Yet another item that has a lot of threads discussing it. I've tried to read most of them, but there's a LOT of them to go through.

First off, I have to admit that I don't know squat about HID lighting. I thought it was supposed to be better on the car - less wattage or amperage needed to light them. Also thought that the bulbs were supposed to last longer than the Halogens that the LS has in it now.

What I don't know is what all I should look at doing. Do I completely replace all the main lights up front with HID kits - Lows, highs, AND fogs? Will it look crappy if I only replace the Lows?

I'm pretty set on doing the 6000k temperature range - wherever I decide to get them from. In regard to that, I've found a few sites that appear to be reasonable, but don't know if anyone has any experience with them:

ddmtuning.com - they appear to be the cheapest, but I think Pek mentioned that they could be questionable to deal with.

carhidkits.com - not bad on price, but I don't know anything else about them

lskoncepts - pricier, but I imagine there's a few that have bought their kits and installed

Can you guys recommend anywhere else to get them?

How about installation? Is it a pain in the butt to wire these things into the car?


TRU - Newbie Mod Researcher

The point of HID's is that you dont NEED highs. At least I think so anyway. YOu should get plenty of light from just lows and fogs.

What year is your LS, tru-blu? Do your low beams stay on when you turn on the high beams?

I bought my kits (low beam and fogs) from Umnitza:

http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=35989

Easy to install. Almost as easy as just changing a bulb. HID bulbs are also supposed to last the life of the vehicle.

Good choice on 6000K.

Pek - I've got a 2006

I'm not sure if the lows stay on with the highs or not. I haven't actually turned them on yet. I'll have to check on that.

TRU

Just wondering. My gen 1 does not keep the lows on when the brights turn on. HID's take a while to get up to full intensity. I live out in the country, with unlighted roads. If I switch from low's to highs (and the highs were HID's), it can take 6-10 seconds before the lights reach full intensity. You can cover a lot of ground in that time while driving 65mph. So for safety's sake, I have regular halogens in the high beams so it's instant.

But if your low beams stay on, you could do HID's, since you wouldn't have a period of darkness where one set is off, and the other is warming up.

If the Lows DO stay on, would having HID's in both pretty much blind someone? I've never seen a set on an LS in real life, but I've heard these things are really bright.

TRU

I put HID shields in. really reduces the glare. reduces output a little, and I'm still refining them. I wish I could get a nice sharp cutoff, but probably not gonna happen with reflector housings.

ok Tru... im gonna try and explain my experience with HIDs so far...

After about 6+ months of research and looking around, I bought 2 HID kits from DDMTUNING.com last month. One for the lowbeams [5000k] and one for the fog lights [5000k]. I got the ddmtuning kits [$69.00 a kit plus S&H - i think].

so far i love 'em...3x as bright as halogens, yes a little bit of glare for on-coming traffic, but because there more ''white'' then ''blue'' [8000k+] and since the LS sits so low, i dont think its really much of a concern.

anyway to answer your questions... I thought it was supposed to be better on the car - less wattage or amperage needed to light them. Also thought that the bulbs were supposed to last longer than the Halogens that the LS has in it now.
better on the car...umm maybe?? idk... yes, the HID ballasts only draw like 6 amps [ea.] at startup and i think they draw less voltage then the halogens... but i dont think anyone can say that it would matter one way or the other as far as "better for the car"... however, one thing i have noticed is that my subs used to make my halogens ''blink'' at higher volumes [yes even with a capacitor] the HIDs dont blink at all, so thats a plus....What I don't know is what all I should look at doing. Do I completely replace all the main lights up front with HID kits - Lows, highs, AND fogs? Will it look crappy if I only replace the Lows?

...easy answer...do the lowbeams and the foglights... it will look crappy if you only do the lowbeams, and the foglights actually add ALOT of light when they have a HID kit..so do both...dont do the highbeams for two reasons... A) its a waste of $$ unless u live in the country where u use them all the time...and B) unless u really need the extra light, the HID ballasts take a couple of seconds to ignite and almost 20 seconds to fully warm up - chances are when u need the high-beams or even want to "courtsey flash" someone u will click them on and be in almost complete darkenss for a couple of seconds while they warm up [especially since the foglights click off]...like i said, bad idea, you wont need them much with the HIDs in the low beams and fogs anywayI'm pretty set on doing the 6000k temperature range - wherever I decide to get them from. In regard to that, I've found a few sites that appear to be reasonable, but don't know if anyone has any experience with them:
...colors are hard to standardize...some cheaper kits like ddmtuning really have a hard time making a significant color difference between the 4300k [4500k in the case of ddm], 5000k and 6000k kits... however the $200+ kits will definitely have a big difference between color temps. my girlfriends brother just paid $250 for a 6000k HID kit installed on his srt-10 pickup and i almost like his color better than mine because they are a lil "whiter" [but mine cost about 1/3 what he paid, so i like mine better] .For example PEKTEL's pics with his HIDs on is basically what mine look like, he has 6000k and i have 5000k...so i would say no big difference between the 6000k, 5000k and even some 4300k kits, but it all depends on the manufacture


...my experience with DDM has been completely pleasant, fast shipping, easy to call them on the phone for any questions...and a lifetime warrenty on the ballasts and n the bulbs....cant beat that

...i imagine ken over at lskoncepts would give the same service, but there is a difference in price...its totally up to u, but remember... u typically get what you pay for... im happy with my "cheaper kit" but i know its not as nice as the more expensive kits out there... so dont think that the cheaper kits are just as good as the more expensive ones, however dont get me wrong - i still love mine :)



... if you feel comfortable enough to change a headlight bulb, the plug-and-play kits are almost as easy to install... its a lil cramped and takes a lil to find a place for the ballasts, but no biggie - maybe 20-25 minutes each headlight, just grab some long cable ties...


...and one last thing, there was a lil confusion with the foglight install [the pos and neg wires were reversed on the factoiry wiring harness - [leave it to ford to f*ck something like that up] - i kept blowing fuses when i turned the fogs on... so if that happens to you, reverse the plug and it works 100% - thanks pete!


...so good luck!...and post pictures, im working on taking some of mine

Thanks Long Island for all the info you put in your reply!! It looks like DDMTuning puts a slim ballast in their kit that you have to pay more for at CarHIDKits.com. I could do both lows and fogs for close to the price of the slim lows at carhidkits.

Thinking about going the DDM route since you had a positive experience. Which bulb type to I get - is it H4 or something else? <smacks head because he should know this>

TRU

umm... im not a 100% sure about what bulbs u would need... i have a gen1 LS... so my bulbs are gonna be different then your gen2. best thing to do would be to call/ email them over at ddmtuning and they will tell you the exact ones u will need.

if you want, a quick way to look up your bulbs would be to check sylvania's website here http://www.sylvania.com/ConsumerProducts/AutomotiveLighting/LampReplacementGuide/

...that should give you a place to start, but sometimes the exact bulb u need can be referenced to a different HID kit...for example my fog light is a 9145, but they dont make a 9145 HID kit...but the 9145 is the same as a H10 kit or 9005 kit... u get the idea

Switching the 12v pos and neg wires is really not that big a deal... takes 10 seconds to move em back. Its happens in all cars and stock harnesses do not care what place its in... so yeah

You could also try using HIR bulbs in the stock harnesses, its about 80% of the HID lighting, and the bulbs are like $20 a piece. You have to do a little modding as they only come in a size we dont use. 9003 or something like that.

I have hid 6000k kit in low and fog lights you won't even think about hi beams anymore the combo gives more than enough light output.

To do HIDs right you should really do a projector retrofit

a projector what??

http://www.pilothid.com/hdhidkits.html

this is what i found free shipping ! i might give them a shot... Has any one used to this brand ?? im going to do my lows and fogs :)

http://www.pilothid.com/hdhidkits.html

free shipping im going try em any one1 try this brand ??

Projector lenses, a couple people have done them here already.

I did 5000K lows/fogs in both my vehicles. I love them. I also used DDM for the last 2 sets I bought. They sent me the wrong size, and took care of it quickly. If you do use DDM make sure you swap the pos/neg when you plug them in.

DDM is who I'm going to get my HIDs from, just can't decide on which kit. I also don't know if I should get a 35W kit or a 55W kit.

I thought all 2006 had HID anyway?

Also on the high beams, since most people use them to flash oncoming traffic to give the right of way, or to tell them they are pricks for cutting you off etc,... etc,.. its hard on the unit. Pointless.

I agree with TDUB but at least having a HID housing is still good enough.

My 2006 V8 Premium does not have them. I think it only came with the "Elite" option, which also included the backup sensors and Factory Nav.

But, are my headlight housings okay for putting HID's in or is this a futile attempt?

TRU

In my opinion and I know others differ, its pointless. The clarity is not that great and nothing compared to having a HID unit to put them in and they must be pointed down to not blind on coming traffic with the horrendous glare.


Also, not that anyone checks but in the US retro fit kits are not legal on non HID units.

No one else has these bulbs yet so none can take my word but the Bimmian Xenesis bulbs are a very close match in output and a exact match as far as aesthetics.

Okay, I'll add my opinion too then.
I have an 06 LS with factory HIDs, and an 04 LS without HID. As far as being able to see at night, I really don't notice any difference between the two. (Yes, the 06 is whiter, but that really doesn't help with seeing anything.)

such controversy haha... i think im going to have to chime in....

...as far as a 35w vs 55w kit... i dont see the need for the 55w, the glare is probably twice as bad for on-coming drivers and i would be concerned that the amount of extra heat from the 55w could damage the housing or wires...

...the 2006 LS (along with all gen2s) uses the same headlight assembly for the HID and halogen headlights.... therefore i dont see why there is so much concern about "glare"....its the same headlight housing for HID and non-HID so what could possibly be the difference between factory HID and aftermarket HID?

...one last thing, i know not everyone is a fan of aftermarket HIDs....but i think we all can agree they are brighter then factory halogens...well at least mine are...i think im going to have to take some pictures tonight so i can put this one to rest ...

such controversy haha... i think im going to have to chime in....

...as far as a 35w vs 55w kit... i dont see the need for the 55w, the glare is probably twice as bad for on-coming drivers and i would be concerned that the amount of extra heat from the 55w could damage the housing or wires...

...the 2006 LS (along with all gen2s) uses the same headlight assembly for the HID and halogen headlights.... therefore i dont see why there is so much concern about "glare"....its the same headlight housing for HID and non-HID so what could possibly be the difference between factory HID and aftermarket HID?

...one last thing, i know not everyone is a fan of aftermarket HIDs....but i think we all can agree they are brighter then factory halogens...well at least mine are...i think im going to have to take some pictures tonight so i can put this one to rest ...

It's not just a matter of being brighter. It's a matter of the light scatter that is caused by putting an HID bulb into a housing that is built for a halogen. You're not going to get a properly focused light output unless you install what is needed for it. I think we can all attest to driving by the dumb ass who has installed an aftermarket HID kit and blinds you as you drive past because of the horrible light scatter.

Thanks Long-Island! I was just about ready to put the nail in the coffin on this one, because there was NO way I was going to fork out major cash for different headlight assemblies JUST to have HID.

So now I know that the game is still on for this mod!

Woot!

TRU - eventual HID owner

TDUB, if the headlight assemblies ARE the same on a Gen II for HID and non-HID then this wouldn't be an issue, correct?

TRU

Hey JoeGR, can you try and confirm that the headlight assemblies are the same since you have both? That would help a lot!! Would also be good for anyone else with a Gen II considering this mod.

TDUB, if the headlight assemblies ARE the same on a Gen II for HID and non-HID then this wouldn't be an issue, correct?

TRU

Hey JoeGR, can you try and confirm that the headlight assemblies are the same since you have both? That would help a lot!! Would also be good for anyone else with a Gen II considering this mod.

From what I know they are NOT the same, but I've never seen them in person. Why do the 2nd gen HID housings go for about $5-700 per light if they are the exact same as the halogen housing? It all depends on what you want though. Yes you can put HIDs in a halogen housing but like I said before they weren't built for the HID bulb so although they may be brighter, it won't necessarily be focused where you need it.

Hmmmmm :confused:

Guess this mod is gonna totally be dependent on whether or not the housings are the same.

I don't want to be putting HID lights in a housing that really wasn't designed for them to make it difficult for oncoming drivers.

TDUB, you posted that you were getting HID's from DDMTuning as well. Are you just not concerned with the glare/light splatter issue then?

TRU

I've gotta call Maxx at 5 Star for my A pillar trim pieces. I might as well see if he can help determine if there actually is a difference in housings for factory HID vs. halogen.

I'll post an update as soon as I can talk to him.

TRU

There is a difference in the housings. Not sure about in the reflector bowl, but there definitely is a difference in the shield. The halogen shield is just a cap so you can't see the bulb. The HID shield prevents a lot of the light from hitting the bottom of the bowl, thus preventing the terrible glare. I'll find a pic.

I'm doing HID shields right now. I just made them too big at first. I need to trim them down.

Here's a pic of a stock HID shield:

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t228/pektel/mb-reflector-d2r-rear-view.jpg

Mine are way more basic than that. Similar to this design, but mine are mounted in the housing, not on the bulb. And my bulb is not painted. The shield should go under the bulb when installed:

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t228/pektel/9006-hid-lower-shield-example.jpg

So Pek, you're saying that if you're gonna do HID's in a halogen headlight housing, you should put some type of metal shield at the bottom of the bulb mounting assembly?

Man, I didn't think this was going to be that tough - especially since so many LS'ers here seem to be running an HID mod.

Back to square 1, I guess. I had the kits in the checkout cart ready to go, too (but was waiting on talking to Maxx at 5 Star).

TRU - HID bummed

No, you don't need to at all. I am just trying something new. It literally takes 5 minutes and a dremel if you are interested in doing the mod.

I don't get flashed for my low beams the way they are. But I do know that there is some glare. Just trying to make it easier on oncoming traffic.

Man, I didn't think this was going to be that tough - especially since so many LS'ers here seem to be running an HID mod.


TRU - HID bummed

Thats cause general bolt on/plug and play mods for the LS are far and few people jump on what they can.

And yes, for the sake of other people on the road ( as TDUB said Im sure it happened to you and just about everyone ) you should use those shields, they are called Casper shields.

I have not seen any for purchase though. not for 9006 bulb aplications anyways. Do a google search for your bulb style hid shield.

Yeah, I still cant find them either for 9006 but I know I saw people discussing them on another forum.

I'm using the touch up paint can for the shields. What do you think about painting them with a high temp grill paint? to absorb more of the light?

Pewter or aluminum in color?

that would work probably and look better.

I have no problem doing Pek's mod if it works and that is what I need to do.

Pek, once you get it ironed out on what would be best to do please let me know. I guess I'll hold off on buying the HID kits until I know that I'm not going to be the pain-in-the-you-know-where driver that creates a headache for oncoming drivers.

Thanks,

TRU

such controversy haha... i think im going to have to chime in....
...
...the 2006 LS (along with all gen2s) uses the same headlight assembly for the HID and halogen headlights.... therefore i dont see why there is so much concern about "glare"....its the same headlight housing for HID and non-HID so what could possibly be the difference between factory HID and aftermarket HID?
...

That is 100% wrong. The assemblies look similar. They are not at all the same. The reflector is different, and the ballast is built into the HID assembly. It's not in the halogen assembly.
Where did you get your information from?

Thinking about going the DDM route since you had a positive experience. Which bulb type to I get - is it H4 or something else? <smacks head because he should know this>

TRU

06 should be H11 for lows and fogs.

From what I know they are NOT the same, but I've never seen them in person. Why do the 2nd gen HID housings go for about $5-700 per light if they are the exact same as the halogen housing? It all depends on what you want though. Yes you can put HIDs in a halogen housing but like I said before they weren't built for the HID bulb so although they may be brighter, it won't necessarily be focused where you need it.

I have seen them in person. My 06 has HID, and my 04 does not. The assemblies are different. I don't know where the claim that they are the same came from. Even the connector they plug into is different, so you can't just exchange them without modifying the connector.

Rich, DDM lists the H10 as the comparable replacement for the 9145 fog light. I don't know how different it is to the H11 that would be used for the low-beam.

TRU

I know that opinions are going to be pretty much everywhere on almost every thread within this forum. I appreciate everyone who HAS posted on this thread for taking the time to do so.

In summary, it sounds like it may not be a good idea for me to put HID's in an LS halogen headlight housing. It's going to be way worse in how the light comes out than the factory HID system - based on feedback from those who have direct experience with this.

My reasons for doing this mod were more for better bulb longevity and helping to reduce the electrical load on the car - not as much for a cooler or even brighter look. I guess all in all, this may not be worth pursuing if it's going to cause so much trouble or incapability in relation to the halogen housing.

TRU

I know that opinions are going to be pretty much everywhere on almost every thread within this forum. I appreciate everyone who HAS posted on this thread for taking the time to do so.

In summary, it sounds like it may not be a good idea for me to put HID's in an LS halogen headlight housing. It's going to be way worse in how the light comes out than the factory HID system - based on feedback from those who have direct experience with this.

My reasons for doing this mod were more for better bulb longevity and helping to reduce the electrical load on the car - not as much for a cooler or even brighter look. I guess all in all, this may not be worth pursuing if it's going to cause so much trouble or incapability in relation to the halogen housing.

TRU

Dude, if you want solid honest to god facts join and log onto HIDplanet.com


Aside from the facts Joegr just pointed out abut the units not being the same they can tell you everything you need to know.

I have seen them in person. My 06 has HID, and my 04 does not. The assemblies are different. I don't know where the claim that they are the same came from. Even the connector they plug into is different, so you can't just exchange them without modifying the connector.

Wouldn't happen to have pictures that show the differences would you?

Or actually are the two pictures I've attached a good example of the differences?

I'm in the process of contesting with the body shop that my HID's are stock and what they put in clearly isn't stock. (See Thread (http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=56888))

Wouldn't happen to have pictures that show the differences would you?

Or actually are the two pictures I've attached a good example of the differences?

I'm in the process of contesting with the body shop that my HID's are stock and what they put in clearly isn't stock. (See Thread (http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=56888))

No, I would pretty much have to pull them out to show the differences. Maybe Max can help you with part numbers?
Be warned that Ford's part number catalog seems to be messed up on this. You are not the first that I have heard of that got the wrong assembly or bulb.

I know that opinions are going to be pretty much everywhere on almost every thread within this forum. I appreciate everyone who HAS posted on this thread for taking the time to do so.

In summary, it sounds like it may not be a good idea for me to put HID's in an LS halogen headlight housing. It's going to be way worse in how the light comes out than the factory HID system - based on feedback from those who have direct experience with this.

My reasons for doing this mod were more for better bulb longevity and helping to reduce the electrical load on the car - not as much for a cooler or even brighter look. I guess all in all, this may not be worth pursuing if it's going to cause so much trouble or incapability in relation to the halogen housing.

TRU

My additional 2 cents worth on this.

1. The power difference is 70 Watts for the HIDs vs 100 Watts for the halogen. I don't think 30 Watts is going to make much difference in the stress on the electrical system. Turn your passenger seat off and you'll save more than 30 Watts.

2. Bulb life. The HID bulbs cost so much more than the halogen bulb that there is no savings to be had here. Also factor in that when a HID fails, it might be the ballast instead of the bulb (also very expensive).

3. HIDs being brighter. HIDs throw out more light close to you. This makes them seem brighter, but it doesn't really help. Far out in front of you is where you need the light. Having more light close to you actually makes your eyes less sensitive to the light far out in front of you. The main safety factor for HIDs was supposed to be how the ultraviolet light from them would make signs and reflectors glow. I find that the halogen light on the LS does this almost as well.
(The halogen or HID lights on the LS are both way better than the halogen lights on my Grand Marquises were.) [What is the plural of "Marquis"?]

That is 100% wrong. The assemblies look similar. They are not at all the same. The reflector is different, and the ballast is built into the HID assembly. It's not in the halogen assembly.
Where did you get your information from?

...ok listen, i dont just type random things that pop into my head...and for once i would like everybody to do the same. I hate being called out, especially with no sort of counterpointing evidence... SO EVERYONE PAY ATTENTION.

...2 years ago i wanted to upgrade my gen1 headlights to gen2 [they look better IMO]...found out i would have to change alot more then just the headlights - more like the bumper, the wire harness and a bunch of custom work...well i dint want to get into it. HOWEVER, i had already picked up a set of 2003+ GEN2 halogen headlamps for like $100 from a local junkyard...now they sit in the garage. But i work at an auto parts store par-time [when im not in school], CARQUEST, so before i completely gave up i had done alot of research, and been to FORD about 50+ times.

Im pretty sure the housings are the same, and the biggest difference is the lack of a ballast for the halogen wire harness... PETE im not sure about the shield for the HID bulbs like you posted earlier, so im not gonna say if that is different or not. So the only thing i can do is to show my "evidence" and let you all decide for yourselves...

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8225/hidpic1.jpg (http://img16.imageshack.us/i/hidpic1.jpg/)

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/6781/hidpic2.jpg (http://img17.imageshack.us/i/hidpic2.jpg/)

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/5197/hidpic3p.jpg (http://img186.imageshack.us/i/hidpic3p.jpg/)

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/2923/hidpic4.jpg (http://img186.imageshack.us/i/hidpic4.jpg/)

...and here is the link to the HID ballast on eBay http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003---2006-Lincoln-LS-Headlight-BALLAST_W0QQitemZ250380390519QQcmdZViewItem

...I dint mean to sound like an a**hole, and i dont mean to offend anybody, BUT...chances are, if im going to take my time and say something here on LVC...i probably am pretty sure that im right. I dont know alot of what the rest of you guys know, especially QUICK ..and PEKTEL knows his stuff too, but do me a favor and keep the criticism to a minimum unless you are 100% about something.

With that said, im done with this whole HID debate...i got stuff to do... my only advice is this...TRU if you want to see better at night, get some HIDs, yes, it may be a little brighter for everybody else, but IMO its not that bad - so too bad for them, i personally have never had a problem driving opposite white HIDs, its the blue/purple ones that suck. Good luck to you...i might snap some pics of mine and if i do ill post them.

So maybe an acceptable alternative would be to put some Silver Stars in the car instead of going HID. I will readily admit that I allowed myself to get caught up in the "coolness" of HID. And I guess my eventual mod-list signature will not be as distinguished for the LVC board.
:(


TRU

silverstars = crap ...had them too [fogs, highbeams and lowbeams]...they look good when they are working, but i was replacing a bulb about every 6 months...and at $50 a pair thats alot more expensive then my $65.00 hids [which have a lifetime warranty]...

...but TRU, dont get confused, a plug and play HID kit would NOT require you to change anything inside your factory halogen headlamp. You would ONLY have to change the harness if you wanted to install OEM HIDs [which are probably outrageously expensive]. A plug and play kit would plug directly into the factory h11 plug and you would only have to modify the dust cap so u could run the wire out to the ballast and then back into the housing. Easy as can be. Just wanted to set the record straight.

...ok listen, i dont just type random things that pop into my head...and for once i would like everybody to do the same. I hate being called out, especially with no sort of counterpointing evidence... SO EVERYONE PAY ATTENTION.

...2 years ago i wanted to upgrade my gen1 headlights to gen2 [they look better IMO]...found out i would have to change alot more then just the headlights - more like the bumper, the wire harness and a bunch of custom work...well i dint want to get into it. HOWEVER, i had already picked up a set of 2003+ GEN2 halogen headlamps for like $100 from a local junkyard...now they sit in the garage. But i work at an auto parts store par-time [when im not in school], CARQUEST, so before i completely gave up i had done alot of research, and been to FORD about 50+ times.

Im pretty sure the housings are the same, and the biggest difference is the lack of a ballast for the halogen wire harness... PETE im not sure about the shield for the HID bulbs like you posted earlier, so im not gonna say if that is different or not. So the only thing i can do is to show my "evidence" and let you all decide for yourselves...

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8225/hidpic1.jpg (http://img16.imageshack.us/i/hidpic1.jpg/)

http://img17.imageshack.us/img17/6781/hidpic2.jpg (http://img17.imageshack.us/i/hidpic2.jpg/)

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/5197/hidpic3p.jpg (http://img186.imageshack.us/i/hidpic3p.jpg/)

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/2923/hidpic4.jpg (http://img186.imageshack.us/i/hidpic4.jpg/)

...and here is the link to the HID ballast on eBay http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2003---2006-Lincoln-LS-Headlight-BALLAST_W0QQitemZ250380390519QQcmdZViewItem

...I dint mean to sound like an a**hole, and i dont mean to offend anybody, BUT...chances are, if im going to take my time and say something here on LVC...i probably am pretty sure that im right. I dont know alot of what the rest of you guys know, especially QUICK ..and PEKTEL knows his stuff too, but do me a favor and keep the criticism to a minimum unless you are 100% about something.

With that said, im done with this whole HID debate...i got stuff to do... my only advice is this...TRU if you want to see better at night, get some HIDs, yes, it may be a little brighter for everybody else, but IMO its not that bad - so too bad for them, i personally have never had a problem driving opposite white HIDs, its the blue/purple ones that suck. Good luck to you...i might snap some pics of mine and if i do ill post them.

I don't post random thoughts either. I do have both assemblies, and clearly you don't. They are different. The reflector is different. Also, it is impossible to design one assembly that is legal for both bulb types. The light comes out of the HID bulb at a different point and in a different spread pattern than it does for the halogen bulb. This is why all HID refit kits are illegal for street use in the USA or most/all of Europe.

The ballast from E-bay is not stock, of course it would fit the halogen harness.

The plastic housing does not equal the reflector.

I never said that every single part on the assembly is different. Only some of them are different. That makes the "assembly" different. No two ways about it. It be the same as arguing that the V6 LS is exactly the same as the V8 LS because the both have the same hood.

Go and get a real HID factory assembly and take it apart and you will see what I mean. Or maybe you are too invested in being wrong to do that now.

Let me say this one more time. The reflector is different. You don't even have a HID assembly to look at, but yet you some how just know that it isn't.
If you are going to use that kind of logic, then I guess I am wasting my time here!

Long_Island, you've taken a ton of time to post all the info and pics in this thread. I can't thank you enough. :yourock:

It really wasn't my intent to start a huge debate or disagreement over this. I will humbly admit (and have in several other threads) that I don't have any experience with most of the mods you guys are running on your rides.

I do apologize if I've upset or frustrated anyone with any of my postings here. I found myself getting frustrated and confused because there were so many differing opinions/advice/experiences that it made it difficult to try and make a determination on what should be done. That's nobody's fault but my own. I asked for all of your input, and you gave it willingly. I don't want people to feel like they wasted their time if I'm the butthead that just can't seem to figure out what I should do.

I guess I'm just trying to do the best I can with the resources and knowledge I have (or lack thereof) to try and make my new ride my own. It may seem like I don't know that much about cars, but I've worked on them for over half my life. I just didn't know that much about the LS' and I didn't want to just jump into the deep end of the pool without trying to know what I was getting into. I do know that I actually enjoy this car more than any other car I've owned - camaros, trans-ams, grand prix gtp, etc. Are there better cars out there - no doubt. But this seems to be the best car for ME and I can't help but get excited about making it just the way I want it.

So please forgive me for being a bit over-zealous in the mod-research department. I know I've made a bunch of you experts spend a lot of time replying to my threads/questions. Please don't think that I don't appreciate it - I really do, maybe even more than I tried to convey. Good boards like this where people really want to help each other are hard to find.

Thanks again for your time,

TRU

My understanding is this, in order of least effective to most effective lighting:

1- halogens are going to be your base output.

2- HID bulbs in your halogen reflector housing are going to up the amount of output, but the focus is off, so there is a lot of unneccessary light (the scatter that lights up the trees and road signs and the like).

3- HID bulbs in a halogen housing with HID shields are going to eliminate a lot of that unneccesary light, but still keep the necessary light where it needs to be.

4- projector HID retrofit. This will give you the most light by far, but is the most difficult of the modifications to lighting.

I left the HID reflector bowl out of the picture, because you would need to swap the entire assembly for that.

...ok listen, i dont just type random things that pop into my head...and for once i would like everybody to do the same. I hate being called out, especially with no sort of counterpointing evidence... SO EVERYONE PAY ATTENTION.

...2 years ago i wanted to upgrade my gen1 headlights to gen2 [they look better IMO]...found out i would have to change alot more then just the headlights - more like the bumper, the wire harness and a bunch of custom work...well i dint want to get into it. HOWEVER, i had already picked up a set of 2003+ GEN2 halogen headlamps for like $100 from a local junkyard...now they sit in the garage. But i work at an auto parts store par-time [when im not in school], CARQUEST, so before i completely gave up i had done alot of research, and been to FORD about 50+ times.

Im pretty sure the housings are the same, and the biggest difference is the lack of a ballast for the halogen wire harness... PETE im not sure about the shield for the HID bulbs like you posted earlier, so im not gonna say if that is different or not. So the only thing i can do is to show my "evidence" and let you all decide for yourselves...



Never argue with a fool. People might not know the difference.
Long_Island_LS please ignore this since you already know everything without having ever seen an LS factory HID assembly.

For the rest of you who might be wondering, here are some pictures of the reflectors. First is the reflector on the HID assembly, and second is the reflector on the halogen assembly. The pictures aren't very good, but you can see the different patterns of the reflectors. What you can't tell, since the pictures are 2D and not 3D, is that the reflectors are slightly different shapes as well. The difference in the bulb shield is pretty clear though.

The pictures didn't post. They're too big. Here they are at low quality.
HID then halogen.

I don't post random thoughts either. I do have both assemblies, and clearly you don't. They are different. The reflector is different. Also, it is impossible to design one assembly that is legal for both bulb types. The light comes out of the HID bulb at a different point and in a different spread pattern than it does for the halogen bulb. This is why all HID refit kits are illegal for street use in the USA or most/all of Europe.

The ballast from E-bay is not stock, of course it would fit the halogen harness.

The plastic housing does not equal the reflector.

I never said that every single part on the assembly is different. Only some of them are different. That makes the "assembly" different. No two ways about it. It be the same as arguing that the V6 LS is exactly the same as the V8 LS because the both have the same hood.

Go and get a real HID factory assembly and take it apart and you will see what I mean. Or maybe you are too invested in being wrong to do that now.

Let me say this one more time. The reflector is different. You don't even have a HID assembly to look at, but yet you some how just know that it isn't.
If you are going to use that kind of logic, then I guess I am wasting my time here!

Are you kidding me?

The first pic, the one that says the wire probably goes here, the wire dont go there. What wire would go there? Its a breather, I have one on my Gen one headlight unit!

Look next to the high beam, it has one also!

Look a the way the bowls are ribbed in those pics. That defines the difference.

Bottom line for me is this -

If I can find some type of Casper shield that will work with the H11 and H10/9145, I'll get PnP HID kits.

A couple of people have mentioned HID Retrofits, but has anyone here done that on their LS, and if so, how much did it cost?

If neither of the above is feasible and/or reasonable in cost, then my "punt" option is to try and find the best Halogen bulb upgrade I can for all 3. I believe JWerner2 mentioned some type of Xenesis bulb, and hopefully he can shed a little more "light" on the subject (yep, pun was intended).

TRU - currently in the dark about my lights (sorry, couldn't resist)

http://www.bimmian.com/46/XEN/
Low beam HID, Fog light Xenesis

I cant upload a pic either tonight.

I'll try image shack.

http://img5.imageshack.us/img5/4768/dsc014717764751.jpg

So JWerner2, you have HID's in your low-beams and the Xenesis in the fogs?

Did you do a retrofit of some type for the HID's in the low beams?

Curious mod researchers want to know.....


TRU

To do HIDs right you should really do a projector retrofit
Or get the factory ones :
http://www.directfordparts.com/partlocator/index.cfm?action=getLocator&siteid=214290&chapter=DR2KD00&appSectionid=2295&groupid=2296&subgroupid=2297&componentid=26356&make=21&model=Ls&year=2003&catalogid=2

Has anybody done a bi-xenon retrofit in our cars and if so what would it take to wire it?

Playa, that's 814 clams JUST to get the headlight housings - I don't think it includes ballasts, bulbs, etc. If that indeed is the case, then you're looking at well over a grand to upgrade to HID going the factory route. :eek:

TDub, if you go out to YouTube and search on HID Projection Headlight Construction, you'll see several videos (one is a 4 part) on how to retrofit a projector into a halogen housing. It's fairly involved, but if you got the time, tools, skillz, and most importantly, guts it is doable.

Personally, I think we're kind of on the "bleeding edge" of where HID is going. I'm really thinking that the aftermarket companies will start to accommodate some type of shielding for the different bulb types. There's already some out there for H4 and 9006, so this could just be a matter of time. You could try to make your own (Pektel is giving it a shot), but I'm content to wait and see if a company turns out a product that will take care of the issue.

I think I've researched this mod type more than any other for my ride, and I've come to the conclusion that screwing up my lighting is not something I want to do. I'm not as worried about getting tickets, but more of actually decreasing my visibility and affecting oncoming traffic. I do think we'll be able to do this in our halogen-based LS' the right way - it's just gonna take more time.

So, I may put Silverstar Ultras or Xtravisions in mine for now (may look at Nokya as well). But I know I'm set on doing HID ONLY if it can be done the right way, and that will require a shield on the bulb.

Good luck,

TRU

Playa, that's 814 clams JUST to get the headlight housings - I don't think it includes ballasts, bulbs, etc. If that indeed is the case, then you're looking at well over a grand to upgrade to HID going the factory route. :eek:
...

TRU

The $407 price each is for the complete assembly. The assembly includes all the bulbs (HID low beam, halogen high beam, turn signal, LED parking light) and the ballast. There is nothing extra to buy. (It also includes the HID reflector that some here don't think exists.)

Thanks for the clarification, Joe. It's still a hefty pricetag to upgrade to HID, but I agree that would ensure that it's done right. I wonder if the harness is any different and if so, would that have to purchased separately to do this?

TRU

Thanks for the clarification, Joe. It's still a hefty pricetag to upgrade to HID, but I agree that would ensure that it's done right. I wonder if the harness is any different and if so, would that have to purchased separately to do this?

TRU

There is an extra rib on the connector. All you have to do is to shave it off, no need to replace the harness in the car. (Disclaimer: I haven't done this, but I have researched it. I have also compared the HID and non-HID LSes that I have.)

Didn't have access to my notes last night.
Here are a couple of nice threads about the factory HIDs :

http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=16933
http://www.lincolnvscadillac.com/showthread.php?t=46421

So JWerner2, you have HID's in your low-beams and the Xenesis in the fogs?

Did you do a retrofit of some type for the HID's in the low beams?

Curious mod researchers want to know.....


TRU

I used them for that pic to show how well they match.

My 04 Toyota Highlander has a retrofit kit from Xetronics and requires the same low beam bulbs as the LS which is where that kit came from.

Im getting the low beam Xenesis cause like joegr said, its not that impressive in a non hid housing at all.

I can see better without the scatter at night than with the HIDs. In the Highlander since it sits so high its a different story.

So JW, you'd recommend the Xenesis in the Low-beam and Fog-lights, then?

Any data on how reliable the bulbs are? Am I looking at the same range as a Silverstar Ultra, or is it better?

Thanks,

TRU

100X's better than those garbage bulbs! I havent had mine long but within the amount of time I had mine I had those cheap trash bulbs blow on me in the past for no reason. Those that didnt faded quickly!

Someone in another forum said the first release had problems but are ow way better and very reliable.

If you want one step above for halogen I say Hoen, if you want one step below which is also a great bulb I say Nokya.

Does anyone have issues with HID kits and the auto lamp function. I want to upgrade the lows and fogs but it's not worth it to me if I have to turn the headlights on and off myself. I have this issue on my Mark VIII but don't really bother me since it's not a daily driver.