Alright guys...here it is.

Today...I finally had the LSE dynoed. I have a copy of the graph but...my scanner is on loan right now...so...I can't post it. Hopefully...I'll get it back next week...at which time...I'll be glad to post it up.

Anyway...drumroll...it made 220 hp (248 tq) at the rear wheels in 4th and 219 hp (251 tq) in 3rd. We tried both just because we wanted to see what difference it would make. Peak hp was at about 5200 rpm and peak torque was at about 3400 rpm. The two curves cross at about 5200 rpm. I did not get an a/f ratio but...I'm certain that it would have revealed a slightly rich condition.

So...assuming a 20% driveline loss...which is conservative considering a 5 speed slushbox with an IRS...we have about 264 hp and 297 tq (using the 4th gear ratings) at the flywheel. Not bad for a car with 252 hp / 261 tq from the factory. Oh...and my one mod is...my gutted stock airbox with a K&N panel. Which...BTW...wails at WOT when you are standing right next to it. So...chalk up at least 12 hp to the gutted stock airbox. I didn't have a non-gutted one to test with so...I don't know what the car would have made with it.

Other extraneous facts:
52000 miles
~45% humidity
~52 F
DynoJet dyno.

Next mod...exhaust (probably start with removing the resonators and adding a freer flowing muffler). I'll do another dyno at that time. We'll get the facts straight on what mods offer the most bang for the buck and end all of the crap internet racing/dynoing/manufacturer claims. Just remember...EVERY car is different.

Oh...one other thing...before I even mentioned what mod I wanted to do next...the dyno operator suggested that the exhaust be the first one on his list. He questioned if the factory is even 2.25". Does anyone know what diameter the factory system is?

-Pete
02LSE

i believe when my car was on the lift it was 2.50 from the cats then it turned into 2.25"

Cool. Sounds like pretty good numbers. BTW, depending on what view mode your dyno operator had it in, the torque and hp always cross at 5200.

What was the HP after 5200?

Oh...one other thing...before I even mentioned what mod I wanted to do next...the dyno operator suggested that the exhaust be the first one on his list. He questioned if the factory is even 2.25". Does anyone know what diameter the factory system is?

-Pete
02LSE

cats-back the stock is 2.25" and full of bends. there has been aalot of threads on exhausts - you should be able to get a lot of good ideas from those.

What was the HP after 5200?

Horsepower falls off gradually to ~210 at 5900 and torque falls of pretty quickly to ~190 at 5900k.

One other thing I didn't mention...in 3rd, it hit the rev-limiter at ~5900 (makes sense) however, in 4th, it hit the speed sensor at ~132 mph. Obviously, I haven't had the car up that fast or I would have found this out before yesterday. I suppose I didn't realize it was limited to 30 mph less than the speedo. Oh well...you learn something new everyday. Any faster in 4th and it wouldn't have mattered much anyway as the hp and torque curves already crossed and were decreasing.

Quik...yeah...I know there have been multiple posts about exhaust but...sorta like the intake posts...nothing is definitive. Now that I know the size...I'll probably just go 2.5" from the cat-back. Then we'll re-dyno.

You know one thing that I have not been able to find...a flow rate comparison of name brand mufflers. i.e. Flowmaster, Magnaflow, Dynomax, Borla, Dynatech, Summit Racing, IMCO, etc. A one stop shopping for this would be great. I mean...you can calculate the flow rate of an air filter and I'm sure you can calculate the flow rate of a muffler. But...why can't someone just put these on a flow bench and illustrate exactly what they flow?

Thanks for the posts y'all.

-Pete
02 LSE

Horsepower falls off gradually to ~210 at 5900 and torque falls of pretty quickly to ~190 at 5900k.

One other thing I didn't mention...in 3rd, it hit the rev-limiter at ~5900 (makes sense) however, in 4th, it hit the speed sensor at ~132 mph. Obviously, I haven't had the car up that fast or I would have found this out before yesterday. I suppose I didn't realize it was limited to 30 mph less than the speedo. Oh well...you learn something new everyday. Any faster in 4th and it wouldn't have mattered much anyway as the hp and torque curves already crossed and were decreasing.

Quik...yeah...I know there have been multiple posts about exhaust but...sorta like the intake posts...nothing is definitive. Now that I know the size...I'll probably just go 2.5" from the cat-back. Then we'll re-dyno.

You know one thing that I have not been able to find...a flow rate comparison of name brand mufflers. i.e. Flowmaster, Magnaflow, Dynomax, Borla, Dynatech, Summit Racing, IMCO, etc. A one stop shopping for this would be great. I mean...you can calculate the flow rate of an air filter and I'm sure you can calculate the flow rate of a muffler. But...why can't someone just put these on a flow bench and illustrate exactly what they flow?

Thanks for the posts y'all.

-Pete
02 LSE


If anyone knows this I would be willing to bet it would be el es or Quick!!! :dj:

yeah.
they are my heroes...
it's so good to know that you can turn to this forum for questions and opinions.

here you go ->
http://www.exhaustsoundclips.com/cfm.pdf
http://www.a-1performance.com/flow.htm

...but keep it a secret :Beer

here you go ->
http://www.exhaustsoundclips.com/cfm.pdf
http://www.a-1performance.com/flow.htm

...but keep it a secret :Beer


Yeaya!!!! See I told ya :Beer

cats-back the stock is 2.25" and full of bends. there has been aalot of threads on exhausts - you should be able to get a lot of good ideas from those.

i could have sworn that the pipes were bigger at the cats.

how the heck can can u get 12 horsepower from just cutting the bottom of your airbox off? does this even let more air in? youre still using the same hole to get air in. it seems like all this would do is allow more engine heat to get into the airbox which would make this mod pointless.

how the heck can can u get 12 horsepower from just cutting the bottom of your airbox off? does this even let more air in? youre still using the same hole to get air in. it seems like all this would do is allow more engine heat to get into the airbox which would make this mod pointless.

Correct me if im wrong but i believe that the pre 03 airbox was restrictive and was reworked for post 03.

the 02 had a re-worked airbox on the 01 motor - the 03 had a completely different setup as that is when it went to the current 280hp with VVT, better intake and exhaust.

Alright guys...here it is.

Today...I finally had the LSE dynoed. I have a copy of the graph but...my scanner is on loan right now...so...I can't post it. Hopefully...I'll get it back next week...at which time...I'll be glad to post it up.

Anyway...drumroll...it made 220 hp (248 tq) at the rear wheels in 4th and 219 hp (251 tq) in 3rd. We tried both just because we wanted to see what difference it would make. Peak hp was at about 5200 rpm and peak torque was at about 3400 rpm. The two curves cross at about 5200 rpm. I did not get an a/f ratio but...I'm certain that it would have revealed a slightly rich condition.

So...assuming a 20% driveline loss...which is conservative considering a 5 speed slushbox with an IRS...we have about 264 hp and 297 tq (using the 4th gear ratings) at the flywheel. Not bad for a car with 252 hp / 261 tq from the factory. Oh...and my one mod is...my gutted stock airbox with a K&N panel. Which...BTW...wails at WOT when you are standing right next to it. So...chalk up at least 12 hp to the gutted stock airbox. I didn't have a non-gutted one to test with so...I don't know what the car would have made with it.

Other extraneous facts:
52000 miles
~45% humidity
~52 F
DynoJet dyno.

Next mod...exhaust (probably start with removing the resonators and adding a freer flowing muffler). I'll do another dyno at that time. We'll get the facts straight on what mods offer the most bang for the buck and end all of the crap internet racing/dynoing/manufacturer claims. Just remember...EVERY car is different.

Oh...one other thing...before I even mentioned what mod I wanted to do next...the dyno operator suggested that the exhaust be the first one on his list. He questioned if the factory is even 2.25". Does anyone know what diameter the factory system is?

-Pete
02LSE
Pete,
I was really interested in seeing your dyno numbers. But, I can't follow the math. Doesn't 264 at the flywheel less 20% drivetrain loss equal 211.2 at the rear wheels? 220 HP at the rear wheels would have to give you something like 275 HP at the flywheel. No? Lincolnlov

A quick thing to point out, HP and TQ will always cross at 5250 rpms, its part of the calculation.

You will always have more HP than torque after 5250rpm, and always have more torque than HP below 5250 rpm. But you can still have a HP peak below that rpm.

A quick thing to point out, HP and TQ will always cross at 5250 rpms, its part of the calculation.

You will always have more HP than torque after 5250rpm, and always have more torque than HP below 5250 rpm. But you can still have a HP peak below that rpm.

That is very close. It's actually 5252 rpm. You see, a dyno cannot measure horsepower...only torque. That is why dyno pulls are always done in a 1:1 gear ratio so there isn't any gear multiplication. The dyno then uses a mathematical calculation to compute horsepower. This results in a graph that ALWAYS has torque and hp intersecting at 5252 rpm. If you see a graph that shows otherwise, I would call :bsflag:

I just recently saw one of those graphs on a focus turbo/supercharger kit (I cannot remember which it was or who made it) but the torque graph looked pretty normal, and the HP graph almost looked hand drawn, and when I start punching numbers, the HP was almost 30hp higher than the torque/rpm calculated to.....

I have the actual formula that is used somewhere. If I can find it, I will post it.

Torque / 5252 * RPM = HP Right?

I can't find it Putter! But it seems to me that is was more than that. But I see where you're coming from with your formula. I gotta find the damn thing!!

I can't find it Putter! But it seems to me that is was more than that. But I see where you're coming from with your formula. I gotta find the damn thing!!

Horsepower and Torque:

Horsepower comes from torque. Torque is a result of the combustion process forcing the piston downward and rotating the crank. This output is measured as Torque. The idea is to generate high enough pressure on each stroke often enough (rpm) to generate the necessary Horsepower.

Horsepower = (Torque * RPM)/5252

Torque = (Horsepower * 5252)/rpm

http://www.rpmoutlet.com/formula.htm