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Problem

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Posted by: Cheez_94

Posting here cause I know it will get more responses. OK got a 01 crown vic that all of a sudden will just die. Pull over turn off the key, roll the key back to start, it starts and goes down the road fine. It has done this twice in one day. Too me it sounds like a possible fuel problem. The CE light came on but did not come back on after re-start, and it stored no codes.

Help please, thanks

Posted by: Frat-man-du

Try the IAC They get dirty and it could cause this.

Posted by: Frogman

When does the car die? While idling, or driving?

The IAC is useless when you're driving (aka the motor is under load).

My first thought was the ignition cylinder.

Could be fuel as you said, but... sounds unlikely for it to just cut out all of the sudden, then start right back up again when you re-start it... even with a bad fuel pump.

Posted by: unity

Bad ground?

Posted by: chicken

thats what my mr2 does, as soon it gets up to operating temp it turns off, but after its warm it will only run for a few seconds each restart. getting home after this started was fun. start it, floor it, dump the clutch and push it back down and roll for as long as you could......for 12 miles, now it might be for sale (

something may have come up

)

Posted by: 93' Blue on blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by chickenviii

now it might be for sale (

something may have come up

)

Nice!

Posted by: Cheez_94

OK, My wife took it to a local recomended shop (I work out of town all week). The thing was throwing codes all over the place (very inconsistant). He determined to the replace the shift solinoid pack, and I had him do a trans flush/service as well. He also said that #1 coil was weak. Well my wife got the car back and last night I finally had the chance to drive it home from Bloomington. It started acting up big time, stalling more than 10 times w/all kinds of crazy stuff going on. The CE light will come on and stay on momentarily, flicker or flash. The trans will shift in and out of OD harshley, (this will trigger the stall). Now for really strange, the anti theft light on the dashwill stay on or ficker or flash, the climate control will come on all by itself and the door locks will accuate (Lock) all by themselves. The frigging thing is possesed! The irronious codes and strange behavior points to a ECM to me but this mechanic swears that Fords ECMs very rarely go bad and he believes the problems to be all Trans, Throttle solinoid or converter. If you drive it with the OD off it does better but it will turn the OD back on by itself and then stall emmediatly after, WTF! This can has never had problem and has been extreemly reliable now all of this? Having to deal with this on top of trying to move my family so I don't work out of town all week, AAAAAARRRRRGGGG!!!! Anyone have an extra 01 CV ECM they can let me try out?

Posted by: 93' Blue on blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheez_94

The CE light will come on and stay on momentarily, flicker or flash. The trans will shift in and out of OD harshley, (this will trigger the stall). Now for really strange, the anti theft light on the dashwill stay on or ficker or flash, the climate control will come on all by itself and the door locks will accuate (Lock) all by themselves. The frigging thing is possesed!

Those 'ghostly' multiple errors may point towards a centralized electrical problem, such as bad alternator, bad battery, bad ground cable somewhere. I'd be inclined to have the charging system thoroughly checked over before proceeding to throw more parts at (possible) problems.

Edit: Mind, no harm in trying a (known) good ECM.

Posted by: droobie

i bought one for parts, since it had similar problems
once i removed the after market alarm , the car ran fine
do you have factory or aftermarket alarm ? if after market was it installed by some young kid in a shop ?
best of luck

Posted by: Cheez_94

It's a factory alarm, and the charging system and grounds have been checked. I wish I had access to a known good ECM but unfortunatly I don't, neither does the shop, and I can try a new one after I buy it and can't return it if it isn't the problem.

One other odd thing it did, the first OTC scanner he plugged into it, the car fryed it, like I said the damn thing is possesed

Oh yeah he tryed another, brand new MAF and it ran worse, I told him to let the place where he got it know that is wasn't any good. Can't see how it would make it run worse.

Posted by: XLRVIII

Quote:

Originally Posted by 93' Blue on blue

point towards a centralized electrical problem, such as bad alternator, bad battery, bad ground cable somewhere.
Edit: Mind, no harm in trying a (known) good ECM.

+ 1

that is exactly how my car acted just prior to smoking the alternator.

in the end, it needed battery, Alternator and cable ends.

Posted by: slowmkviii

sounds like electrical to me to like XLRVIII said with the alternator or
to me more like the ECU is acting up try to make sure the wires are good going to the ecu try to unplug it and plug it back in for starters
I had this problem before in a mark it would shift out of od then back in and stall it was bad wires going to the ecu

Posted by: Cheez_94

Well I ordered a set of MSD coils for it and last night I finnally had a chance to work on the car (we've been moving) I installed the coils and cleaned the battery terminals (I thought the mechanic had done this) and VIOLA it's back to it's tire munching self. I'd be willing to bet that all the problems originated with low voltage. I know that lower than required voltage to the coils can fry them, and this car had lost two recently. The Mechanic soaked me for over 900 bucks of tranny solinoids and labor, and I seriously doubt there was anything wrong with them.

Does antifreeze slipped into a mechanic's coffee work like it does on cats in cat food?

Posted by: 93' Blue on blue

Wow! The mechanic who said he checked the charging system and grounds missed the most elementary of things! What a tool!

Oh well, at least you worked it out in the end.

Is the mechanic going to reimburse you for wasted time and money on labor and parts? He should!

Posted by: XLRVIII

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheez_94

I'd be willing to bet that all the problems originated with low voltage.

this is 100% true, since 100% of the PCM stuff is based on voltage.
the shift solenoids proper operation depend on the PCM getting proper voltage

the MLPS is a crude version of a dimmer switch, by sending different voltages to the PCM it communicates what gear the car is in.

when I drove my battery into the dirt the car, engine and trans did all kind of goofy crap just prior to the car dying.

1 bad electrical connection + over a grand in cost X all the frustation = Suckage.

I'm still shocked at 900.00 for shift solenoid service.
I got that done locally for 140.00 including fluid.
{mercron v was 60.00 of that cost)

Posted by: XLRVIII

Quote:

Originally Posted by unity

Bad ground?

LVC solved this issue LONG before the guy that got paid 900.00 did.

this thread should be printed and handed to the guy that's wallet got REALLY FAT from this "Job".

Posted by: XLRVIII

woman+lincoln+dishonest mechanic= "Bentha F Over" on your credit card bill.

granted, the mechanic ran diagnostics that pointed to a problem with the SS pack.
a real mechanic would have seen that the common thing between ALL the issues was lack of proper voltage.

Diagnostic tools are powerful, but you still have to be intelligent enough to INTERPRET what the little box is telling you.

Posted by: Cheez_94

Quote:

Originally Posted by XLRVIII

woman+lincoln+dishonest mechanic= "Bentha F Over" on your credit card bill.

granted, the mechanic ran diagnostics that pointed to a problem with the SS pack.
a real mechanic would have seen that the common thing between ALL the issues was lack of proper voltage.

Diagnostic tools are powerful, but you still have to be intelligent enough to INTERPRET what the little box is telling you.

Diagnostic tools are powerful, but you still have to be intelligent enough to INTERPRET what the little box is telling you.

Exactly, I'm old shcool so I always check the basics first. There are too many Mechanics out there that rely to much on their code reader.

It just turned out to be a bad time not be around home (work) The guy was recommended and I don't think he did anything intentional, I just think he needs to stick with the basics and not trust his reader so much.

What burns me up is I explicitly asked him "did you check the battery, alternator etc?" "yeah, yeah one of the first things"

Those terminals hadn't been touched. They didn't really look too bad, but this car apparently needs spotless battery terminals. I'm also going to check the harness that runs from the battery, under the core support to the firewall. There was an old service bullitin I found stating that CVs had a problem chafing this and causing shorts, again something he should have checked for.

He replaced every solenoid in the trans, the pack, the shift and the presure solenoids.

I wished I had the stuff to do the J-mod while he was in there

Posted by: XLRVIII

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheez_94

They didn't really look too bad, but this car has apparently needs spotless battery terminals..

If they are the OEM cable ends then yes.. SPOTLESS
If they are the OEM cable ends I would suggest putting something "old school" on there. {you know what I mean)

the new band clamp strap terminals are CRAP as I'm sure you know.

Posted by: Cheez_94

Quote:

Originally Posted by XLRVIII

LVC solved this issue LONG before the guy that got paid 900.00 did.

this thread should be printed and handed to the guy that's wallet got REALLY FAT from this "Job".

not bad ground, dirty positive battery cable connection

Posted by: Cheez_94

Quote:

Originally Posted by 93' Blue on blue

Wow! The mechanic who said he checked the charging system and grounds missed the most elementary of things! What a tool!

Oh well, at least you worked it out in the end.

Is the mechanic going to reimburse you for wasted time and money on labor and parts? He should!

Is the mechanic going to reimburse you for wasted time and money on labor and parts? He should!

HA HA HA your funny, I wish

Posted by: XLRVIII

which is even stupider than a bad ground.
when I check the charging system it ALWAYS starts with "remove and clean battery terminals".

had proper diagnostic procedures been followed it wouldn't have been a thousand dollar fishing expedition.

Unity was ON the right track, til you batted him down with "it's been checked".
lol

Posted by: XLRVIII

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cheez_94

Is the mechanic going to reimburse you for wasted time and money on labor and parts? He should!

HA HA HA your funny, I wish

he's not funny he's right....

I dont think you could go "I want my 900.00 back".

But as I said, I would print this thread.
Show him what the dumbasses on the internet figured out before HIS EXPERT Diagnosis led to the customer spending about NINE TIMES too much money.

This should have been a 100.00 fix at most
85ish for the hour of diagnostics and 15.00 to replace the terminal end.

ALSO the complete RAPE on the Shift Soleniod job that wasn't actually needed.

I would SEROUSLY ask for 50% of my money back.
The guy would still make 450.00 on a job that if done by a NON RAPIST would have been 250.00 tops.

Like I said 140.00 for SS service on my 95 mark 8
He'd still 350.00 a head and you'd get half your money back.

PRINT THIS and TAKE IT TO HIM.

It really boils down to "if he cares if you ever come back".

Which based on his INTIAL RAPEAGE he stays in business by the "screw everyone once" mentality.

Posted by: Cheez_94

Quote:

Originally Posted by XLRVIII

Yep that they are (stock)

"Old School" Man! yeah I know what your talking about, but they just look so ammature hour.

I'll have to see if I can find my old electricians hydrolic terminal crimping set and make my own.

Posted by: XLRVIII

well there are some "new school" terminal ends that are baddass...but the few I've seen didn't "tighten" up enough to make a good connection and cause more problems.

stick with tried and true old school battery lugs, feel free to improve.

Posted by: Icedphoenix

if its a chain shop eg firestone pep boys etc they have a 1 800 number that you call, complain, and they talk to the shop. Then discuss the situation i know you paid the diag so he should have come back with that as the cause since he did not they will pay back part of it. The tranny flush and anything maint they will not so full price on that. If he recommended on the work order those be cleaned with a corrosion package you may be sol as they recommended what fixed it and you declined even though you were misled to the root of the problem so check the invoice before calling. If they do get money back it will be on the stuff he said would fix your problem. If its a tire brand company tht is shared by a japanese company of a almost same name then pm me the shops address and phone number i cant help with the money but can get you the 800 number and send this thread to the bosses boss so he sees the bad pr he is getting over that mechanic and it will get handled on that side.