and what do they give me for a loaner.....a Deville.:slam

A frickin' lazy boy on wheels....I kept checking under the seat for the remote control.
What a boat....almost as bad as driving a Lincoln:woowoo2:

....almost as bad as driving a Lincoln:woowoo2:

I guess the old saying is true - once you go ugly you never go back. :N

Stay with the xlr - you'll be in the only one on the road [/thanx god xlr owner doesn't know it's ugly]

I think the XLR is a totally hot car and 99% of the guys on this board would trade for one if they could.

I have always like large 4 door cars, Fleetwood Cadillacs, Coupe de Ville, ect,
even :C when I was in grade school up to now, but I would sure take an
XLR if I could afford one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

02/21/05 - GM announced it was jammed with a backlog of unsold Cadillac CTS and STS sedans and SRX SUVs. This week, GM announced it is slowing production of the high-end, two-seat Cadillac XLR -- Cadillac's halo car.

DETROIT -- Last summer customers waited in line to buy Cadillac's hot XLR. Now dealers are waiting to sell them.

GM has reduced XLR production at its Bowling Green, Ky., plant from 23 vehicles a day to 12, union officials say.

As of Feb. 1, Cadillac had a 200-day supply of the $76,200 vehicle -- about 1,700 units.

- it's all about value -> http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=101909 (as a lincoln guy would say - ugly doesn't sell :N )

http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/vbgarage.php?do=getimage&id=672

We've all got our preferences, and I have my issues with the art and science thing, but this is a damn nice car. A Corvette with a more luxurious touch. The pricepoint may be too high for the market to bear, but that is a mistake the marketers made in pricing the car. Nothing to do with the car. Price it at $50K and it probably flies out the door.

Cadillac, like Lincoln and any other domestic brand needs to overcome the poor resale values as compared to imports. That is what is killing the US brands. If you want to trade vehicles fairly often, 3-4 years, you get hammered in value as compared to a comparable import model. That has to change for things to improve in domestic US new car sales.

When you can pick up a $6000-$7000 '98 Mark VIII with under 100,000 miles, you know something is going on.

I just primmed and primped my '98 this past weekend. When I got into the car Monday morning, I could swear I was in a brand new car. Except for some wear on the drivers seat and a couple of bumps and bruises on the body, the car runs and handles like new. With the wraparound 'cockpit', the inside is as 'modern' as any car on the road. Unless you call all the flash trend as modern. Then this car is a little behind the times.

But for the XLR, I look forward to being able to pick one up on the cheap. I sold cars for 4 years. Cars are a bad investment. To call them an investment at all is an oxymoron. Enjoy them for what they provide. Transportation and enjoyment. Some cars cost $100/month to drive and enjoy. Others cost a grand to do the same. In the end, it's up to the owner to decide if the value is there, no matter what kind of car.

If they didn't make any more at all that would be OK with me.
I wouldn't mind being the only ulgy car on the road,
It suits my taste :C

You want to talk sales?Cadillac is worlds ahead of Lincoln.Since Art and Science became Cadillac's new design theme they have been doing great.Sales have surpassed those of BMW and Mercedes Benz.Now Lincoln,oh God,Lincoln.To put in the simplest words possible,Lincoln is on life support.For 40 years Ford has done nothing to make the brand better.The Town Car is still riding on the same suspension and chassis as the 1976 Town Car.They stopped making the Mark Series,big no no.And now to try to improve the brand,they have come out with the Lincoln Mark LT.This Lincoln truck is the same exact truck as the for F-150,besides the prettier grill.Same truck,30 grand more.Same body,same interior.Might as well go buy a F-150 for 30 grand less.People just aren't going for the old,dull,grandma land yachts anymore.Look what Cadillac did.They changed they entire design image back in 2000 starting with the Deville.In the past 5 years,Cadillac has past Mercedes Benz and BMW in yearly sales.In the past 5 years,they have come out with 4 new awsome cars.With 3 more planned for the next 3 years.They were getting close to the same boat as Lincoln.But they woke up and realized what people want.Unless a miracle happens,Fords going to have to pull the plug on Lincoln.What they need to do is what everyone is doing.Benz has AMG.BMW has the M Power.Cadillac woke up and came out with the V-Series.See a trend?Don't yah think Lincoln should jump on the band wagon?They also need to start making cars that don't look like everything else on the road.When theres a Caddy rolling down the road,you take one slight glimpse at it and you know its a Caddy.There some of the most distinct cars out there.

Not sure what you just type cause you hardly use any punctuation.

I believe your facts are incorrect:

you said - "In the past 5 years,Cadillac has past Mercedes Benz and BMW in yearly sales"

http://www.forbes.com/columnists/2004/12/14/cz_jf_1214flint.html
"This year Cadillac will outsell Mercedes-Benz, but won't come close to BMW or Lexus."

you said - "But they woke up and realized what people want"

And since this article - the lots are full and production is now cut:
http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=101909
"As of Feb. 1, Cadillac had a 200-day supply of the vehicle -- about 1,700 units."

True - Cadillac has more mommentum than Lincoln in the car division - Ford's decided to position Jaguar as the Luxury line and Lincoln as the 'near-lux' line.

They stopped making the Mark Series,big no no.And now to try to improve the brand,they have come out with the Lincoln Mark LT.This Lincoln truck is the same exact truck as the for F-150,besides the prettier grill.Same truck,30 grand more.

When theres a Caddy rolling down the road,you take one slight glimpse at it and you know its a Caddy.There some of the most distinct cars out there.


First off, 30 grand more?, no, fully loaded the Mark LT is 47,000. just about 1,000 more than a fully loaded F-150.

Escalade looks just like the suburban, especially the avalanche clone. So don't bash lincon for putting out something that looks like a ford when cadillac puts out something that looks just like a chevy and say cadillac is "distinct".

:L

First off, 30 grand more?, no, fully loaded the Mark LT is 47,000. just about 1,000 more than a fully loaded F-150.

Escalade looks just like the suburban, especially the avalanche clone. So don't bash lincon for putting out something that looks like a ford when cadillac puts out something that looks just like a chevy and say cadillac is "distinct".



Now obviously 30 grand was a number I pulled from my ass.I was actually being sarcastic.And a 4x4 LT can run up to 54 grand.But the thing is,it trulely is the same truck.Sytleing and everything.

Now when you say the Escalade to just like the Suburban,thats just stupid.Styling is TOTALLY different.Unlike the LT and the F-1:q:q:q:qty,cues and lines on the Escalade and Burban are totally different.Front ends are totally different.Unlike the LT and F,you can put the Escalade and Burban next to eachother and actually beable to tell them apart,pretty easily.Its all the same with the Avalanche too.

Now,unlike Ford and Lincoln,besides the Escalade,no Caddy resembles and other GM car.The Navigator resembles the Expedition.The Aviator resembles the Explorer.The Town Junk resembles the Crown Victoria.Before they stopped making them,the Mark series resembled the T-Bird.The Ls and Continental both resembles/d the Taurus.Now,what other GM does the Seville,STS,XLR,Deville,CTS,Eldorado or Fleetwood resmeble? Nothing.

Not sure what you just type cause you hardly use any punctuation.

Well,most people start that kind of sentence with the word "Im".As in "Im not sure...".And the word "cause" in your sentence makes no sense.

I believe your facts are incorrect:

Sir,that document is at the least a year old.I read something someplace online that said Cadillac has passed both BMW and Benz.And was gaining on Lexus.I have not succeeded in finding that document yet but will continue to look.

"As of Feb. 1, Cadillac had a 200-day supply of the vehicle -- about 1,700 units."

Maybe true,but,Cadillac is doing better than they were.And ahead of much of the competition.Cadillac is going to be selling 2 new models over seas within the next 2 years,that should do well,but we'll have to see.

Now,unlike Ford and Lincoln,besides the Escalade,no Caddy resembles and other GM car.The Navigator resembles the Expedition.The Aviator resembles the Explorer.The Town Junk resembles the Crown Victoria.Before they stopped making them,the Mark series resembled the T-Bird.The Ls and Continental both resembles/d the Taurus.Now,what other GM does the Seville,STS,XLR,Deville,CTS,Eldorado or Fleetwood resmeble? Nothing.

I would say that the exterior of the navigator is just as different for the expedition as the escalade is from the chevy trucks. Look at the shape of the headlights on the new cadillac and compare them to the headlights on the chevy trucks. As well as for the hood.

Don't even get me started on the interior of the escalade. It has been the same as the yukons and suburbans since they started making the car. What about the Navigator interior compared to the expedition interior. It bears no resemblence whatsoever. Obviously you are biased against ford, and have no respect for the best selling truck in the world for 27 years in a row.

Bottom line. Navigator is more diferentiated from the expedition that the escalade is from the suburban.

Town car, has needed an overhaul for a long time, they are working on that right now.

Aviator is being dumped and replaced with a crossover vehicle

Lincoln, while still somewhat resembling its ford counterpart, is doing something about it.

You may be able to diferentiate a cadillac from any other car, but can you diferentiate a CTS grille from an STS grill. Its more difficult that to tell a Town Car from an LS. But, there is nothing wrong with that.

Sounds like you have some pent up tension toward Lincoln.

I think a nice ride in the pillow soft Town Car would do you some good.

TownCar97 :L

I would say that the exterior of the navigator is just as different for the expedition as the escalade is from the chevy trucks. Look at the shape of the headlights on the new cadillac and compare them to the headlights on the chevy trucks. As well as for the hood.

Don't even get me started on the interior of the escalade. It has been the same as the yukons and suburbans since they started making the car. What about the Navigator interior compared to the expedition interior. It bears no resemblence whatsoever. Obviously you are biased against ford, and have no respect for the best selling truck in the world for 27 years in a row.

Bottom line. Navigator is more diferentiated from the expedition that the escalade is from the suburban.

Town car, has needed an overhaul for a long time, they are working on that right now.

Aviator is being dumped and replaced with a crossover vehicle

Lincoln, while still somewhat resembling its ford counterpart, is doing something about it.

You may be able to diferentiate a cadillac from any other car, but can you diferentiate a CTS grille from an STS grill. Its more difficult that to tell a Town Car from an LS. But, there is nothing wrong with that.

Sounds like you have some pent up tension toward Lincoln.

I think a nice ride in the pillow soft Town Car would do you some good.

TownCar97


In your first paragraph,assuming that you have some brains,you are comparing Escalade headlights to the Chevy trucks and not Caddy cars.There is no rememblence at all in the Escalades headlights and the Suburbans headlights.Totally different.I will agree that the interiors are very much alike.But exteriors are a totally different story.

My point is that you can hardly put a Navi and Expedition n ext to each other and tell them apart.Thats not the story with the Escalade and Suburban.You can tell the difference with those two.And yes,I hate Fords.They are junk.And instead of trying to make a more quality product,they continue to build sh!t.The quality and craftsmenship of Fords is just terrible.You go to pick a parts,Ford always has the most vehicles sitting in the yard.Many of which are late 90's vehicles,and I sh!t you not,many Lincolns too.You can't feed any crap to me saying that Fords are good cars,because there just junk.Everyone I know that owns a ford complains about it.My neighbor bought a 2002 F250,brand new off the lot.Two weeks after he got it,his radiator blew up.Shortly after that,his windows started leaking,then shortly after that his chrome wheels started rusting.The truck now has around 50.000 miles,on its second engine,3 tranny,and is about to die again.A good friend of mine,her mother has a 2001 Taurus wagon.Around 75,000 miles,also on the second engine,has had tons of tranny work done to it,and the exaust fell of a few days ago.Her dad also has a 2003 F-150.She says its aways having something replaced on it.Another buddy,2002 Taurus.The engine just went with 32000 miles.He's got a for sale sign on it as we speak.Those are just a few examples.Need I go on?Me on the other hand.Die hard GM(Cadillac if ya wanna go technical)I have owned Caddys since I have been able to drive.And I drive them to there about ready to drop.Never have sold one with under 250,000 miles.Never have had a problem with any of them under 200,000 miles.And the few problems I have had were normal,such as shocks.And other tiny things.My mental brother drives Lincolns.His are junk.There always in the shop getting something fixed.He's got a 1998 Mark that he drives in the summer.Garage kept,never seen snow.50,000 miles on it and the suspension went last summer.Cost him like 6 grand to get it fixed.He keeps buying the things for some reason.Fords are junk.I hate them and have plenty of reasons to.

They should have worked on Town Cars redesign years ago.And its more than "somewhat" resembling Ford.More like duplicating it.

Pillow soft Town Car?The ride in those doesn't compare to that of my STS bud.MRC?Come on now,you need to take a ride in the New STS,Magnetic Ride
Control,reads the road 1000 times per second.And you literally don't feel a thing.I rented a brand new Town Car,(got the deal of a lifetime,had to take it)and maybe its because of being used to my STS,but honestly,I wasn't impressed.There was more road noise and wind noise than I expected.Far more than any Caddy Ive driven.And the ride was OK.Nothing to brag about.Lincolns got some catching up to do.Besides,the design is serverly out dated.

Sorry about any spelling errors I may have made.And for those of you who have trouble reading post with some punctuation errors here and there,try your best.Its pushing midnight.

And yes,I hate Fords.They are junk.And instead of trying to make a more quality product,they continue to build sh!t.The quality and craftsmenship of Fords is just terrible.You go to pick a parts,Ford always has the most vehicles sitting in the yard.Many of which are late 90's vehicles,and I sh!t you not,many Lincolns too.


When I joined this forum I was under the impression that it would be a place where people of the same interests could discuss the differences and advantages between Lincolns and Cadillacs. It appears that it may have strayed from this original mission statement. You sir have turned this particular thred into a personal vendeta against all those who appreciate Lincoln.

You refuse to accept the possibility that something produced by Ford would be of any value.

You also have refused to engage in intelligent discussion. This is displayed through your vulger use of the english language. It shows your lack of intelligence and I can proudly say that I do not care what you think about Lincoln or Ford.

GM is a good company, as well as Ford. If you want to talk about cars looking like others just take a look at GM's line of SUVs. The Chevy Trailblazer in particular. This platform has now been employed nine times within the same company. Please let me know if I left any variations out.

2 Chevy Trailblazer and extended cab
3 GMC envoy, extended cab and "Convertable" (discontinued)
1 Oldsmobile Bravada
1 Isuzu Ascender
1 Saab whatever they are going to call it.
1 Buick Rainer

All of these models can be seen as extreamly similar in sheet metal as well as their profiles. They give it the "Escalade Treatment" Change the front and slap some fake plastic wood trim on the interior.

How many times has Ford consecutively cloned one platform to look almost the same.

4 times maximum.

1 Mazda 6, Ford Fusion, Mercury Milan, Lincoln Zephyr

This is the only quattro of cars that I can think of that ford has based off of the same chasis that appear to look somewhat allike. and even at that the Zephyr looks nothing like the mazda 6, nor do the fusion or the milan while the GM SUV's all generally look the same.

Ford has been more creative. Their safety systems are more advanced. Town Car was the first car in history to ever recieve 5 stars in all 5 categories of crash tests. And as far as I know it is still the only car to have ever gotten such a rating.

All cadillacs leak oil. My brothers STS leaks oil, his broaghm before it leaked oil. The rappers in music videos talk about how their cadillacs leak oil like it's something to be proud of.

"Cadillac Grilles, Cadillac Grilles, Look at the Oil My Cadillac Spills"

Lincoln as well as cadillac are very good cars but the fact of the matter is is that cadillac is the nicest car company that GM owns. So they are giving it all they have got. Ford has Jaguar into which they have poured allot of money and created a nice line of cars. So this puts Lincoln somewhere in limbo between Buick and Jaguar as far as luxury goes this is why you do not see a V-Series equivalent.

I am happy with the panther cars but they are due for a refurb and they will be great when they are done.

Please improve your attitude

TownCar97 :L

the opening post makes fun of a lincoln, I poked fun back.....

KillerCTSV - you've really lost it.....

:thread:

Now obviously 30 grand was a number I pulled from my ass.I was actually being sarcastic.And a 4x4 LT can run up to 54 grand.But the thing is,it trulely is the same truck.Sytleing and everything.

Not sure where you got 54 Grand, I went on the Lincoln Build and Price website and put everything that I possibly could on the LT and the price came out to $47,605.

TownCar97 :L

Quick LS-I don't call telling it like it is making fun of something.If you want me to make fun of Lincoln,I can.And also,please,oh please tell me how I've lost anything.Im not the one driving a Lincoln.

And Towncar97-http://www.automobilemag.com/news/new_2005/Pickup_Trucks/0410_mark_lt/

is where I came up with the $54,000 (its actually ranged between $52,845-$56,545.I chose a number in between.)

dude - relax - maybe your grammar will have a chance to catch up to your emotions....

Its beats yours.

CTS-V - 1/4 mile - 13.1 @ 109
Quik LS - 1/4 mile - 13.9350 @ 109.04

CTS-V = about $90,000 (guessing)
Quik LS = $43,000 + $5,000 in mods

not sure this is something to brag about...... even if you get your grammar on track.

And Towncar97-http://www.automobilemag.com/news/new_2005/Pickup_Trucks/0410_mark_lt/


I quote from the source meaning the people who sell the vehicle. Isn't that the best place to get the information?

I thought you would have listened to reason, but now you are just acting like a twelve year old. It's really quite funny. :N :L

CTS-V - 1/4 mile - 13.1 @ 109
Quik LS - 1/4 mile - 13.9350 @ 109.04

CTS-V = about $90,000 (guessing)
Quik LS = $43,000 + $5,000 in mods

not sure this is something to brag about...... even if you get your grammar on track.

Wow Quik LS that is one awesome car. Love the looks.

TownCar97 :L

Quik LS CTS-V - 1/4 mile - 13.1 @ 109
Quik LS - 1/4 mile - 13.9350 @ 109.04

CTS-V = about $90,000 (guessing)
Quik LS = $43,000 + $5,000 in mods

not sure this is something to brag about...... even if you get your grammar on track.



WHOA buddy!Quick LS,a brand new CTS-V runs at about $50,185.Very inexpensive for what you get.And imagine what you can do to a V with 5 grand.That LS6 would be scary with a supercharger or twin turbo.It would easily bring that time down to low 12s,possibly even high 11s.Iv'e got a buddy with a 2000 WS6 Trans Am.With the LS6.Not sure what stock times(I believe around 13.6) are on a WS6 but he's got a twin turbo set up in his WS6 and does low 12's.I'd say 0-60 in 4.6 seconds and 1/4 in 13.1 is plenty to brag about for $50,000.

I quote from the source meaning the people who sell the vehicle. Isn't that the best place to get the information?

I doubt my source just made it up.

I thought you would have listened to reason, but now you are just acting like a twelve year old. It's really quite funny.

How am I acting like a twelve year old?Because I have beaten you on discussing the topic,instead of accepting that,you resort trying to insult me by calling me a twelve year old.Hows that for immaturity TownCar97?

By the way Quick LS,a CTS-V could out handle your LS anyday.

By the way Quick LS,a CTS-V could out handle your LS anyday.

Based on what facts? Do you know anything about my car?

You keep spewing - nothing to back it up - except your bad grammar.

I doubt my source just made it up.

Well, wether or not they made it up, they are inacurate. You lose. :L

And Towncar97-http://www.automobilemag.com/news/new_2005/Pickup_Trucks/0410_mark_lt/

Here is the article

OK, so the last Lincoln-badged pickup was the Blackwood (a.k.a. the Blackhole, the Deadwood, and the Whywould), a vehicle mis-begotten enough to make the Edsel look inspired. Rest assured, the new Mark LT is no Blackwood. Based on the very fine Ford F-150 SuperCrew, the four-door Lincoln Mark LT promises to be-unlike its monochromatic forebear-a bona fide, honest-to-goodness truck, available with two- or four-wheel drive and sporting an actual, fill-it-up-and-get-it-dirty bed (no carpeting or African wenge wood back there, thank you very much). Behind that familiar waterfall grille resides the F-150's excellent, three-valves-per-cylinder, 5.4-liter Triton V-8, which produces 300 hp and 365 lb-ft of torque.

ON SALE: Early 2005
PRICE: $52,845-$56,545
ENGINE: 300-hp, 5.4-liter V-8
BOTTOM LINE: Let's pretend the Blackwood never happened, OK? This is a worthy Lincoln pickup.


Notice the line that says on sale early 2005. This implies that when the article was written that pricing information was not yet released. So, they were just making an educated guess. A bad and incorrect one.

Have a nice day :N :L

By the way Quick LS,a CTS-V could out handle your LS anyday.


http://home.comcast.net/~tmango/whocares3.jpg

Based on what facts? Do you know anything about my car?

Well,according to the mods YOU listed,there is no indication of suspention or chassis modifcations anywhere.So unless for some reason you forgot to list some of your mods,there has been no work done to your suspention or chassis.If you have those kind of mods done to your LS,maybe you should list them on your mods list so that people don't think what I did.My sh!t has been spewed,and plenty to back it up.You people. :Bang

Hey TownCar97,I was on my way home from work today.I drove by the local Lincoln Mercury dealership.And since they can't sell anything,they were having a huge sale.In which I must mention the silver Mark LT out front,on the roof there was this huge sign,it said-SALE!$48,995.Written in window marker on the windshield-$52,000.So it appears that what Lincoln says they sell for,well,it isn't what your always going to pay at the dealership.

And
TWasAroundHere,QuickLS started a comparison between his his car and the higher performance CTS-V.So,apparently someone cares.And since you both responded to what I said,Its quite obvious that you both care.Im going by the fact that I don't respond to posts that I don't care about.If you didn't care about it,why then the response.

wrong again dude - YOU started the comparisons - read the threads.

And if you read more of this board you'll find that most of my mods are in the braking and suspension area. I autocross twice per month - Solo2 class ESP #0018.

I never said my car was better in any of the posts, it's an LS, it's a fine car - it will never be a 1/4 mile rocket nor a Grand-Am racer - but it does ok. I'll keep trying to make it better.

You jumped into a thread where a cadillac guy made a fun joke about a lincoln, I made one back. All your crap is simply out of context. enough already.

You started a direct comparison between a CTS-V and your LS.Which I responded to.It was quite clear that thats what was being mentioned by TWas.

I was looking at your mod list in you "garage" area.I saw nothing on suspention work.

And Im also making fun of Lincolns.What the difference?The difference is is that you have tried to turned this into an insult contest.I could care less but just for the records,I do believe you tried to insult me several times on my grammar.TownCar had aslo tried to insult me by trying to say I was immature.Ever since I joined in on this thread you have been nothing but a complete ball buster.Now,since this thread has turned into something useless,just have a mod close the damn thing.

Killer CTSV

To combat your claim that no Cadillac looks like any other car, just take a look at this link. A very sexy Cadillac based off of the SAAB 9-3. It is a beautiful car and it will only be sold in Europe. But as stated above, it is based off of the SAAB 9-3 and if I was not told this I could have guessed it myself

http://www.allcarscentral.com/forums/index.php?topic=403.0

Also, here is a link to a forum thread at All Cars Central listing an article from motor trend magazine. The article states that the interior of the brand new STS is Cavalier Cheap. I myself have touched the interior panels at the auto show and it is a little coarse for a luxury car, especially a Cadillac.

http://www.allcarscentral.com/forums/index.php?topic=381.0

If you ask me this is proof enough to dispel your suggestion that Cadillac has some omnipotent power over any other car manufacturer to make them perfectly flawless. Just to let everyone know, neither GM nor Ford is known for high quality. Can anyone guess what car manufacturer is? That's right Toyota. To bad the only car they make that I like is $74,000 (Lexus LS 430)

These are my last remarks on this topic; hope to have more friendly discussions in other threads in the future.

TownCar97
:L

My sh!t has been spewed,and plenty to back it up.Don't care about the debate, but this line . . . man, what an allegory LOL!!

Peace to both sides. Out.

What ever you think, building a lincoln on a mazda platform is a bad idea. The LS was a great car...Lincoln is making the same mistake Caddy did with the Eldorado...leaving it alone and not updating and evolving the line.

the escalade only really looked like a chevy the first year, then it was redesigned and took off.

The LS rides on a superb platform.
Unfortunately Lincoln chose not to develop it.
The 00 -02 LS rides on a stiffer suspension.
The 03 to present is softer bowing to demands from "traditional" Lincoln dealers.

But to give you an idea just what potential the LS has, it out handled every car short of 3 Porsches on the wet skid pad trials at the One Lap of America
event last year. The only suspension changes were stiffer springs, thicker sway bar and adjustable shocks...and that was it. The LS uses a race designed all-aluminum suspension with anti-dive characteristics.
Aluminum hood, front fenders, trunk lid, battery-in-the trunk etc...
Much more that ANY dealer ever told a perspective customer.

This year they will compete with a Roush-built 4.6.
450 RW horsepower is their target.
THIS IS THE CAR LINCOLN SHOULD HAVE BUILT !!

I own a 2000 LS V8 Sport but I have also driven a CTS-V on the slalom course at a Cadillac event.

There is so much more power in the Cadillac that it's hard to imagine the actual handling differences.
I preferred the LS steering but the Caddie was not bad at all.

XLR
I also drove an XLR and I thought that it was MUCH more streetable than the new Vette.
Very smooth driver and great handler. But you have to live with virtually NO none, nada storage space at all.
Styling..hmm..Lund has an XLR body kit based on the Rides TV show that can dress up the front and rear of the XLR IMNSHO.

the escalade only really looked like a chevy the first year, then it was redesigned and took off.

The only real change that caddy made to the escalade is the front end. They then used the same sheet metal as the suburban and just covered up the curves with their body cladding. There is nothing wrong with that, the Escalade is a nice car, but I think it gets more credit than it is due.

TownCar97 :L

But the thing is,they made it right.They didn't make it look like crap like Pontiac did on the Asstec.They made it look good.But we see what a difference and distincion a little body cladding can make.People just like it.It gives the Escalade more lines than the Yukon orTahoe.

To combat your claim that no Cadillac looks like any other car, just take a look at this link. A very sexy Cadillac based off of the SAAB 9-3. It is a beautiful car and it will only be sold in Europe. But as stated above, it is based off of the SAAB 9-3 and if I was not told this I could have guessed it myself

And is there a point there?The BTS is BASED of the 9-3.BASED.Not A 9-3.You can base anycar of another.That Doesn't mean they look alike.The BTS and 9-3 show no similarities in styling whatsoever.Just like the LS is based of a Mazda,yet look nothing alike.

Also, here is a link to a forum thread at All Cars Central listing an article from motor trend magazine. The article states that the interior of the brand new STS is Cavalier Cheap. I myself have touched the interior panels at the auto show and it is a little coarse for a luxury car, especially a Cadillac.

Ok buddy.Take it from someone that owns a 2005 STS.Any real car enthusiast would agree with me when I said that this guy pulled that statement out of his ass.This car if far from cheap.Everything is either leather vinel,except the trim around the radio,which is expected.The vinel peices are all padded,not hard plastic.Unlike my uncles 04 5 series.I'll tell yah why I never pay attention to anything in a magazine like that.Eversince foreigners took over the U.S . auto industry in sales,they have always bern biased.Those magazines are biased about German,British and Jap cars.Theres no doubt about that.Whens the last you had seen an American car win in one of their comparisons?You rarely see them included.And when they are,they usually take last place.When some readers like myself know that the American car is far better than they are rating it.So as far as Im concerned you can eat your magazine article because I own the damn car and believe me,I didn't pay almost 65 grand for cheaness.

If you ask me this is proof enough to dispel your suggestion that Cadillac has some omnipotent power over any other car manufacturer to make them perfectly flawless. Just to let everyone know, neither GM nor Ford is known for high quality. Can anyone guess what car manufacturer is? That's right Toyota. To bad the only car they make that I like is $74,000 (Lexus LS 430)

Nobody but you said that Cadillac was flawless.I guess mag. editors aren't the only ones that pull crap out of their ass.I like Cadillacs because they have always been nothing but greatness to me.If I found them to be pieces of :q:q:q:q,I wouldn't like them.Makes sense eh?

If I had an XLR I wouldn't be spending 2 seconds on a message board like this.

I'd be driving it, or flying witn John Travolta to Aspen.

Seriously...why bother with a board like this. I mean are you going to get tune up tips from someone here? Is your yacht broke or something? :F

If I had an XLR I wouldn't be spending 2 seconds on a message board like this.

I'd be driving it, or flying witn John Travolta to Aspen.

Seriously...why bother with a board like this. I mean are you going to get tune up tips from someone here? Is your yacht broke or something? :F

:slam What, you think I'm interested in doing a tune up on an XLR??
I got my yacht to work on :wrench

I check in here mostly for the "Anything Goes" stuff and some politics,
but there's a good group of people here and they're serious car enthusiasts.

I get most of my XLR info on another board
http://www.xlrforum.com/

i have a CTS and i am vey fond of ls's LS and i love the 90's towncars and devilles but i dont think anyone really cares about fianancial stuff about the companies the fact is cadillac and lincoln are the two most prominent american car brands in my opinion and have alot of history, ups and downs and sucesses and failures but the fact is usually people like what they have if i had an LS id be an LS fanatic but i dont i have a CTS and i know more about the cts then the ls and the ls owner knows more then me about their own car i am happy with mine id love an xlr or a mark but i dont have one but these 2 marques are beautiful and should not be argued over in my opinion and on another lighter note quikLS.....your ride is effing bad

I grabbed my brand new Town Car in Nov of 02 I wanted a early build (the stamping dies are sharper when new) I had been in the same car as a rental for two months, I just couldn't give it up, the car is like the 98 nthru 02 except that it is like on steroids, I sure wouldn't mind more power, but it is still commanding, it got 14 in town and 27 the road doing 73 when new and would smoke the rear tire for about ten ft, then I asked them if they could kick it up a notch, that was a mistake, they screwed it up it lost over 4mpg on the highway and about six in the city, it took some doing and taking the dealer to court, but they just reprogrammed it, it is doing 15-16 in the city it is easy to feather the throttle now and the road is doing 30 to 33 I do not believe it, I rode in the car with the Ford engineers, one drove and the other worked the programer we exchanged car stories, I wonder if it helped that I drove in with the Auto Engiunity hooked up I could see every sensor and reading but could hot adjust anything it was running at times 10degrees ATDC, it made me fume, I am al lot happier now they timed the shifts better too, its so nice not to have to push down so far on pedal to make it go, this is my @10 or 11 full size Lincoln, my first one was a 57 thats all for now, I hate fwd, no turning radius, and more unstable on a larger car. I like my smooth rider, btw I have three Maseratis, too and three other Townies my 88 is almost pristine except that the vinyl top is checking it has almost 400,,000 miles on it, I see the cars when they get wrecked, the cads will put the heqter core through the firewall in a really high speed crash, and come in under the passenger airbag, not a good thing, I walked away from a high speed cross the center line head on crash in a 76 TC coupe, The higway patrol man asked what he could do to help me I asked him to pull on the door al little so I could get out, it shoved the engine and trans under the car and lifted the car up the other car just bounced and sliced the head of the driver off on the A pillar, and sunk the steering wheel into his skull on his right side, I walked over and looked, he was .33 blood alcohol. I like my Big Lincolns, got rear ended sitting at a light by a new Infinity ti crackled the paint on my bumper cover, and did 15 grand damage and totaled the little car.

'42I would say that the exterior of the navigator is just as different for the expedition as the escalade is from the chevy trucks. Look at the shape of the headlights on the new cadillac and compare them to the headlights on the chevy trucks. As well as for the hood.

Don't even get me started on the interior of the escalade. It has been the same as the yukons and suburbans since they started making the car. What about the Navigator interior compared to the expedition interior. It bears no resemblence whatsoever. Obviously you are biased against ford, and have no respect for the best selling truck in the world for 27 years in a row.

Bottom line. Navigator is more diferentiated from the expedition that the escalade is from the suburban.

Town car, has needed an overhaul for a long time, they are working on that right now.

Aviator is being dumped and replaced with a crossover vehicle

Lincoln, while still somewhat resembling its ford counterpart, is doing something about it.

You may be able to diferentiate a cadillac from any other car, but can you diferentiate a CTS grille from an STS grill. Its more difficult that to tell a Town Car from an LS. But, there is nothing wrong with that.

Sounds like you have some pent up tension toward Lincoln.

I think a nice ride in the pillow soft Town Car would do you some good.

TownCar97 :L

I looked at the Beautiful Blackwood, when I was shopping my 03 TC it was nice, but made as a rich mans toy for the golf course, what workmanship and attention to amazing detail the bed cover a marvel to see opening and closing, what a toy, it will become a high priced collector vehicle, and is very rare even today, a rich mans toy, not a truck, not practical, but wow. and so what. give it 15 or twenty yeqrs and see what you have to pay for it. of course it is an Excursion based vehicle, but for the insides and its trick features and suspension. I have over 20,000 cars under my belt so far, RBG, I read most of these postings and laugh laugh laugh I prefer a Lincoln ,of course they brag that its mean age of owner is over 70 maybe the old people are on to something they sure have life experience, I sure dont pay sticker for a carl, only an idiot would walk in and do that. its a matter of what you like, I like Lincoln, and I do not have a yacht, but if I did it would need a big crew if not it would only be a little sailor, the Yachts that go to the Bal de La Mere' have huge crews, when you have that much money its nothing to spend 500,000 a month on upkeep,
B
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