This should be enough of an arsenal for anyone.

http://newsbusters.org/forums/topic-discussion/global-warming-phooey-15427

The founder of The Weather Channel, John Coleman, called global warming the "Greatest scam in history (http://media.newsbusters.org/stories/weather-channel-founder-global-warming-greatest-scam-history.html?q=blogs/noel-sheppard/2007/11/07/weather-channel-founder-global-warming-greatest-scam-history)." He said scientific data has been manipulated by scientists with an agenda. He went on to say:

Now their ridiculous manipulated science has been accepted as fact and become a cornerstone issue for CNN, CBS, NBC, the Democratic Political Party, the Governor of California, school teachers and, in many cases, well informed but very gullible environmental conscientious citizens.

Ummm.. I can't believe this but on this issue I am how can I say closer side to Fossten...

Global warming is a natural effect that has been happening since the last ice age. Just wait until we have Global Cooling again...

I'm sorry but our 4.5 billion year old world has gone through many changes. I'm living on the bottom of an old riverbed or glacial run off from about 10,000 years ago.

And the bluffs around here date back to about 245,000,000 million years ago.

Ummm.. I can't believe this but on this issue I am how can I say closer side to Fossten...

Global warming is a natural effect that has been happening since the last ice age. Just wait until we have Global Cooling again...

I'm sorry but our 4.5 billion year old world has gone through many changes. I'm living on the bottom of an old riverbed or glacial run off from about 10,000 years ago.

And the bluffs around here date back to about 245,000,000 million years ago.

:D Rich is just trying to provoke me...

I'm living on the bottom of an old riverbed or glacial run off from about 10,000 years ago.


so you'll be one of the first to go... :)


I tend to agree that for the most part, global warming is part of a natural cycle. That doesnt mean we dont need to be conscience of the enviroment though. Ive said before that I think its good to think along the lines of enviromental responsibility, we just dont have to make knee jerk reactions to things.

:D Rich is just trying to provoke me...

Trying to provoke you hell I was agreeing with you for once... I crossed the line...

so you'll be one of the first to go... :)


I tend to agree that for the most part, global warming is part of a natural cycle. That doesnt mean we dont need to be conscience of the enviroment though. Ive said before that I think its good to think along the lines of enviromental responsibility, we just dont have to make knee jerk reactions to things.

I agree 100% Joey... We do add to the speed of the problem but when Al Gore claims that we started it.. sorry that's not true.. We've been on a warming trend for the last 10,000 years.

I wonder what they are going to say when the Poles Switch Polarity.

Trying to provoke you hell I was agreeing with you for once... I crossed the line...

I agree 100% Joey... We do add to the speed of the problem but when Al Gore claims that we started it.. sorry that's not true.. We've been on a warming trend for the last 10,000 years.

I wonder what they are going to say when the Poles Switch Polarity.
Please cite factual (unmanipulated) scientific data which shows that humans are in any way causing global warming. Humans produce a mere 4% of total worldwide atmospheric CO2--The rest is produced naturally.

Where is the scientific data showing that the 4% human produced CO2 is causing global warming?

Please cite factual (unmanipulated) scientific data which shows that humans are in any way causing global warming. Humans produce a mere 4% of total worldwide atmospheric CO2--The rest is produced naturally.

Where is the scientific data showing that the 4% human produced CO2 is causing global warming?

For that matter, please show ANY factual data that PROVES that CO2 is causing global warming and not the other way around (http://mysite.verizon.net/mhieb/WVFossils/ice_ages.html).

And Rich, I was just referring to the age of the earth that you cited. I thought you were needling me. It's no biggie, really. I'm glad you agree with me on Global Warming. It's all good. :cool:

Please cite factual (unmanipulated) scientific data which shows that humans are in any way causing global warming. Humans produce a mere 4% of total worldwide atmospheric CO2--The rest is produced naturally.

Where is the scientific data showing that the 4% human produced CO2 is causing global warming?

Looks like you can't ever please the Right... agree with them and they still try to shoot you down..

Well Fossten I tried agreeing with you... but some of you buddies just don't like it when the more central thinking people agree with you...

Sorry MAC1 I guess you are the fact God.. I worship you.... and your factual greatness...

I never said the humans are causing global warming... I disagreed with Al Gore's claim that humans have caused global warming.. Wasn't that what I said or can't you read...

I only said we add to it's progression ... Which any increase will do... that's just common scense... Take the human's out and we add nothing... put humans in and we add what we add...

Joey slap me next time I come into this forum... :slap:

And Rich, I was just referring to the age of the earth that you cited. It's all good. :cool:

That's just a matter of faith and Interpretation but that's a different discussion and I'm not going into that one ... I doubt I'll be visiting you in hell for that one ... :shifty:

It's amazing that people can find common ground..:)

Looks like you can't ever please the Right... agree with them and they still try to shoot you down..

Well Fossten I tried agreeing with you... but some of you buddies just don't like it when the more central thinking people agree with you...

Sorry MAC1 I guess you are the fact God.. I worship you.... and your factual greatness...

I never said the humans are causing global warming... I disagreed with Al Gore's claim that humans have caused global warming.. Wasn't that what I said or can't you read...

I only said we add to it's progression ... Which any increase will do... that's just common scense... Take the human's out and we add nothing... put humans in and we add what we add...

Joey slap me next time I come into this forum... :slap:
Is it your "common scense" position that humans are not causing global warming, rather, only contributing to global warming? I simply asked you upon what scientific basis are you claiming that humans "add to it's progression." It's apparent that you have nothing to support your position.

Sorry MAC1 I guess you are the fact God.. I worship you.... and your factual greatness...
Good one! :rolleyes:

Looks like you can't ever please the Right... agree with them and they still try to shoot you down..

Well Fossten I tried agreeing with you... but some of you buddies just don't like it when the more central thinking people agree with you...

Sorry MAC1 I guess you are the fact God.. I worship you.... and your factual greatness...

I never said the humans are causing global warming... I disagreed with Al Gore's claim that humans have caused global warming.. Wasn't that what I said or can't you read...

I only said we add to it's progression ... Which any increase will do... that's just common scense... Take the human's out and we add nothing... put humans in and we add what we add...

Joey slap me next time I come into this forum... :slap:
I've got news for all of you...if it weren't for CO2, we wouldn't have any oxygen to breathe. (http://www.emc.maricopa.edu/faculty/farabee/BIOBK/BioBookPS.html)

And that's just what the ecowackos want - to "take out the humans." (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aA7hAFBRlZw)

Global Warming, Just Like The Stock Market
http://brocktownsend.forum5.com/viewtopic.php?t=1156&mforum=brocktownsend
(This chart says it all. BT)

so you'll be one of the first to go... :)


I tend to agree that for the most part, global warming is part of a natural cycle. That doesnt mean we dont need to be conscience of the enviroment though. Ive said before that I think its good to think along the lines of enviromental responsibility, we just dont have to make knee jerk reactions to things.

:I

It is unquestionable to anyone who is capable of basic thought that the earth heats and cools because that is a natural cycle of this planet. There is NOTHING man can do to stop the cycles. It is unreasonable, however, to think our actions are entirely benign.

With this said, black things attract heat. I'm still not prepared to drive dirt roads in spite of the fact that black-top (asphalt) is a contributor. I am prepared, however, to do anything I reasonable can to mitigate my own contribution to global warming. Why not?

:I

It is unquestionable to anyone who is capable of basic thought that the earth heats and cools because that is a natural cycle of this planet. There is NOTHING man can do to stop the cycles. It is unreasonable, however, to think our actions are entirely benign.

With this said, black things attract heat. I'm still not prepared to drive dirt roads in spite of the fact that black-top (asphalt) is a contributor. I am prepared, however, to do anything I reasonable can to mitigate my own contribution to global warming. Why not?

The key here is "reasonable." Not burning your trash in your backyard is reasonable. Being told you MUST buy stupid twisty lightbulbs, can't drive on blacktop, must ride a bike to work, and must keep your thermo at 62 during the winter, is unreasonable. But don't tell Al Gore that.

The key here is "reasonable." Not burning your trash in your backyard is reasonable. Being told you MUST buy stupid twisty lightbulbs, can't drive on blacktop, must ride a bike to work, and must keep your thermo at 62 during the winter, is unreasonable. But don't tell Al Gore that.

Why not? Compact florescents have their place but if he's gonna ram it down our throats (like our idiot parliamentarians here in Ontario) why should be screw them into their ... ummm ... y' know.

4% is a big number. not that ive done anything to help. i dont hug trees, but i do recycle steel and alum. but look at the sunspot factor when you talk on this subject. records prove it has something to do with little ice ages and so forth. dont attack me for the first sentence, but 4% is a big number. i also believe in atlantis and things like that. we are not the first group of humans to have come this far.:bash: :bash:

and in the case of the poles changing polarity. that was the downfall off atlantis look at your globe. the placement of the bermuda triangle, and all the :q:q:q:q affiliated with it

Why not? Compact florescents have their place....

No they don't. They are a joke and like ALL Liberal feel good attempts at saving the planet, they do more harm than good.

All Things Considered (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=7431198), February 15, 2007 · The Environmental Protection Agency and some large business, including Wal-Mart, are aggressively promoting the sale of compact fluorescent light bulbs as a way to save energy and fight global warming. They want Americans to buy many millions of them over the coming years.

But the bulbs contain small amounts of mercury, a neurotoxin, and the companies and federal government haven't come up with effective ways to get Americans to recycle them.

"The problem with the bulbs is that they'll break before they get to the landfill. They'll break in containers, or they'll break in a dumpster or they'll break in the trucks. Workers may be exposed to very high levels of mercury when that happens," says John Skinner, executive director of the Solid Waste Association of North America, the trade group for the people who handle trash and recycling.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you realize if you break one of these bulbs in your house, your home is considered a contaminated site?

No they don't. They are a joke and like ALL Liberal feel good attempts at saving the planet....

My mistake :slam I was entirely unaware that the earth/environment cares about your politics or mine.

My mistake :slam I was entirely unaware that the earth/environment cares about your politics or mine.
psungee, surely you read the rest of Bryan's post, did you not? Are you deliberately trying to miss his point?

Never mind the fact that the light given off by these bulbs flat out SUCKS, these bulbs are actually more dangerous to humans AND to the environment than Edison's Very Special Creations.

Well... yeah! I'm just not with you guys on absolutism. Look - horse chestnuts are dangerous too. We don't ban them. They are used in medicine and are sustenance for some wildlife.

Caffeine will kill your dog but almost nobody will have a second thought of leaving a soda or a piece of chocolate (not to speak of coffee) lying around their home.

There is a tendency to want to ban everything we see that poses a danger. Heck! We know the emissions from cars are toxic (I assume we can agree on this). Some of us are prepared to ban a light bulb but people die because of exhaust emissions. Cripe! People die from their allergy to peanuts. Let's wipe peanuts off the face of the earth (and get bees at the same time). Well, yeah! Of course this is silly. Suggesting that incandescents are the only viable non-natural light is equally ridiculous. Many homes have florescent bulbs in kitchens, work shops, garages, etc. Factories, offices and commercial establishments are pretty much exclusively florescent.

So? You want to ban a light bulb but you haven't an issue with firearms? Sorry guy - I just don't see it.

(BTW... it was Edison's very special improvement - was it not? Something I'm very grateful for, personally. That doesn't mean we shouldn't seek better. Bell did wonderful things with the phone but we're not really using his hard wired device as much as we used to and there are WAY more phones out there now than there were 50 years ago.)

With this said, I don't understand how florescent lighting is about liberalism. Surely you don't think Wal-mart is a "liberal" money machine, do you? I don't know. I always thought they were just business - not political.

Besides, I just don't buy what "seems" to be your "everything wrong with the world is a liberal conspiracy." any more than I would buy "everything wrong with the world is a conservative conspiracy." That's just inane prattle!

Besides, I just don't buy what "seems" to be your "everything wrong with the world is a liberal conspiracy." any more than I would buy "everything wrong with the world is a conservative conspiracy." That's just inane prattle!

I don't think you can find any of us using those words. However, anytime the government tries to either ban something or force us to behave in a certain way, that is liberalism. It's not a conspiracy, it's just liberalism.

Liberalism believes that people are not competent enough to direct their own lives and need elites to tell them how to live. These elites exist in the United States in the form of government programs, bureaucrats, and congressmen. Any solution that can be found in the hands of individuals or the free market is frowned upon and discouraged.

I don't think you can find any of us using those words. However, anytime the government tries to either ban something or force us to behave in a certain way, that is liberalism. It's not a conspiracy, it's just liberalism.

Liberalism believes that people are not competent enough to direct their own lives and need elites to tell them how to live. These elites exist in the United States in the form of government programs, bureaucrats, and congressmen. Any solution that can be found in the hands of individuals or the free market is frowned upon and discouraged.

Fair enough. I have not seen those specific words being used but I suspect that I'm not the only one who has this sense from the threads I've read.

from http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/liberalism
"a political or social philosophy advocating the freedom of the individual, parliamentary systems of government, nonviolent modification of political, social, or economic institutions to assure unrestricted development in all spheres of human endeavor, and governmental guarantees of individual rights and civil liberties."

Essentially, all definitions are about the same.

You seem a reasonably bright guy - I assume we're not going to attempt to rewrite the dictionary here. I also assume that when you stand back and think about it, you realize that when a politician ascends to power (s)he (regardless of his/her political stripe) wields that power with the specific intent of controlling any descenting opinion - regardless of its validity.

... But isn't defining socio-political attitudes and behaviours an entirely different thread? (It would be an interesting discussion if it could be had as a discussion as opposed to a battle.)

With this said, I don't understand how florescent lighting is about liberalism. Surely you don't think Wal-mart is a "liberal" money machine, do you? I don't know. I always thought they were just business - not political.

Just like Ethanol is a joke perpetrated by the tree huggers and liberals alike.

Let's make the free market use ethanol. Let's force people to use it. Let's tell them it will clean up the air. Let's tell them it will burn 5% cleaner. Let's not tell them that they will use 10% more gasoline to get that benefit.

Let's tell them ethanol will free the U.S. from dependency on foreign oil.

Let's not tell them that it takes more energy to produce ethanol (from corn) than the energy created. Let's not tell them the effects on corn prices and every product related to corn.

Let's cry wolf about global warming and deny any proof that it is not man-made.

The list goes on and on and on.

Let's give condoms to 12 year olds.
Let's give tax credit to those that don't pay taxes.

Liberalism is a losing proposition on almost every single topic. It just doesn't work.

If you don't think that Walmart is under tremendous pressure on all fronts to act 'socially more responsible", you don't know Walmart. I do. I sell to them. I can tell you every little initiative they have undertaken and the genesis for it. They have to appear to care about the earth or they will get ravaged by liberals and the media.

There is a huge push to eliminate plastic at Walmart. Watch your favorite clothes detergent bottle change soon.

I have to admit, this response is merely for fun - I've said pretty much what every I can here BUT... (:D)

1) Ethanol is no joke! It's a serious mistake!

2) You're misinformed. Ethanol costs WAY more than 10 % more gasoline to get the "benefit". I would be surprised if there were any environmental or cost benefit to ethanol.

3) You're quite correct if you think I don't know Walmart. I neither shop nor sell there. I'm disinclined towards any of their business practices (although I admit to having purchased a roll of film there somewhere back in, approximately, 1989 or so **blush**).

4) I'm proud to be liberal-minded and I'm not, as a liberal, interested in having you or anyone else in my bedroom or being in yours (not all liberal minded people are intrusive. Not all conservative minded people mind their own business).

5) We use dry detergent so I won't be affected ... or will I? ;)

6) Man is not the root of global warming but to deny we have "some" hand ... that we are contributors (if minor or major) is silly. To think that we can change it is equally silly but we can, to some degree mitigate our own impact.

7) I give more credence to the dictionary definition of liberalism than yours (no offense).

8) I've heard nothing that causes me to change my mind to think that a light bulb or the earth or skies have politics. Politics are a human foible

This should be enough of an arsenal for anyone.

http://newsbusters.org/forums/topic-discussion/global-warming-phooey-15427

Sorry, but it seems G.W. Bush now acknowledges Global Warming.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWdiHtv6T6s

Sorry, but it seems G.W. Bush now acknowledges Global Warming.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWdiHtv6T6sSo what? You're the one who posted the fraudulent article about his IQ, so we all know you think he's an idiot.

So what? You're the one who posted the fraudulent article about his IQ, so we all know you think he's an idiot.

You need to pull that knobby tree branch out of your ass. This was a joke, obviously. The kid does an excellent impersonation.

I don't think you can find any of us using those words. However, anytime the government tries to either ban something or force us to behave in a certain way, that is liberalism. It's not a conspiracy, it's just liberalism.

Liberalism believes that people are not competent enough to direct their own lives and need elites to tell them how to live. These elites exist in the United States in the form of government programs, bureaucrats, and congressmen. Any solution that can be found in the hands of individuals or the free market is frowned upon and discouraged.
Holy Cow!
I agree with every word!
KS

I dont get it are we arguing that global warming is real or not? i remember when i was on that bandwagon then a stat popped up in my face.... over past ten years we lost 900 feet in ice in the south or north pole (dont remember)... last year 800 feet of it refroze... so... global what now?

as far as references go i got this from my english teacher who is actually very credible she was one of the most analytical people i ever met.

Also its starting to bother me to see that its 80 degrees outside with a CHILLY breeze... WTF?

I think it would be absurd to argue that global warming isn't real. The globe is constantly warming or cooling. The big argument is whether the most recent warming trend is man-made or not. A smaller argument would be if we are currently even in a warming trend.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2008/05/26/cnsoros126.xml

Speculators are largely responsible for driving crude prices to their peaks in recent weeks and the record oil price now looks like a bubble, George Soros has warned.

The billionaire investor's comments came only days after the oil price soared to a record high of $135 a barrel amid speculation that crude could soon be catapulted towards the $200 mark.

In an interview with The Daily Telegraph, Mr Soros said that although the weak dollar, ebbing Middle Eastern supply and record Chinese demand could explain some of the increase in energy prices, the crude oil market had been significantly affected by speculation.

"Speculation... is increasingly affecting the price," he said. "The price has this parabolic shape which is characteristic of bubbles," he said. "We face the most serious recession of our lifetime"

The comments are significant, not only because Mr Soros is the world's most prominent hedge fund investor but also because many experts have claimed speculation is only a minor factor affecting crude prices.

Oil prices stalled on Friday after their biggest one-day jump since the first Gulf War earlier in the week.

At just over $130 a barrel, the price has doubled in around a year, causing misery for motorists and businesses.

However, Mr Soros warned that the oil bubble would not burst until both the US and Britain were in recession, after which prices could fall dramatically.

"You can also anticipate that [the bubble] will eventually correct but that is unlikely to happen before the recession actually reduces the demand.

"The rise in the price of oil and food is going to weigh and aggravate the recession."

The Bank of England recently warned that soaring energy and food costs would push inflation above its target range for most of the next 18 months, making it more unlikely that it will cut borrowing costs soon.

Mr Soros warns Britain is facing its worst economic storm in living memory, dwarfing those of the 1970s and early 1990s, with a housing slump and serious recession.

He said: "The dislocations will be greater [than in the 1970s] because you also have the implications of the house price decline, which you didn't have in the 1970s."

The warning undermines predictions that Britain will suffer only a brief and relatively painless recession, unlike the precipitous dives of previous years.

Mr Soros also warned that the Bank's inflation report represents a "Faustian pact", obliging it to keep interest rates high to control inflation, even as the economy is starting to slump.

"You had the nice decade," he said. "Now that is over and you are in a straitjacket."