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Military Draft: Brought to you by the Democrats

(Click here to view the original thread with full colors/images)

Posted by: fossten

Sunday, Nov. 19, 2006 8:24 p.m. EST

Rep. Charles Rangel Wants to Reinstate Draft

WASHINGTON -- Americans would have to sign up for a new military draft after turning 18 under a bill the incoming chairman of the House Ways and Means Committee says he will introduce next year.

Rep. Charles Rangel, D-N.Y., said Sunday he sees his idea as a way to deter politicians from launching wars.

"There's no question in my mind that this president and this administration would never have invaded Iraq, especially on the flimsy evidence that was presented to the Congress, if indeed we had a draft and members of Congress and the administration thought that their kids from their communities would be placed in harm's way," Rangel said.

Rangel, a veteran of the Korean War who has unsuccessfully sponsored legislation on conscription in the past, has said the all-volunteer military disproportionately puts the burden of war on minorities and lower-income families.

Rangel said he will propose a measure early next year. While he said he is serious about the proposal, there is little evident support among the public or lawmakers for it.

In 2003, Rangel proposed a measure covering people age 18 to 26. It was defeated 402-2 the following year. This year, he offered a plan to mandate military service for men and women between age 18 and 42; it went nowhere in the Republican-led Congress.

Democrats will control the House and Senate come January because of their victories in the Nov. 7 election.

At a time when some lawmakers are urging the military to send more troops to Iraq, "I don't see how anyone can support the war and not support the draft," said Rangel, who also proposed a draft in January 2003, before the U.S. invasion of Iraq. "I think to do so is hypocritical."

Sen. Lindsey Graham, a South Carolina Republican who is a colonel in the U.S. Air Force Standby Reserve, said he agreed that the U.S. does not have enough people in the military.

"I think we can do this with an all-voluntary service, all-voluntary Army, Air Force, Marine Corps and Navy. And if we can't, then we'll look for some other option," said Graham, who is assigned as a reserve judge to the Air Force Court of Criminal Appeals.

Rangel, the next chairman of the House tax-writing committee, said he worried the military was being strained by its overseas commitments.

"If we're going to challenge Iran and challenge North Korea and then, as some people have asked, to send more troops to Iraq, we can't do that without a draft," Rangel said.

He said having a draft would not necessarily mean everyone called to duty would have to serve. Instead, "young people (would) commit themselves to a couple of years in service to this great republic, whether it's our seaports, our airports, in schools, in hospitals," with a promise of educational benefits at the end of service.

Graham said he believes the all-voluntary military "represents the country pretty well in terms of ethnic makeup, economic background."
Repeated polls have shown that about seven in 10 Americans oppose reinstatement of the draft and officials say they do not expect to restart conscription.

Outgoing Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld told Congress in June 2005 that "there isn't a chance in the world that the draft will be brought back."

Yet the prospect of the long global fight against terrorism and the continuing U.S. commitment to stabilizing Iraq have kept the idea in the public's mind.

The military drafted conscripts during the Civil War, both world wars and between 1948 and 1973. An agency independent of the Defense Department, the Selective Service System, keeps an updated registry of men age 18-25 — now about 16 million — from which to supply untrained draftees that would supplement the professional all-volunteer armed forces.

Rangel and Graham appeared on "Face the Nation" on CBS.

Posted by: pepperman

His proposed legislation will get defeated again.

Posted by: Calabrio

Pepperman, the question is then- why is he sponsoring it again?

Posted by: mike maluchnik

Rangel does this all the time. He skews it into a race issue,when it isn't. It's volunteer,nobody is forced into it. Rangel needs to look up the "volunteer" in the dictionary.

Posted by: fossten

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike maluchnik

Rangel does this all the time. He skews it into a race issue,when it isn't. It's volunteer,nobody is forced into it. Rangel needs to look up the "volunteer" in the dictionary.

His dictionary doesn't have "volunteer" or "tax cut" in it.

Welcome to the forum.

Posted by: 97silverlsc

I agree with Rangel, reinstate the draft. All you imperialistic hawks that want to take over oil fields or otherwise involve the US in unnecessary wars can help support the troops with the ultimate sacrifice--yourselves or your kids.

Posted by: Calabrio

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97silverlsc

I agree with Rangel, reinstate the draft. All you imperialistic hawks that want to take over oil fields or otherwise involve the US in unnecessary wars can help support the troops with the ultimate sacrifice--yourselves or your kids.

So the military operations in Iraq were just an effort to "take over oil fields?"
Do you really believe that?

Posted by: TheDude

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97silverlsc

Considering all you said to be true, it still would be a lousy idea. The 'upper crust' will always have loopholes for themselves and their children. A draft would only guarantee a weaker military as people who do not want to serve will be forced to serve. A volunteer system (some cases aside) guarantee's soldiers that want to live a military lifestyle and want to fight.

Posted by: JohnnyBz00LS

Quote:

Originally Posted by 95DevilleNS

While I agree the "upper crust" would maintain loopholes, I'm not sure if I buy the "volunteers guarantee a stronger army" connection. I don't think you'll find an enlisted person who'd argue that basic training and everything else done to build each person into the "Army of One" makes a much better person out of them. With a few isolated cases as an exception, in general one could easily argue that making every high-school grad go through boot camp not only provides just as strong as army (are we doubting the reformation capabilities of boot camp here??), but a better society overall by giving opportunities to many they would'nt have had the guts to persue otherwise, and forced the slackers of society to shape up and possibly become a better person. I'm suprised those who are so quick to blame today's problems on rap music, video games and designer clothes haven't instead blamed the lack of the draft for being at least partially to blame for the downfall of society.

Posted by: TheDude

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyBz00LS

I see your point, but generally speaking, when someone forces 'you' to do something against your will do you generally just accept it and make the best out of it or do you rebel against it and fight the assimilation?

Posted by: fossten

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97silverlsc

Um...Phil...

Which Rangel do you agree with:

This one:

PRESS CONFERENCE: 2:00 P.M. TODAY
Room H-322

STATEMENT BY
HON. CHARLES RANGEL

THE VOTE ON THE BILL TO REINSTATE THE DRAFT IS A POLITICAL MANEUVER TO PROTECT THE PRESIDENT

WASHINGTON, October 5, 2004 -- The Republican leadership decision to place the draft legislation on the Suspension Calendar is a political maneuver to kill rumors of the President's intention to reinstate the draft after the November election.

I am voting no, because my bill deserves serious consideration. It should be subject to hearings and to expert testimony. The Administration should come and tell us about our manpower needs, about recruitment and retention, about the extent to which out troops are overextended. And they should give us their views about shared sacrifice. If they did all of those things in a serious way, they would have to admit that my bill is an option.

But what we are seeing now is election-year politics. They are using the Suspension Calendar, which is reserved for non-controversial items, to make a cynical political statement. The American people are deeply concerned about this issue deserve more than this. So do our troops, who after we leave here today, will still be on ground, and left with the message that we couldn't take the time to discuss their situation and what should be done to relieve them.

This is hypocrisy of the worst kind. I would not encourage any Democrat running for reelection to vote for this bill.
http://www.house.gov/list/press/ny15...r10052004.html

Or this one:

Asked on CBS’ “Face the Nation” if he was still serious about the proposal for a universal draft he raised a couple of years ago, he said, “You bet your life. Underscore serious.”

“If we’re going to challenge Iran and challenge North Korea and then, as some people have asked, to send more troops to Iraq, we can’t do that without a draft,” he said.

Rangel, who opposed the 2003 invasion of Iraq, also said he did not think the United States would have invaded Iraq if the children of members of Congress were sent to fight. He has said the U.S. fighting force is comprised disproportionately of people from low-income families and minorities.

“I don’t see how anyone can support the war and not support the draft. I think to do so is hypocritical,” he said.

Posted by: 97silverlsc

I think the draft should be reinstated. Period. Arguments that it's not as good as a volunteer army are moot, the military has lowered their standards to accept racists, skinheads and felons because they're not meeting their quotas now. Their are a lot of people who are quick to jump on the war wagon who might not jump so quickly if it were their ass or their kids ass on the line.

Posted by: pepperman

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97silverlsc

I think the draft should be reinstated. Period. Arguments that it's not as good as a volunteer army are moot, the military has lowered their standards to accept racists, skinheads and felons because they're not meeting their quotas now. Their are a lot of people who are quick to jump on the war wagon who might not jump so quickly if it were their ass or their kids ass on the line.

would you go into the Military if you got drafted?

Posted by: fossten

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97silverlsc

Anybody who falls for the myth that the military is composed only of the dregs of humanity is simply being suckered. The fact is that our military is composed of some of the finest minds and bravest souls in our country. Anyone who's been to Walter Reed has reported that these guys and gals are proud of their service and can't wait to get back to the battlefield. Not exactly forced servitude.

People like Chucky Rangel wish to drive a wedge into society by portraying the military as taking advantage of the less fortunate. This simply is not true. Let us not forget that many of our colleges such as Harvard and Yale are banning ROTC now, so it's unlikely that recruiters will be able to pull from there anymore anyway. Not sure I'd want those bluebloods in any event.

Furthermore, I'd like to see your evidence that racists, skinheads, and felons are being accepted into the military. I'd also like to see your evidence that the quotas are not being met. Finally, the only people who would object to their children volunteering to defend this country would probably be cowardly liberals anyway.

Posted by: JLewisinSyr

I do not want the draft, I am a democrat, so I guess your logic is flawed in your post title.

Glad you demonstrate what ignorance you have towards politics. Rangel wants the draft, not democrats as a whole.

In other words, correlation is not causation!!! Plain and simple!

Oh, and I didn't read the entire thread, nor do I plan to, it seems all you like to post is Republican spew.

Posted by: JohnnyBz00LS

Quote:

Originally Posted by 95DevilleNS

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepperman

would you go into the Military if you got drafted?

When I turned 18 I signed up for the selective service and was prepared to serve my country if called upon.

It all comes down to this question: Is GW BuSh and the GOP war-hawks REALLY SERIOUS about waging this global war on terror or NOT? If they are, they are going to need significantly more servicemen to do it.

Posted by: fossten

Quote:

Originally Posted by JLewisinSyr

I do not want the draft, I am a democrat, so I guess your logic is flawed in your post title.

Glad you demonstrate what ignorance you have towards politics. Rangel wants the draft, not democrats as a whole.

In other words, correlation is not causation!!! Plain and simple!

Oh, and I didn't read the entire thread, nor do I plan to, it seems all you like to post is Republican spew.

Charlie Rangel is a Democrat, and he's the one pushing this. I didn't say anything about you, nor do I know you. Obviously you aren't a House or Senate member so I could not possibly have been referring to you. I simply drew a distinction between Democrats and Republicans so you could see which party actually pushed for a draft, despite the accusations from the Democrats that Bush would be the one.

Your logic is flawed because you misunderstood the thread in general, which is supported by your admission that you didn't even read it. Your pejorative invective is misplaced. There isn't anything in that article that was written/spewed by a Republican. Therefore, your statements have no credibility.

Sounds like you are a barely conscious drive-by poster. So far you have contributed nothing. Keep it up.

Posted by: fossten

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyBz00LS

Generally speaking, I think for most, it depends on if its for a noble cause or not. I believe if you took 100 "slackers of society" and put them through basic training, 80 will become good soldiers and better people. Another 15 won't make it through boot-camp and get rejected or quit, and the other 5 will be put into positions where they can do no harm. You still end up w/ a good % of "good soldiers" on the battle field.

Even then, way less than half of those drafted will be societal slackers. Contrast that with the military's lowered standards we have now............???

When I turned 18 I signed up for the selective service and was prepared to serve my country if called upon.

It all comes down to this question: Is GW BuSh and the GOP war-hawks REALLY SERIOUS about waging this global war on terror or NOT? If they are, they are going to need significantly more servicemen to do it.

If anybody's serious about "waging this global war on terror," it isn't the libs in Congress. From the Al Qaeda Bill of Rights, to the attack on the terrorist surveillance program, to threatening to pull out of Iraq, these guys have proven that they can't be trusted to defend our country.

By the way, if you really want to learn the demographic data about the military, you can view it here:

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Nat...y/cda05-08.cfm

Posted by: mike maluchnik

How dare 97silverlsc say that our men in the service are degenerates !!! We have THE BEST trained and equiped army this earth has ever seen. These men are valiant and honorable. 97silverlsc dosen't have a clue. I wonder how our servicemen feel when a person like 97silverlsc provaricates about them. Everyone has the right to their opinions,pro-war or anti-war,that choice is what makes America the greatest country ever. That does not give the right to ANYONE to question the integrity of our armed services.

Posted by: evillally

Quote:

the military has lowered their standards to accept racists, skinheads and felons

Same thing with the New Jersey legislature.

Posted by: 97silverlsc

1 of many available with a minimum of searching:

Concern over US army recruitment
By Robert Hodierne
Presenter, BBC Radio 4's Crossing Continents
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programme...ts/5278654.stm
As the "war on terror" drags on, the US military is finding it difficult to fill its ranks and there are growing concerns some recruiters are breaking the rules.

SUS army recruiters have found it difficult to meet their targets
Nearly five years into the war, with conflicts in Afghanistan and Iraq, the death toll is approaching 3,000 servicemen and women.

The pressure to sign up new recruits against this background has challenged the US military.

The problem is especially acute for the army.

It had a goal of bringing in 80,000 new soldiers in the financial year that ended on 30 September 2005.

It finished that year with just 73,000 recruits.

This year the army appears to be on target to reach the 80,000 goal but to do so it has had to double the top enlistment bonuses for recruits from $20,000 to $40,000.

It has also had to loosen medical standards, forgive more minor criminal offences, raise the age limit for new recruits from 35 to 42 and accept more people who did not finish high school.

Casualty rates

The burden of finding and signing up new soldiers falls on 8,000 army recruiters scattered through nearly every town of any size in the US.

Kokomo, Indiana
Kokomo has lost a disproportionate number of men in the war
But the burden of fighting the war is not spread evenly among Americans.

Small towns suffer a disproportionate number of the casualties.

BBC Radio 4's Crossing Continents visited such a town - Kokomo, Indiana, which has a population of just 46,000.

Four young men from Kokomo have died in the war, the same number as from much larger towns - Boston, Atlanta, Washington.

The programme wanted to know if recruiters there are having a tougher time these days finding volunteers.

Sergeant 1st Class Gil Lang runs the six-man recruiting station in Kokomo.

He has no doubt about what is keeping people from signing up.

"The biggest thing is the war - it's the war," he said.

"People believe what they see on TV - they show the bad things and not the good things that are going on as well. And I believe a lot of families are just scared of that."

Cold calls

One of Sgt 1st Class Lang's best recruiters is Sergeant 1st Class Larry Arnold.

Sergeant Larry Arnold
Sgt 1st Class Larry Arnold cold calls students in his search for recruits
A career soldier with a charming line of fast-paced chatter, Sgt 1st Class Arnold circulates through town like a salesman.

He visits local high schools and colleges and drops by the government office where the unemployed come looking for jobs.

He stands in front of a busy convenience store handing out his business cards and eyes fellow customers as he eats lunch in a local cafe.

Sgt 1st Class Arnold also does something every day that is the subject of controversy in America - he makes cold calls to high school students trying to talk them into signing up.

He tells the students about the financial help the army can give them for their college education, the bonuses and how the training can help in their future careers.

He uses lists of students that federal law requires the schools to provide to military recruiters.

Pressure is always there. It's the army, it's your mission, and they drill that into you every day
The law - passed in 2001 before the 11 September attacks - grew out of the military's frustration that some public schools banned recruiters from visiting campus.

Others put severe restrictions on their access and many refused to provide phone lists.

Today, the schools have no choice and the summer before their final year of secondary education, it is not uncommon for students to get calls from every branch of the service.

The army recruiters in Kokomo will make 300 calls a day, Sgt 1st Class Lang told the programme.

"Pressure is always there. It's the army, it's your mission, and they drill that into you every day," he added.

Rule-breaking

The pressure to meet goals in an environment where potential recruits - and their parents - read daily about the mounting death toll has caused increasing numbers of recruiters to misbehave.

In order to meet their goals, recruiters have encouraged potential recruits to lie about medical conditions that would disqualify them, such as asthma or attention deficit disorder.

PROGRAMME INFORMATION
Radio 4's Crossing Continents was broadcast on Thursday, 24 August, at 1102 BST
Listen to the programme
Send us your comments
Some recruiters have shown young people how to cheat on the drug tests that are mandatory.

In the three years prior to the start of the war, the army says it caught an average of 93 recruiters a year in some sort of impropriety.

In the last three years that number jumped to an average of 126.

The same pattern repeats itself for the other services as well.

Days to go

It is easy to see how recruiters could be tempted.

Sgt Arnold
I was tempted, no doubt about it, running out of time
Sgt 1st Class Larry Arnold

With less than four days to go, Sgt 1st Class Arnold still needed one more recruit to meet his goal of signing up two new soldiers.

If he fails, he will have to attend a punitive counselling session in his own time on a Saturday.

If he fails often, it can hurt his chances for promotion.

Sgt 1st Class Arnold met 17-year-old Matthew, a quiet boy who may or may not be able to graduate from high school in the spring of 2007. He was not certain.

If that was not enough cause for concern, Matthew's mother also confided that her son was taking two medications a day for Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder (ADHD).

Despite that clearly disqualifying medical condition, Sgt 1st Class Arnold admitted he was tempted to sign him up anyway.

The army does not test for the presence of ADHD drugs so it is possible to conceal this condition.

Some recruiters have been caught encouraging people to do just that.

"I was tempted, no doubt about it, running out of time and I know when the deadline is. But we move on and we find the next one," Sgt 1st Class Arnold confessed to the programme.

The good news for Sgt 1st Class Arnold is that the day before his month-end deadline he found a second recruit.

Overall, the Kokomo station signed up nine new soldiers, one more than its goal.

In Kokomo, despite the unusually high casualty rate, there remains a large pool of young people attracted to the army for a combination of reasons, including both benefits and their sense of patriotism.

Posted by: 97silverlsc

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike maluchnik

How dare 97silverlsc say that our men in the service are degenerates !!! We have THE BEST trained and equiped army this earth has ever seen. These men are valiant and honorable. 97silverlsc dosen't have a clue. I wonder how our servicemen feel when a person like 97silverlsc provaricates about them. Everyone has the right to their opinions,pro-war or anti-war,that choice is what makes America the greatest country ever. That does not give the right to ANYONE to question the integrity of our armed services.

Blow it out your butt!!!!!!!!
Don't even try to use your righteous Repug indignation on me cause it falls on deaf ears. read the above article, do a search on the topic and read more articles, but don't get your skirt ruffled. If you want to get pissed save it for the idiot in chief that got us in the mess we're in now!!!

Posted by: 97silverlsc

Hate Groups Are Infiltrating the Military, Group Asserts
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/07/wa...ner=rssuserlan
Article Tools Sponsored By
By JOHN KIFNER
Published: July 7, 2006

A decade after the Pentagon declared a zero-tolerance policy for racist hate groups, recruiting shortfalls caused by the war in Iraq have allowed "large numbers of neo-Nazis and skinhead extremists" to infiltrate the military, according to a watchdog organization.

The Southern Poverty Law Center, which tracks racist and right-wing militia groups, estimated that the numbers could run into the thousands, citing interviews with Defense Department investigators and reports and postings on racist Web sites and magazines.

"We've got Aryan Nations graffiti in Baghdad," the group quoted a Defense Department investigator as saying in a report to be posted today on its Web site, www.splcenter.org. "That's a problem."

A Defense Department spokeswoman said officials there could not comment on the report because they had not yet seen it.

The center called on Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld to appoint a task force to study the problem, declare a new zero tolerance policy and strictly enforce it.

The report said that neo-Nazi groups like the National Alliance, whose founder, William Pierce, wrote "The Turner Diaries," the novel that was the inspiration and blueprint for Timothy J. McVeigh's bombing of the Oklahoma City federal building, sought to enroll followers in the Army to get training for a race war.

The groups are being abetted, the report said, by pressure on recruiters, particularly for the Army, to meet quotas that are more difficult to reach because of the growing unpopularity of the war in Iraq.

The report quotes Scott Barfield, a Defense Department investigator, saying, "Recruiters are knowingly allowing neo-Nazis and white supremacists to join the armed forces, and commanders don't remove them from the military even after we positively identify them as extremists or gang members."

Mr. Barfield said Army recruiters struggled last year to meet goals. "They don't want to make a big deal again about neo-Nazis in the military," he said, "because then parents who are already worried about their kids signing up and dying in Iraq are going to be even more reluctant about their kids enlisting if they feel they'll be exposed to gangs and white supremacists."

The 1996 crackdown on extremists came after revelations that Mr. McVeigh had espoused far-right ideas when he was in the Army and recruited two fellow soldiers to aid his bomb plot. Those revelations were followed by a furor that developed when three white paratroopers were convicted of the random slaying of a black couple in order to win tattoos and 19 others were discharged for participating in neo-Nazi activities.

The defense secretary at the time, William Perry, said the rules were meant to leave no room for racist and extremist activities within the military. But the report said Mr. Barfield, who is based at Fort Lewis, Wash., had said that he had provided evidence on 320 extremists there in the past year, but that only two had been discharged. He also said there was an online network of neo-Nazis.

"They're communicating with each other about weapons, about recruiting, about keeping their identities secret, about organizing within the military," he said. "Several of these individuals have since been deployed to combat missions in Iraq."

The report cited accounts by neo-Nazis of their infiltration of the military, including a discussion on the white supremacist Web site Stormfront. "There are others among you in the forces," one participant wrote. "You are never alone."

An article in the National Alliance magazine Resistance urged skinheads to join the Army and insist on being assigned to light infantry units.

The Southern Poverty Law Center identified the author as Steven Barry, who it said was a former Special Forces officer who was the alliance's "military unit coordinator."

"Light infantry is your branch of choice because the coming race war and the ethnic cleansing to follow will be very much an infantryman's war," he wrote. "It will be house-to-house, neighborhood-by-neighborhood until your town or city is cleared and the alien races are driven into the countryside where they can be hunted down and 'cleansed.' "

He concluded: "As a professional soldier, my goal is to fill the ranks of the United States Army with skinheads. As street brawlers, you will be useless in the coming race war. As trained infantrymen, you will join the ranks of the Aryan warrior brotherhood."

and:
U.S. is recruiting misfits for army
Felons, racists, gang members fill in the ranks
Nick Turse
Sunday, October 1, 2006
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...NG42LCIGK1.DTL
After falling short of its goals last year, military recruiting in 2006 has been marked by upbeat pronouncements from Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, claims of success by the White House, and a spate of recent press reports touting the military's achievement of its woman- and manpower goals.

But the armed forces have met with success only through a fundamental transformation, and not the transformation of the military -- that "co-evolution of concepts, processes, organizations and technology" that Rumsfeld is always talking about either.

While the secretary of defense's longstanding goal of transforming the planet's most powerful military into its highest-tech, most agile, most futuristic fighting force has, in the words of the Washington Post's David VonDrehle, "melted away," the very makeup of the armed forces has been mutating before our collective eyes under the pressure of the war in Iraq. This actual transformation has been reported, but only in scattered articles on the new recruitment landscape in America.

Last year, despite NASCAR, professional bull-riding and Arena Football sponsorships, popular video games that doubled as recruiting tools, TV commercials dripping with seductive scenes of military glory, a "joint marketing communications and market research and studies" program designed to attract, among others, dropouts and those with criminal records for military service, and at least $16,000 in promotional costs for each soldier it managed to sign up, the U.S. military failed to meet its recruiting goals.

This year, those methods have been pumped up and taken over the top in several critical areas that make the old Army ad tagline, "Be All You Can Be," into material for late-night TV punch lines of the future.

In 2004, the Pentagon published a "Moral Waiver Study," whose seemingly benign goal was "to better define relationships between pre-Service behaviors and subsequent Service success." That turned out to mean opening more recruitment doors to potential enlistees with criminal records.

In February, the Baltimore Sun wrote that there was "a significant increase in the number of recruits with what the Army terms 'serious criminal misconduct' in their background" -- a category that included "aggravated assault, robbery, vehicular manslaughter, receiving stolen property and making terrorist threats." From 2004 to 2005, the number of those recruits rose by more than 54 percent, while alcohol and illegal drug waivers, reversing a four-year decline, increased by more than 13 percent.

In June, the Chicago Sun-Times reported that, under pressure to fill the ranks, the Army had been allowing into its ranks increasing numbers of "recruits convicted of misdemeanor crimes, according to experts and military records." In fact, as the military's own data indicated, "the percentage of recruits entering the Army with waivers for misdemeanors and medical problems has more than doubled since 2001."

One beneficiary of the Army's new moral-waiver policies gained a certain prominence this summer. After Steven Green, who served in the 101st Airborne Division, was charged in a rape and quadruple murder in Mahmudiyah, Iraq, it was disclosed that he had been "a high-school dropout from a broken home who enlisted to get some direction in his life, yet was sent home early because of an anti-social personality disorder."

Recently, Eli Flyer, a former Pentagon senior military analyst and specialist on the relationship between military recruiting and military misconduct, told Harper's magazine that Green had "enlisted with a moral waiver for at least two drug- or alcohol-related offenses. He committed a third alcohol-related offense just before enlistment, which led to jail time, although this offense may not have been known to the Army when he enlisted."

With Green in jail awaiting trial, the Houston Chronicle reported in August that Army recruiters were trolling around the outskirts of a Dallas-area job fair for ex-convicts.

"We're looking for high school graduates with no more than one felony on their record," one recruiter said.

The Army has even looked behind prison bars for fill-in recruits -- in one reported case, they went to a "youth prison" in Ogden, Utah. Although Steven Price had asked to see a recruiter while still incarcerated, he was "barely 17 when he enlisted last January" and his divorced parents say "recruiters used false promises and forged documents to enlist him."

While confusion exists about whether the boy's mother actually signed a parental consent form allowing her son to enlist, his "father apparently wasn't even at the signing, but his name is on the form too."

Law enforcement officials report that the military is now "allowing more applicants with gang tattoos," the Chicago Sun-Times reports, "because they are under the gun to keep enlistment up." They also note that "gang activity maybe rising among soldiers." The paper was provided with "photos of military buildings and equipment in Iraq that were vandalized with graffiti of gangs based in Chicago, Los Angeles and other cities."

Last month, the Sun-Times reported that a gang member facing federal charges of murder and robbery enlisted in the Marine Corps "while he was free on bond -- and was preparing to ship out to boot camp when Marine officials recently discovered he was under indictment." While this recruit was eventually booted from the Corps, a Milwaukee police detective and Army veteran, who serves on the federal drug and gang task force that arrested the would-be Marine, noted that other "gang-bangers are going over to Iraq and sending weapons back ... gang members are getting access to military training and weapons."

Earlier this year, it was reported that an expected transfer of 10,000 to 20,000 troops to Fort Bliss, Texas, caused FBI and local law enforcement to fear a turf war between "members of the FolkNation gang ... (and) a criminal group that is already well-established in the area, Barrio Azteca." The New York Sun wrote that, according to one FBI agent, "FolkNation, which was founded in Chicago and includes several branches using the name Gangster Disciples, has gained a foothold in the Army."

Another type of gang member has also begun to proliferate within the military, evidently thanks to lowered recruitment standards and an increasing tendency of recruiters to look the other way. In July, a study by the Southern Poverty Law Center, which tracks racist and right-wing militia groups, found that because of pressing manpower concerns, "large numbers of neo-Nazis and skinhead extremists" are now serving in the military. "Recruiters are knowingly allowing neo-Nazis and white supremacists to join the armed forces, and commanders don't remove them from the military even after we positively identify them as extremists or gang members," said Scott Barfield, a Defense Department investigator quoted in the report.

The New York Times noted that the neo-Nazi magazine Resistance is actually recruiting for the U.S. military, urging "skinheads to join the Army and insist on being assigned to light infantry units." As the magazine explained, "The coming race war and the ethnic cleansing to follow will be very much an infantryman's war. ... It will be house-to-house ... until your town or city is cleared and the alien races are driven into the countryside where they can be hunted down and 'cleansed.' "

Apparently, the recruiting push has worked. Barfield reported that he and other investigators have identified a network of neo-Nazi active-duty Army and Marine personnel spread across five military installations in five states. "They're communicating with each other about weapons, about recruiting, about keeping their identities secret, about organizing within the military," he said.

Little wonder that Aryan Nation graffiti is now apparently competing for space with American inner-city gang graffiti in Iraq.

In the latter half of the Vietnam War, the U.S. military started to crumble from within and American troops began scrawling "UUUU" on their helmet liners -- an abbreviation that stood for "the unwilling, led by the unqualified, doing the unnecessary for the ungrateful."

With a growing majority of Americans opposed to the war in Iraq and even ardent hawks refusing to enlist in droves, new policies creating a lower-quality officer corps and the Pentagon pulling out ever more stops and sinking to new lows to recruit and train troops, a new all-volunteer generation of UUUU's may emerge -- the underachieving, unable, unexceptional, unintelligent, unsound, unhinged, unacceptable, unhealthy, undesirable, unloved and uncivil -- all led by the unqualified, doing the unnecessary for the ungrateful.

Current practices suggest this may well be the force of the future. It certainly isn't the new military Rumsfeld's been promising all these years, but there's no denying the depth of the transformation.

And:http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intel...le.jsp?aid=664

Posted by: Calabrio

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97silverlsc

If you want to get pissed save it for the idiot in chief that got us in the mess we're in now!!!

President Bush is Iranian?

Posted by: 97silverlsc

Quote:

Originally Posted by pepperman

would you go into the Military if you got drafted?

If they want my 48+ yr old ass, I might consider it. Have to be a different CIC though.

Posted by: FreeFaller

Hey Phil...I was almost tempted to lash out at you...almost. But then I realized that I would just perpetuate the point you're trying to make.

Now, you live in NJ right. Well, I'm going to give you a Private Message next time I go to McGuire AFB/Ft. Dix...should be sometime after Christmas. I will escort you throughout the base and personnaly invite you to meet some of these people you are so quick to disparage. You will have a chance to speak to USAF, USA, USMC and USCG personnel and learn what type of people they really are. I know because I serve beside them every day and have for the past decade. I know what kind of people enlist in the military. The opinions of you and your articles aren't worth the paper they are printed on.

Posted by: taylor414ce2003

Will they include women in the draft?

Posted by: fossten

Quote:

Originally Posted by FreeFaller

Hey Phil...I was almost tempted to lash out at you...almost. But then I realized that I would just perpetuate the point you're trying to make.

Now, you live in NJ right. Well, I'm going to give you a Private Message next time I go to McGuire AFB/Ft. Dix...should be sometime after Christmas. I will escort you throughout the base and personnaly invite you to meet some of these people you are so quick to disparage. You will have a chance to speak to USAF, USA, USMC and USCG personnel and learn what type of people they really are. I know because I serve beside them every day and have for the past decade. I know what kind of people enlist in the military. The opinions of you and your articles aren't worth the paper they are printed on.

Phil admits he's 48 years old. That would make him approx. a teenager during VietNam. Makes sense. A "deaf ears" America-hating war protester from the 60's/70's would just about fit the bill of an angry person like him. Don't take any of his frothing at the mouth seriously. He's a lost cause. Heck, he still thinks that Rove is about to be indicted.

Posted by: 97silverlsc

Quote:

Originally Posted by fossten

Fossie,
You can make like a hoover on my wingwang! Once again, you call for proof of a statement, articles backing the statement are posted and you respond by attacking the poster. My father and mother both served in WWII and I lost an uncle in WWII. I'm proud of their service. No, I didn't agree with Vietnam and I didn't then and don't agree now with us going into Iraq. And yes, I do love this country, but that doesn't mean I have to agree with everything it does.
Take your self righteous Reporklican high and mighty, I know everything you know nothing attitude and stick it up your A**! It's people like you, especially ones in offices of power, that are screwing this country up!

Posted by: fossten

Quote:

Originally Posted by 97silverlsc

LOL what an angry child you are. It really took you TEN WHOLE DAYS to think up that pathetic rant?

Posted by: Joeychgo

Lets not let this degrade into name calling - Silver, please - im trying to keep this forum a little civilized..