'03 V8 - exhaust fumes inside of cockpit after start-up

03LinLS

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I've searched this but couldn't find exactly the problem that I am experiencing. I'm not getting the smell of burnt oil (saw that thread), but I am getting the smell of exhaust upon start-up now. I think it really started when it was getting cold. It then goes away and it mainly is in the morning. I don't get it after work when it has only sat for a few hours (I'm in and out of the office). My Ford garage recently changed the cabin filter so I can't think something is wrong there. Anything I can check?

Thanks so much.
 
The cabin filter is not a factor in this at all. Your climate control is only ever supposed to bring fresh air in from the windshield area, not exhaust.
Do you have the factory exhaust? Did you cut the tail pipes short? If the answers are yes and no, then you have an exhaust leak somewhere that you need to find. Otherwise, you need to restore the tail pipes to the correct locations. The trunk vents near the back bumper on both sides, and then the trunk vents to the cabin.

Anyway, as it is now I wouldn't consider it safe to drive. You may take a nap while driving and never wake up.
 
Thank you. Yes, I have factory exhaust, no cutting/shortening. Completely stock car.
 
I would have that factory exhaust system thoroughly checked to make sure there is not a leak somewhere
 
I have this happen when there's a gentle breeze from the rear. Try turning the car around.
 
A quick update...my mechanic (15 year Lincoln mechanic now on his own) thinks I might have faulty valve cover gaskets. However, when I had a coil go at 69,000 miles, the Ford dealership replaced the valve cover gaskets (3W4Z 6584 AB and BB). I have 108,000 on there now. Wouldn't Ford have replaced them with the newer, up-rated gaskets? When my mechanic looked at it, he said that he smells oil. He didn't think it was an exhaust leak for some reason.
 
Well, that makes a lot more sense, but the smell of burning oil is different than the smell of exhaust.
I would bet that its the o-rings on the VCTs that are leaking, and not the valve cover gaskets themselves. Of course, since you have to remove the valve covers to replace the o-rings, you go ahead and replace the valve cover gaskets too. My 04 (about 180K miles) is now leaking enough from the two VCT o-rings to get the smell of oil in the garage. The valve cover gaskets are still okay, but I'm not taking the valve covers off and putting them back on with the old gaskets.
 
Thanks very much for the response. Now that I think about it, he did mention O-rings. I don't detect the smell of burning oil, but he said he did. To me, it smells just like standing behind the car on the initial start-up but in a much more concentrated area. Will it be quite apparent that the o-rings are bad upon inspection?
 
... Will it be quite apparent that the o-rings are bad upon inspection?

Yes. Open the hood and look at the valve covers. At the front of the each cover on top there is an electrical connection. It will be very oily around where the connector comes out of each valve cover (or at least one of the two).
 
Thank you again.

Is there a website that might have an exploded diagram of the VCT o-ring? Just in our casual conversation of discussing when I should drop the car off, I threw out the VCT O-ring and he thought that it was just on the V6. While it is apart, I would like to make sure this is checked. I thought he said something about the intake being sealed on the V8, but I could be wrong and maybe I gave him the wrong terminology to begin with, but I don't think I did.
 
This shows the VCT solenoid itself, but not the o-ring.
http://deneau.info/ls/s6x~us~en~file=s6x3e015.htm~gen~ref.htm
This is the right side valve cover remove/install instructions. Step 5 says to disconnect the VCT electrical. It is shown in the second drawing as item 1.
http://deneau.info/ls/s6x~us~en~file=s6x31008.htm~gen~ref.htm

How can he have looked at the valve cover and not seen it? (And by the way, both of mine are V8s and both have the VCTs.)

Here's a thread about this leak, and it includes a picture.
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/forum/showthread.php?80078-Oil-Leak-Cam-sensors-03-LS-V8
 
Thanks. He actually hadn't looked at the valve cover (yet). He was running through the possibilities. I'm taking it in on Thursday. He is going to start with the coil packs, I think, to see if some oil is in and around there. I'm not a mechanic so sometimes it's hard for me to translate everything from one place to another. Thank you for your replies and patience with me. Once it's fixed, I'll report back. I really like my mechanic...very nice guy and has been spot on in the past. I just like to educate myself a little bit too. This is a great forum to do so.
 
Update -

He replaced the O-rings and cleaned the engine compartment. I'm anxious to see if this does the trick. He was able to replace them without removing the valve cover gaskets. I have my doubts that this is the cause based on the fact that I don't think you had any cabin odors even when yours were leaking...only in the garage (oily smell).

I'll post more as I drive it for a bit.

Thanks again.





Thanks. He actually hadn't looked at the valve cover (yet). He was running through the possibilities. I'm taking it in on Thursday. He is going to start with the coil packs, I think, to see if some oil is in and around there. I'm not a mechanic so sometimes it's hard for me to translate everything from one place to another. Thank you for your replies and patience with me. Once it's fixed, I'll report back. I really like my mechanic...very nice guy and has been spot on in the past. I just like to educate myself a little bit too. This is a great forum to do so.
 
he replaced the VCT O rings without removing the valve covers? interesting
 
Yes. He pulled the coil packs and they were completely dry. He said if they were oily, it would indicate the valve cover gaskets would need to be replaced. He ordered those as well.

Unfortunately, the smell was right back in there today. He said the engine is completely dry/clean. Could it be an exhaust leak even though it can't be heard?






he replaced the VCT O rings without removing the valve covers? interesting
 
Let me show you what he replaced...maybe I'm not reporting accurately, here.

LS replacement.jpg
 
Let me show you what he replaced...maybe I'm not reporting accurately, here.

(Yes, that is a picture of the VCT solenoid, and clearly oil is/was leaking around the seal between it and the valve cover.)

Is that a picture from that car as it is now, as it was before, or from some other LS?

If it is from as it is now, then he didn't clean the oil off (or didn't fix the leak). Even after cleaning all the oil off, you may smell the cleaners (similar smell to burning oil) for a day or two. If the oil is not cleaned off, you'll probably smell it for a week or three more.

I didn't think you could replace those seals without removing the valve cover. I have two on the way to me now. Maybe I will better understand once I have that actual seal in my hands.
 
That is my car before the repair. Is it dry now. Will show another pic shortly.





(Yes, that is a picture of the VCT solenoid, and clearly oil is/was leaking around the seal between it and the valve cover.)

Is that a picture from that car as it is now, as it was before, or from some other LS?

If it is from as it is now, then he didn't clean the oil off (or didn't fix the leak). Even after cleaning all the oil off, you may smell the cleaners (similar smell to burning oil) for a day or two. If the oil is not cleaned off, you'll probably smell it for a week or three more.

I didn't think you could replace those seals without removing the valve cover. I have two on the way to me now. Maybe I will better understand once I have that actual seal in my hands.
 
Give it a few days for the cleaner and any remaining oil to burn off before you take it back.
Did he replace both sides, or just the passenger side? (If only the passenger side was leaking, I would expect the driver's side to start leaking too (maybe tomorrow or maybe next year).
 
Give it a few days for the cleaner and any remaining oil to burn off before you take it back.
Did he replace both sides, or just the passenger side? (If only the passenger side was leaking, I would expect the driver's side to start leaking too (maybe tomorrow or maybe next year).

Looks like you might have a coolant leak starting, either the upper radiator hose, or the top of the left radiator tank at the front of the tank (have to take the bracket off to see it. Alternately, it just be what he used to clean it. (It's the white stuff on the upper hose that am looking at.)
 
Thank you. Yes, he replaced both.

QUOTE=joegr;2037394750]Looks like you might have a coolant leak starting, either the upper radiator hose, or the top of the left radiator tank at the front of the tank (have to take the bracket off to see it. Alternately, it just be what he used to clean it. (It's the white stuff on the upper hose that am looking at.)[/QUOTE]
 
For those who hit this thread in the future...

The VCT seals can indeed be replaced without removing the valve covers. Replacement is really easy. Unplug the electrical connector, pry the old seal out, push the new seal in, and reconnect the electrical. The seal part number is 2W9Z-6A545-AA. You will need two, and they are about $11 each. The valve cover gasket set does not come with these seals.

In the case of my 04, the valve covers looked great externally, apart from the oil leaking around the VCTs (like the picture above), but I found oil in many of the wells when I removed the coils.
 

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