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Pages: 1

Valve Cover Leak

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Posted by: GMAN

The other day I was at my local Sonic to grab some lunch. I turnd off the engine, and enjoyed my burger and fries. When I stared up to leave, I heard a loud "POP". I didn't think much of it at the time, but then I noticed that that my exhaust flow wasn't smooth. Like I can tell it was missing. So I took of the spark plug plate, and my spark plugs were full of oil! To make things worse, spark plug #7 was blown out of the hole, and the coil was obliterated. So now I have to do valve cover gaskets and new COP's

Posted by: 93' Blue on blue

Spark plug blew out the hole?

Did it just come loose or have the threads in the head stripped? (i read its a common thing on B heads)

Posted by: vr4

not only do you have to do the gaskets and coils but you have to put an insert into the hole for a new plug too.

Posted by: GMAN

Quote:

Originally Posted by vr4

not only do you have to do the gaskets and coils but you have to put an insert into the hole for a new plug too.

What do you mean by an insert? Do I have to tap for new threads?

Posted by: vr4

http://www.sjdiscounttools.com/mtn9200.html

Quote:

Designed to aid in repairing Ford modular cylinder heads. A quality fool proof repair system that is fast, cost effective, and simple to use. Used to repair damaged threads from blown or deteriorated spark plugs in 4.6L, 5.4L, and Ford V10 Triton engines.

just 1 of the many kits out there for this common problem.

Posted by: Sal329

I had 2 spark plugs blow out of mine. One blew out, fixed it and on the test drive another one went.

Posted by: jamie97lsc

i cant believe how much oil in down in the journals. when i took the covers off my 98 to powder coat them, i bought a gasket set from felpro, comes with the new valve cover gaskets and spark plug tower oil seals as wel, thats what you need, thats why oil is filling up the journals. as far as the plug goes, either have a pro instal a helicoil or replace the head. that sucks bad.

Posted by: ford nut

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sal329

I had 2 spark plugs blow out of mine. One blew out, fixed it and on the test drive another one went.

OMG I think I would have sold the car when I was done.

GMAN that tool for doing the job is spendy get some quotes on how much at some shops you trust, a good wrench who has done it before will give you a good price.
Its a known problem v 10s spit them out like chewing gum.
It is the main reason I wont buy a pre 2003 ford truck.

Posted by: vr4

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford nut

OMG I think I would have sold the car when I was done.

you could always buy a 3v and have the plugs break upon removal

Posted by: ford nut

Quote:

Originally Posted by vr4

you could always buy a 3v and have the plugs break upon removal

LOL whats up with that ?
Havent heard that one yet....I guess not too many 3v in for a tune up yet.
I wonder about Ford and some of the junk they have been making.

I have a 96 bronco I dont see me getting past that year.

Posted by: vr4

heres a generic picture of the new spark plug....

heres how they typically look when they break...

ive been lucky in that of the 36 that ive removed so far ive only broken 1 and the porcelain didnt break off in the shell so it was an easy removal.

what happens is the shell and most often the porcelain will break off in the head and must be removed with a tap and threaded puller. if you screw up it could mean new cyl head time.

Posted by: 93' Blue on blue

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford nut

I wonder about Ford and some of the junk they have been making.

Me too! For a company thats been making cars for 100 and odd years, they don't seem to have a clue?

Anyway, i was just curious, if you were to thread insert a spark plug hole, would that plug not dissipate heat as well? Would it be a good idea to run a step colder plug for a repaired hole? (im asking now, as its only a matter of time before something like this happens to more of us)

Posted by: vr4

Quote:

Originally Posted by 93' Blue on blue

fords official stance is to not install an insert of any kind. weve done 100s at the shop with no issues and using the standard heat range plug for the vehicle.

granted these are normal trucks not driven hard.

Posted by: ford nut

Quote:

Originally Posted by 93' Blue on blue

It doesnt happen very often on the 4v.
The 2v on the other hand it happens all the time.
From what I was told hole # 3 has only 3 threads holding in the plug it was fixed in 2003.
I think part of the problem in the 4v is how deep the plug is in the head, if you are not careful you can cross thread the plug.
But your right you would think a car company that has been around 100 years would know how many threads are needed to hold in a spark plug.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vr4

Wow that sucks....no 3v for me !
Hopefully Ford comes clean on this one and finds a fix.

Posted by: vr4

Quote:

Originally Posted by ford nut

Wow that sucks....no 3v for me !
Hopefully Ford comes clean on this one and finds a fix.

word has it the hole that the shell goes thru is larger on 06+ engines but i cant confirm his yet.

the problem is less noticed on the 4V due to the plugs being easy to get to. 3 and 4 on the trucks are a PITA so these are the most common to blow out.

Posted by: GMAN

Spent the day working on the valve covers, replacing the gaskets, coils and COP's. I have to tell you, I am not a certified mechanic by no means. I will try everything I believe I can handle at least once. Today I tried the valve cover gaskets. This was a royal PITA! I finally got the passenger side off, no damage was done on that side. Everything looked in tact.

I got the cover back on and buttoned it back up and moved to the drivers side. First I moved the master cylinder, then the fuse box, and move the power steering fluid up. I am having a real hard time getting this valve cover off. I really need some help with this one. Anyone have any ideas?

Posted by: XLRVIII

That explains why you didn't answer your phone...(lol)

was gonna give you some moral support and some pointers on putting a thread insert in if you do indeed need to go that route.

my 95 blew a plug out, I put a steel insert in that lasted well over 200K hard milesh..
"do not fear the insert, it's not as bad as it sounds".

Tip for the valve cover, try and see if you can jack the motor up a bit, you hopefully have a little "slop" in the mount and it'll let the motor up a 1/2 inch or so.
Give it a shot...and feel free to give me a call if I can help in any way.

Posted by: GMAN

I didn't know you called. I was getting so frustrated, I had to walk away.

Posted by: chickenviii

Quote:

Originally Posted by vr4

heres a generic picture of the new spark plug....

heres how they typically look when they break...

at least fords removal kit is fairlly easy, stick vac cap into bottom, thread metal sleeve, insert tool and pull out, ive done a couple, only had a prob with one, where another shop tried to use a 5/8 plug socket and rounded the nut, of course it was cyl #4, so that was fun

Posted by: GMAN

My plugs didn look like that. They all came out, all threads were in tact. The one plug in in question, the gap closed up on it. I believe it somehow backed its way out.

Posted by: chickenviii

best bet, is to see if the threads are still in tact, try carefully to install another of the plugs from another hole and dont over tighten, i have personally never seen one come out and the threads be ok

Posted by: ford nut

Quote:

Originally Posted by chickenviii

best bet, is to see if the threads are still in tact, try carefully to install another of the plugs from another hole and dont over tighten, i have personally never seen one come out and the threads be ok

+1 the pop you heard was the plug poping out it would have to do some damage if your lucky it was loose and only ripped out a few threads.
It was a little missle thats what took out your cop

Posted by: Sal329

When my plug popped out the threads looked perfect. I tried another brand spark plug and it wouldn't thread in. I retreied the one I pulled out and it threaded in fine. I even drove the car 30 miles from work to home and the next mornin started the car and plug blew back out.

Posted by: GMAN

Well, I am at a stopping point. I got the valve cover off, and the spark plug turned freely in cylinder#7. I am going to have to get it fixed. I am apprehensive about doing that myself. And to think, I was getting ready to sell it. Is this the Marks way of saying "You're not selling me!!"? I guess I can either dump more money into her now. No use in selling her at this point. So I have a few options here. Fix the spark plug hole, or go with different heads. I was thinking about cobra heads. I hope they don't have this know problem. What would be the ideal heads to go with?

Posted by: vr4

youll pick up a little power going with newer heads but it wont be worth the cost involved if a shop can install an insert without pulling the heads. youll also need to buy a new intake manifold and tube to go with the new heads unless you find a 99 continental

best bet would be to call around to a few FLM dealers and ask if they have any experience installing inserts for blown out plugs. we do 2-3/week

Posted by: MatthewDavid

I feel you man... I changed gaskets a couple months ago talk about aggravating... I'm a pretty passive bro and my girl never seen me swear scream and threaten anything as much as that stupid drivers side valve cover... and then I cracked it putting it back in... if you do get any ideas of an easier way I'd love to hear how you did it... I still need to change that valve cover... it's going strong with JB weld on it... no leaks or anything anymore... it had seepage for the first couple weeks then nothing... I just don't want to go through with that again!

Posted by: vr4

lower the subframe about an inch or remove the brake booster

Posted by: GMAN

What I ended up doing was putting a jackstand on the right edge of the oil pan, and lowering the car slowly. It move the engine slightly to get the cover off....After four hours of jacking with it though.

Posted by: MatthewDavid

Yeah we did that.... and it helped to get it out... but getting it back in was hard as hell... 4 guys wrestling with it and then pop it just went in... don't really know what we did but it sure was a PITA

Posted by: XLRVIII

I was very apprehensive on doing the plug repair myself..
Only took about 15 minutes and it was done...

you've got the valve cover off, which will make the repair ALOT easier.

I got a thread repair kit made for spark plugs, it was made by helicoil but it's not the traditional "spring type" helicoil, it's an actual steel insert.

You should be able to pull it off Greg, you've by far got the hardest part of the job done... dont sell yourself short sir.

Posted by: ford nut

Quote:

Originally Posted by XLRVIII

I was very apprehensive on doing the plug repair myself..
Only took about 15 minutes and it was done...

you've got the valve cover off, which will make the repair ALOT easier.

I got a thread repair kit made for spark plugs, it was made by helicoil but it's not the traditional "spring type" helicoil, it's an actual steel insert.

You should be able to pull it off Greg, you've by far got the hardest part of the job done... dont sell yourself short sir.

You are so right

you have got this far...If you ever had to retap anything you can do this.
Getting that cover sounds like most of the battle.

Posted by: GMAN

Too late! I wimped out. The whole valve cover took a toll on me.

I'm all scratched up on my knuckles, I practically said every cuss word known. My mechanic has the car now. I didn't want to take a chance on ruining the head.

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