Lincoln vs Cadillac Forums

(This is the forums archive - If you want to get back to the main site simply click the banner above and you will be taken to our homepage.)

Lincoln vs Cadillac Forums is the Ultimate Online Resource for Owners and Enthusiasts of American Luxury Cars. Feel free to browse through our archive - but make sure you make it back to our main site - Lincoln vs Cadillac Forums

Cadillac XLR : Cadillac CTS : Cadillac : 2005 Cadillac STS : Cadillac Forums : 2000 Lincoln LS : Lincoln Mark VIII : Lincoln Mark VII : Car Wax
Lincoln Town Car : Lincoln Air Suspension : Lincoln Continental : Lemon Law : Do It Yourself Car Repair : Lincoln vs Cadillac Forums : Mesothelioma

Back to the Archive Main Page

Pages: 1

manual shifting my mark VIII?! why?

(Click here to view the original thread with full colors/images)

Posted by: SC_Steve

Well... met a fellow mark VIII enthusiest by accident yesterday. I was intrested in buying a 95 from him (figured he was like alot of people and didn't really care for it much, as everytime I seen it... the suspension was totally dropped and just sitting in the same place).

Anyway, while talking with him he was telling me that his tires would break loose every time on the 1-2 shift. Now, I'm not expert or anything like that... but I know that a stock mark wont do that unless the 1-2 piston is going.

So anyway, I sort of called him on it and he told me "no no no... you have to manually shift it... let it rev up to 5K and bang second"... "the tranny, for some reason, will shift gentle in drive... but doing it manually gives a firmer shift". I remember Geno telling me this too a while back on FvC but never tried it before...

So after I left his shop (he owns a body shop as it turns out... so he's hooking me up with some paint and stuff because of the car

) I decided to try it out as curiosity got the better of me and WOW. I can't believe how different the car feels shifting it myself instead of letting the tranny do it for me.

Seriously... if feels alot more powerful for some reason. If I give it any more than 1/2 throttle in 1st the tries will want to start breaking loose and when it bangs second all you hear is a "chiiirrrrrrp" and a bit of smoke off the rear wheels.

now... why is this? When I let the tranny shift itself it's as smooth as a babys butt... but when I do it myself it feels like It's jmodded. Does the tranny change internal setting for pressure and all that jazz based on where the gear selector is or something? I just don't get it.

Even if I punch it off the line in drive it wont chirp second nor will it spin the wheels (most likey because of the tires I have) but when I punch it in 1st off teh line the ass end erupts in a cloud of white smoke....

any insight on this would be cool... I'm stumped, yet at the same time... I havent been this impressed with the car since I first drove it. Had a smile from ear to ear.

Oh... and doing that is probably bad for the tranny isn't it? Or would downshifting be the only rear bad thing to do? thanks alot
-Steve

P.S. sorry in advance for spelling and gramer error

Posted by: Jibit

I don't think anything internal changes in the tranny. I think its a matter of the RPM's you're shifting at. I'm not certain of the stock setting but when I do it manually I shift at about 6500. I doubt the tranny will allow itself to exceed the redline when in automatic. As far as harming the tranny, I was told the firmer shifts prolong the life of the tranny so manually shifting would not damage anything. I've tried to figure this one out and the only thing I can think of is when the car has "lazy shifts" the clutches are grinding against each other longer than if you had firm shifts. This is just an opinion, I never looked into it. I bet Geno would know the answer behind that though.

Posted by: crownvicjim

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jibit

I don't think anything internal changes in the tranny. I think its a matter of the RPM's you're shifting at. I'm not certain of the stock setting but when I do it manually I shift at about 6500. I doubt the tranny will allow itself to exceed the redline when in automatic. As far as harming the tranny, I was told the firmer shifts prolong the life of the tranny so manually shifting would not damage anything. I've tried to figure this one out and the only thing I can think of is when the car has "lazy shifts" the clutches are grinding against each other longer than if you had firm shifts. This is just an opinion, I never looked into it. I bet Geno would know the answer behind that though.

umm Geno?

Posted by: vr4

nope. it does break them loose when manually shifting. mine used to. then i did the j-mod and now it breaks loose any time.

problem is manually shifting isnt good for the trans.

Posted by: 98LSC32V

You can manually shift a 98 tranny all day and all night long no problems. The difference in a stock Mark VIII between leaving it in drive and shifting manually shouldn't be that big but the ECU does increase the line pressure a lil bit manually shifting. A stock Mark VIII should not be chirping the tires in between the 1-2 shift unless the 1-2 accumulator is broken.

Posted by: turborich

My friend's 94 breaks em loose & sends the rear of the car into the next lane! I know that his 1-2 spring must be broke. He doesn't want to repair it though. Who knows why?

My 95 shifts too smooth IMO, shift it manually & it barks the tires pretty good.

Just how hard is the J Mod to do?

Posted by: 98LSC32V

It's pretty simple, you just have to drill a few holes. If you are afraid of drilling you can get a separator plate already pre drilled (jmod) from Lonnie at Blue Oval Chips.

Posted by: vr4

Quote:

Originally Posted by turborich

My 95 shifts too smooth IMO, shift it manually & it barks the tires pretty good.

thats exactly what mine was like when i bought it.

ie: properly working. if it breaks them loose on dry pavement going into 2nd without a j-mod or shift kit when in auto the spring is broken.

Posted by: slowmkviii

If I was driving my 97 hard all day (before the B.E. controls shift kit) It would chirp the tires when shifting from 1 to 2 when you shift the lever from D to 2 at the same time

Posted by: AbrahamLincoln

is the predrilled thing the same as the "shift kit" i dont understand if they both do the same thing, how can they be different?

Posted by: Roadboss

"Shift Kits" come in all varieties and configurations.

Posted by: RedHotMark96

So is manually shifting good or bad for the tranny?

If I want to do some WOT, would it be better to do it that way?

Posted by: poniesviii

The only reason it chirps manually is because you get into higher rpm shifting manually. My first one did this too. Tranny's still going strong but it definately has the broken (spring?) .. because it's never been j modded.

Posted by: Markviiiedrea

BAD for the trans. When doing so, insted of useing the normal opertion of the tranny to shift, it uses the OD band to shift into 2nd and 3rd putting alot shock and ware on the clutch material. Dont do it, just buy a shift kit from BE controls and do it right.

I love my shift kit and I dont have to worry about shifting before the red line.

Posted by: AbrahamLincoln

Quote:

Originally Posted by 98LSC32V

You can manually shift a 98 tranny all day and all night long no problems. The difference in a stock Mark VIII between leaving it in drive and shifting manually shouldn't be that big but the ECU does increase the line pressure a lil bit manually shifting. A stock Mark VIII should not be chirping the tires in between the 1-2 shift unless the 1-2 accumulator is broken.

hmmmm all day and all night?

on the other hand bad for the tranny? quite a debate.

Posted by: kustomizingkid

The -98 4r70w transmissions had a bad one way clutch design, making manual shifting harmful.

Posted by: 98LSC32V

The 98 4r70w comes with a mechanical diode which is pretty much indestructible, you can manually shift as much as you want as long as you get frequent tranny flushes you will be fine. I have been manually shifting at 7000 rpm for 2 years now no problems (knock on wood).

Posted by: Moes8

DO NOT MANUALLY SHIFT A NON MECHANICAL DIODE 4R70W ,YOU WILL QUICKLY DESTROY YOUR TRANS,IFOUND THIS OUT THE HARD WAY,

98+ TRANS YOU CAN SHIFT ALL YOU WANT,I HAD A LOW MILEAGE GEN 1 TRANNY AND MANUALLY SHIFTED IT MAYBE 20 TIMES,THE LAST TIME I DID ITI ACCLERATED UPTO 3RD GEAR AND AT THE NEXT LIGHT I NO LONGER HAD 2ND GEAR.

if you have been manually shifting a non mechanical diode trans and it hasnt broke, consider yourself lucky and possibly on borrowed time

Posted by: ONEBADMK8

I belive that to be total BS. I have manual shifted ALL my Marks forver and never had any adverse effects.

Posted by: Moes8

well maybe i just had bad luck,but after i lost 2nd i dug around online and found a bunch of info saying what i posted above.

i wont argue with you Geno,you have WAY more experience with this than me.

Posted by: Abbens

this talk is all new to me manual shifting on an automatic. only thing i new that was near that is trip tronic trannies that those Jaguar bimmers have

Posted by: ONEBADMK8

Manual shifting is always better. Quicker and faster too.

Posted by: 93' Blue on blue

Says the exact opposite in that article you just posted.

''and in the ongoing debate about whether to shift the electronic AOD manually, we found that doing so RAISED our strip times by two tenths''

Posted by: ONEBADMK8

Again your results may vary. Try it in the Mark, you will go faster manually then in drive. If your chipped and the shifts are well done by the tuner you will NOT be able to outshift the car manually.

Posted by: vr4

supply me with a new trans and ill be happy to verify which is faster.