Ok, thinking of getting HID's, my friend asked where am i going to place the ballast, and i said i dont know, so for you First Gen owners, where do you keep your Ballasts?

Pictures would help!

TIA
BTW, whats the factory HID? 6000k? or 4300k

My friend said its 6000k, but not sure ..Not that I'm getting 4300 but i dont want too much blue

its tough to do without removing the headlights. there is room if you dont (but not much). The headlight comes out easily and theirs plenty of room underneath them, plus it looks really clean. With the cover on you cant see anything.

The picture below shows where I installed mine. The picture is somewhat bad because it looks like they are touching the radiator, but they are not. They are a good 3" from it, and there is next to no heat in that area, which is a very good thing for ballasts. I had to put them that close because the burner wire is very short on these ballasts. They are OEM Lexus ballasts from an '06 LS430. The OEM color temperature (Kelvin) is 4300K, not 6000K.

http://skizot.com/gallery/d/2756-5/100_2853.jpg

BTW, I think you'd be the most happy with 4300K, especially since you don't want too much blue. As far as light output, you'll get a lot more with the 4300K than you would with 6000K.

yeah i mean, i see factory HID's on Navigators, LS's, has like that perfect amount of blue ..

Thanks.

Other pics would help !

Just need a few more ideas :)

Hey man, I have the HID ballasts installed in the front part of the engine bay. I have them bolted on to the piece behind and it is a clean install. I then painted the ballasts a fresh black to match everything. This is also important because then everything blends in and cannot be seen through the grill. I also recommend this location for the ballasts being easy to see and get at.

The fog light ballasts are tucked behind the fog lights in the lower part of the bumper.

I have the 6000K low beams and foglights.

I hope these pictures help.

Thanks a lot, looks clean.

After the HID's gotta get the grille makes the car look so much cleaner.

very nice.

Yeah, I'm either going to go with 4300k or 5000k

I won't mind the 6k, but i think cops will be pulling me over all the time lol. As always just say its stock right? :)

Got a night picture with those 6k's?

I have the 6000K. Here's a night pic:

Also, I've never been pulled over for them.

Looks nice, i might just get the 6000k :p

Here is a picture of Pete and my car a couple months back. We both have 6000K HID low beams, however, there is a slight color difference. Depending on what brand of lights you go with there will be a small color difference.

The following are a couple night pictures. At night the lights are a crystal white with no blue. As far as getting pulled over I have never heard that before. There is no reason for getting pulled over with 6000K.

The last picture is a close up of the HID lights. Because this picture was taken during the day you can see how the fog light is bluish while the headlight is an aqua blue. Everything depends upon the external lighting. I would not recommend going over or under 6000K.

I hope this helps you in your decision process with the ballast placement and what lights to buy.

I would not recommend going over or under 6000K.

Why would you not suggest 4300K? That is the actual OEM color temperature and produces more visible light than the 6000K. :confused:

I did not mean to say there is anything wrong with 4300K. I know that the lower Kelvin the greater light output. I like seeing the slight blues during the day which may or may not be apparent with 4300K, I am not sure. And as far as the 6000K light output there is no complaint.

I agree with john that the 6000K color is pretty tame. But we have completely different setups than skizot. His is AMAZING. So much more light output than the hid bulb in a reflector housing. But the way John, myself, and most others have done, is just put the HID bulb into the stock reflector housing... You don't get near as much output, but there is a big difference from stock halogens. The only reason to go the route we all did is because it's cheaper and a hell of a lot easier. Skkizot's process will yield the BEST possible quality light output, but it is a LOT more involved, and you'd probably need a second car to drive while you're doing all the fabrication.

Yes, you will get more light output by going with something closer to 4300K, but when doing the HID into reflector housing, I don't think there is a huge output difference between 4300 and 6000. At least not enough for it to be a deal breaker. From what I've read, everything over 6000 is when you start seeing the decrease in output.

Hope this helps...

I agree with john that the 6000K color is pretty tame. But we have completely different setups than skizot. His is AMAZING. So much more light output than the hid bulb in a reflector housing. But the way John, myself, and most others have done, is just put the HID bulb into the stock reflector housing... You don't get near as much output, but there is a big difference from stock halogens. The only reason to go the route we all did is because it's cheaper and a hell of a lot easier. Skkizot's process will yield the BEST possible quality light output, but it is a LOT more involved, and you'd probably need a second car to drive while you're doing all the fabrication.

Yes, you will get more light output by going with something closer to 4300K, but when doing the HID into reflector housing, I don't think there is a huge output difference between 4300 and 6000. At least not enough for it to be a deal breaker. From what I've read, everything over 6000 is when you start seeing the decrease in output.

Hope this helps...

pektel, thanks for the kind words about my setup. :) I know it's a lot of work to retrofit projectors, but it's definitely worth the effort. I know it all just depends on what you feel like doing with your LS. A lot of guys spend quite a bit of time, and invest quite a bit of money (ILLS, QuickLS, camthman), on engine performance and many probably wouldn't dare go down that path. So, I'm sure the same is true as far as performance lighting goes.

I'm not trying to go on a rant here, but there is a decent difference between 4300K and 6000K light output, regardless of whether you're using a kit with halogen reflectors, or a OEM projector set up. The lumen rating for your average 4300K bulb is 3200 lm, and the lumen rating for your average 6000K bulb is 2600 lm. Now, multiply the output together since you're using two bulbs, and you're putting out 5200 lm with the 6000K vs. 6400 lm with the 4300K. A difference of 1200 lm is most definitely noticeable. We won't even talk about the numbers on the bulbs rated at over 6000K, because if you go that route, might as well just use your parking lights as your main beams. :D

Here's a definition of lumen (again, not trying to be a smart-ass, just trying to provide information):

The lumen (symbol: lm) is the SI unit of luminous flux, a measure of the perceived power of light.

So, to say that there's not going to be a big difference between 4300K and 6000K, even when using a kit in reflectors, is not an accurate statement. Another thing to keep in mind, is that HID bulbs will color shift, and kit bulbs color shift much quicker than OEM bulbs. What this means is that they will start looking bluer as their age increases. As this happens, the light output (lm) starts to drop as well, but not dramatically. So, if you get the 4300K and they aren't quite white/blue enough for you, just give them a little bit of time. They're worth it for the higher lumen.

And again, the reason I bring all of this up, is because I assume most people are upgrading to HIDs - whether it be a kit into a halogen reflector (you all know my opinion on that route already :D), or a custom retrofit of OEM projectors - to improve their ability to see while driving at night. So, you will be the most happy going with the 4300K bulbs if that's your goal. If you don't care about seeing at night, and all you care about is color, then why not just go with the 10000K bulbs? :shifty:

I know a lot of people are all about the color (referred to as "flicker"), and most think they're achieving that by using 8000K bulbs, but that's not really where that blue/purple comes from as you see a BMW heading towards you at night. That flicker has to do with the colorband at the cutoff from a projector.

xarruda89x, by the way, you could always get a pair of 4300K and a pair 6000K bulbs and try them both out for yourself. You could definitely get rid of the pair you didn't like on ebay, or even here on LVC. I'm pretty sure you'll end up putting the 6000K up for sale. :D Keep us updated with what you decide to do.

Not really a fair comparison since the 6000k is a "year" old but ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32hYjQ84aJ8

Here's a picture I found of the Philips Ultinon (6000K) vs. Philips 85122 (4300K):

http://img302.imageshack.us/img302/3798/ultinonvs4300kcopy8bt.jpg

i have the lights that you would never suggest (10k) but to be honest with you my hid's are brighter than my "parking lights", lol. it's all a matter of choice. if it was up to me now i would go with a lower kelvin hid kit but i have to sets and i don't feel like buying new ones. another thing is, they seem to be doing the reverse of what you described which is they are going from bluish to more white. i've had them for over a year and a half and i'm always satified with them. i think any hid kit is better than stock halogen, but of course these are my opinions and not said to discredit your statements. i have a video on youtube (on my sig i believe) that shows my hid output. just my .02

i have the lights that you would never suggest (10k) but to be honest with you my hid's are brighter than my "parking lights", lol. it's all a matter of choice. if it was up to me now i would go with a lower kelvin hid kit but i have to sets and i don't feel like buying new ones. another thing is, they seem to be doing the reverse of what you described which is they are going from bluish to more white. i've had them for over a year and a half and i'm always satified with them. i think any hid kit is better than stock halogen, but of course these are my opinions and not said to discredit your statements. i have a video on youtube (on my sig i believe) that shows my hid output. just my .02

LOL. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But, lumens don't lie, and I'm not making up the stuff I'm saying. :) And your 10000K HIDs may be brighter than your parking lights, but they're probably not brighter than a LS's stock Halogen low-beams.

LOL. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. But, lumens don't lie, and I'm not making up the stuff I'm saying. :) And your 10000K HIDs may be brighter than your parking lights, but they're probably not brighter than a LS's stock Halogen low-beams.

i'd gladly bet money on it ;)

i'd gladly bet money on it ;)

LOL, no offense man, but from your video it looks like your low beams and fogs don't shine much further than 10 feet out. I remember my halogen low beams illuminating the road much more than that (before my retro), and they did it without creating the massive amounts of glare that yours do.

Also, the CRI (color rendering index) of HID is not as good as halogen, but it's extremely poor with 10000K HID burners. So, not only is there a huge difference in actual light output between 4300K and 10000K, but the CRI is so crappy that you're doing your eyes more harm than good.

Here's a quote explaining what CRI is:

The CIE color rendering index (CRI), is a quantitative measure of the ability of a light source to reproduce the colors of various objects faithfully in comparison with an ideal or natural light source.
Color rendering: Effect of an illuminant on the color appearance of objects by conscious or subconscious comparison with their color appearance under a reference illuminant

—CIE 17.4, International Lighting Vocabulary, (Schanda 2002)


So again, to each his own. But if you're looking for better light output, absolutely do not go with 8000K or 10000K. This is not my opinion, as the numbers speak for themselves.

LOL, no offense man, but from your video it looks like your low beams and fogs don't shine much further than 10 feet out. I remember my halogen low beams illuminating the road much more than that (before my retro), and they did it without creating the massive amounts of glare that yours do.

Also, the CRI (color rendering index) of HID is not as good as halogen, but it's extremely poor with 10000K HID burners. So, not only is there a huge difference in actual light output between 4300K and 10000K, but the CRI is so crappy that you're doing your eyes more harm than good.

Here's a quote explaining what CRI is:



So again, to each his own. But if you're looking for better light output, absolutely do not go with 8000K or 10000K. This is not my opinion, as the numbers speak for themselves.

see the problem is that i do understand what you are saying, but i can still see better than i could with my halogens. that's the extent of what i'm saying. you can quote facts and numbers and all this and that but at the end of the day i see better at night time with my hid's than i did with my halogens. now if that in some way upsets you then that's something you have to deal with on your own. in no way shape or form am i trying to convince someone to purchase the 10k. therefore i stand by what i have but encourage those that are not certain to go with the 4300k or 6k, makes no difference to me. once again, i respect what you are saying but on a day to day basis i deal with them not you and i can vouche for them and say they provide better output than my halogens did. end of story

see the problem is that i do understand what you are saying, but i can still see better than i could with my halogens. that's the extent of what i'm saying.

Then that's fine, if they work for you, then that's all that matters. I'm just supplying information about the difference between the different K bulbs out there, which is what the OP asked. And it's not my opinion either.

you can quote facts and numbers and all this and that but at the end of the day i see better at night time with my hid's than i did with my halogens. now if that in some way upsets you then that's something you have to deal with on your own.

No, it's not something I have to deal with on my own, they're your lights, and your safety, not mine. If you want to drive around with your headlights completely off, it has absolutely no bearing on me or my life. LOL

once again, i respect what you are saying but on a day to day basis i deal with them not you and i can vouche for them and say they provide better output than my halogens did. end of story

It's all good man, no need to take it personal. We're just discussing things on an internet forum, as that's what they're here for. :) Like I already stated, my comments were not intended to hurt your feelings.

In reference to your reply to my post, and more specifically to my statement about not being a big difference between 4300 and 6000 in a halogen reflector housing:

I was speculating on that part. But where I was coming from, is that both 4300 and 6000 kelvin temps in a halogen reflector housing are both terrible RELATIVE to a projector HID. i was guessing that since the light is dispersed so quickly when used in a halogen reflector housing, that no matter what the temp, the output would be sh*tty. I based this only on speculation, whereas you know a hell of a lot more than me about it.

Does that make sense? Maybe I'm not wording it correctly.

In reference to your reply to my post, and more specifically to my statement about not being a big difference between 4300 and 6000 in a halogen reflector housing:

I was speculating on that part. But where I was coming from, is that both 4300 and 6000 kelvin temps in a halogen reflector housing are both terrible RELATIVE to a projector HID. i was guessing that since the light is dispersed so quickly when used in a halogen reflector housing, that no matter what the temp, the output would be sh*tty. I based this only on speculation, whereas you know a hell of a lot more than me about it.

Does that make sense? Maybe I'm not wording it correctly.

Hey, pektel. I know what you're trying to say. I'll definitely agree that HID in halogen reflectors isn't the greatest compared to HID projectors. The thing to think about with halogen reflectors vs. HID projectors, is that the projectors are designed to focus the light so that it is 100% controlled, and almost all of the usable light can be projected below the cutoff line (the small percentage [~ 1-2%] of light that doesn't make it there is turned into heat as it hits the inside of the projector where it's not reflected). When you put HID burners into halogen reflectors, there's a certain amount of light that cannot be focused where it should be, so you end up with glare. And the simple definition of glare is "uncontrolled light".

So, to give a quick example, I'll use the lumen numbers from above - 5200 lm for 2 6000K burners and 6400 lm for 2 4300K burners. Now, say that the halogen reflector is able to focus 70% of the light when used with HID burners (the rest of it is uncontrolled light, which is what creates the glare). Because I don't know what the actual percentage is (and it absolutely depends on the design of the halogen reflector, which can vary, given the different halogen bulb types), the 70% is a hypothetical figure. So, the constant in the equation is the 70% of light focus, and the variable is the luminous flux of the burner (lm). With that, you'd have:

6000K light output: (5200 lm * 0.70) = 3640 lm
4300K light output: (6400 lm * 0.70) = 4480 lm

So, even though the projector (or actual HID reflector even) would do a lot better job, there would still be a difference in light output when using a 4300K vs. a 6000K bulb in a halogen reflector.

The one thing I will note from personal experience, is that it takes a little bit of adjustment when going to a projector setup. The reason for this is the dramatic contrast between the area above the cut-off line, and the area below it. It is purely dark above the cut-off line (aside from a little light that comes from the squirrel finder on some projectors), and totally lit below it. That's why it's hard to understand why some true HID fanatics are obsessed razor sharp cut-offs. I would think that with that sharp of a contrast line, it would be make it harder to adjust to the objects above it. But to each their own on that as well, I'm just glad the my projectors have a Fresnel lens. It gives a slightly blurrier cut-off, but that in return blends the light and the dark a tad bit better.

Sorry for the rant, I can get carried away sometimes. :D

no, it's all good info! I am not very well educated on the specifics, so my way of thinking sounds like it may be off.