scan tools can read out far more than just any triggered trouble codes.
 
joegr said:
It can do things you can't do. You can't apply the brakes to single wheels (you don't have four pedals and four feet) to try and correct the direction that the car is traveling in.
The ABS controller is the heart of the AdvanceTrac system. AdvanceTrac was an option (LSes without AdvanceTrac got just traction control instead), so it is possible that your ABS controller could have been replaced by one without the AdvanceTrac feature.

Which of the several "computers" on the LS did you plan to re-flash? Depending on what you mean by re-flashing, I don't see it helping this. There certainly is a calibration procedure that can be run on the AdvanceTrac system. If that was your problem, there would definitely be a DTC to read from it (unless they didn't use the right tool/settings). BTW, the good Ford specific, complete system, scan tools can read out far more than just any triggered trouble codes.
Click to expand...


What i read someplace else.

" A Lincoln mechanic says "I have seen a lot of the ADVANCE TRAC lights staying on, its a common problem(It happened on my LS). 99% of the time you just need to have the computer reflashed. This must be done by the dealer and it is usually about an hours worth of labor, so around 90 bucks depending on the dealer. This will fix all concerns""

My self,,i know nothing !! :)
thats why i'm here ..
 
First to find the controller and check numbers on the ABS controller like Joe said.

It was hit hard enough in the front like i said to need a new bumper,,wonder if some parts where replaced ??
will have to ask..

Thanks guy's for all the input.
 
roncoinc said:
What i read someplace else.

" A Lincoln mechanic says "I have seen a lot of the ADVANCE TRAC lights staying on, its a common problem(It happened on my LS). 99% of the time you just need to have the computer reflashed. This must be done by the dealer and it is usually about an hours worth of labor, so around 90 bucks depending on the dealer. This will fix all concerns""

My self,,i know nothing !! :)
thats why i'm here ..
Click to expand...

Interesting... I've had 4 LSes for a continuing total of over 380K miles and have never had the light remain on.
 
LS4me said:
Interesting... I've had 4 LSes for a continuing total of over 380K miles and have never had the light remain on.
Click to expand...

Me either, but I've only had two for a total of about 300K so far. The 04 has turned it on a couple of times, but it cleared the next time it was started in each case. Also each time, a scan showed a stored code for the steering angle sensor. It's been a pretty good while since the last time.
 
elephantrider interesting that you mention about the hubs.
I changed wheel bearing/hubs about a year ago, I recall the light coming on and going out by itself.
I recently changed ball joints and shocks in the front end, after only disconnecting the same hubs and putting them back in the same location, light came on again till I took it for a ride.
 
^ thats what i thought mine was, but it turned out that i just needed a dealer
to recalibrate / program the advancetrac system, after the hub swap.
 
I have not had any issues with my advancetrac light staying on since changing my steering wheel angle sensor. I had my codes read and it came back stating it needed to be replaced so I replaced it. You can spend the money to replace the sensor which is a pretty easy or you can try and have your codes read again from a reputable dealer to see what the stored code is.
 
Car was delivered today ! :)

Asked again about the AT light and he said..

" i know your going to go and pay $80 at the Lincoln dealership to get the code reader done but they will find NO codes i guarantee it,i had it done twice."

when i test drove it the message center said " check advancetrac".
hitting the reset got rid of it for that ride.

now i notice the light still flashes all the time but nothing in message center now ??

when i press the " status " button it says "advancetrac ok "

WTH ??

seems like more of a problem with light illumination trigger than a problem with the system ??

Also looks like somebody got a tad upset with it all and took their frustration out on the switch !! LOL !!
some epoxy and i can put it back :)

MVC-195F.JPG

a pic of the car and my sporty ride.


MVC-196F.JPG

MVC-195F.JPG


MVC-196F.JPG
 
roncoinc said:
...seems like more of a problem with light illumination trigger than a problem with the system ??

Also looks like somebody got a tad upset with it all and took their frustration out on the switch !! LOL !!
..
Click to expand...

I doubt that. The electronics in the cluster drive the light based on data received on the CAN bus from the ABS controller. It's not like it's a broken or shorted wire somewhere. If you come down to Gulfport, I'll pull the codes for you.

Nobody got mad at the switch. It's a pretty common problem. Both of mine broke, and we never even push them. (Epoxy solved it.) The E-brake switches break too. Go ahead and epoxy it in now. (Just don't get any on the moving parts of either switch.
 
joegr said:
I doubt that. The electronics in the cluster drive the light based on data received on the CAN bus from the ABS controller. It's not like it's a broken or shorted wire somewhere. If you come down to Gulfport, I'll pull the codes for you.

Nobody got mad at the switch. It's a pretty common problem. Both of mine broke, and we never even push them. (Epoxy solved it.) The E-brake switches break too. Go ahead and epoxy it in now. (Just don't get any on the moving parts of either switch.
Click to expand...

Ok,,you going to be home around 9 am ??
if i leave day before yesterday i can be there by then :)

more input on code pulling please..
why cant the dealer get them ??

can i find an free place like autozone or advance auto that can get them ??

what are reader and operator requirments ?
tnx.
 
1. No idea, other than they really aren't trying.
2. Usually, the scan tools they use can't get ABS/AdvanceTrac codes.
3. They need to be able to do Ford specific codes and to read ABS and body codes. Here is one example that I know works.
https://www.autoenginuity.com/order-online/vm-bundles.html
scroll down to the Ford bundle.
Here's what it covers: https://www.autoenginuity.com/products/oe-coverage-options/ford-family-ei01.html
https://www.autoenginuity.com/images/vehicle_samples/Ford/Ford-All-Systems-List.html

IVD Initialization
Steering Angle / Yaw Rate / Acceleration Sensor Reset ('03 Explorer and Lincoln LS)
Would be of interest to you right now. (IVD is AdvanceTrac)
 
ABS module model numbers
was told to get them and check to make sure correct for the car
2004 V8
4W4T - 2C219-CB

and how do i find if it is correct ??
 
That part number should be with IVD (AdvanceTrac), and it should fit 04 and 05. It look it is currently listed for the 04 by Ford, but that doesn't mean it couldn't be what shipped with the car. You can enter your VIN at FordPartsGiant and see what part number they suggest for it.
 
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